Fertitta shows renewed interest in bringing hockey to Houston (Bloomberg)

[KevFu]

But turning this back to Houston...

Don't the Wild own the "Houston Aeros" name? So if Houston got a team, they could relatively easily acquire that, like the Jets got their name back from the Coyotes; and how the Avs are totally willing to give (ahem, sell) QC the Nordiques name and brand back.

An NHL team in Houston would absolutely have a name that is tied to aerospace in some way, because Fertitta's Rockets are on the Space City RSN they co-own with the Astros.

 

[Yukon Joe]

But turning this back to Houston...

Don't the Wild own the "Houston Aeros" name? So if Houston got a team, they could relatively easily acquire that, like the Jets got their name back from the Coyotes; and how the Avs are totally willing to give (ahem, sell) QC the Nordiques name and brand back.

An NHL team in Houston would absolutely have a name that is tied to aerospace in some way, because Fertitta's Rockets are on the Space City RSN they co-own with the Astros.

So couple different thoughts:

-TNSE was perhaps more easily able to get the name "Jets" back because the Coyotes were owned by the NHL at the time.

-that being said, it's not like the Wil are doing anything with the name "Aeros" - and indeed that name means pretty much nothing outside of Houston itself. In particular if Houston is writing out a huge cheque for an expansion fee it's hard to imagine why the name "Aeros" wouldn't be included as part of the purchase price.

-I definitely hope they go with the name Aeros. When my own kids were being born, my father reminisced about the day I was born. He recalled that the Winnipeg Jets were playing the Houston Aeros that night, and he had been listening to the game (this was the 70s, and obviously in the WHA).

 

[KevFu]

Yeah, they could easily pick something else, but like... if they want to keep the Space City theme going -- and chances are they do -- then buying the IP from the Wild is the way to go.

Like, it was "easy" for the Jets to do it because the NHL owned it by owning the Coyotes.

But like you said, the Wild have no use for it. Holding on to it gets you nothing (And there's a time limit on it, right? Like I'm no trademark/copyright lawyer, but if you don't use it in X years...)

So why wouldn't you take cash for it. It's not like you're moving your AHL team to Houston when there's an NHL team there!

 

[Yukon Joe]

Yeah, they could easily pick something else, but like... if they want to keep the Space City theme going -- and chances are they do -- then buying the IP from the Wild is the way to go.

Like, it was "easy" for the Jets to do it because the NHL owned it by owning the Coyotes.

But like you said, the Wild have no use for it. Holding on to it gets you nothing (And there's a time limit on it, right? Like I'm no trademark/copyright lawyer, but if you don't use it in X years...)

So why wouldn't you take cash for it. It's not like you're moving your AHL team to Houston when there's an NHL team there!

I think my point was that if Houston is an expansion franchise the Wild are already getting $30+ million in expansion fees - would they really try and hold out for a little bit more?

Oh by the way - a USPTO search does reveal that the term Houston Aeros is an active trademark held by "Aeros Hockey Club, LLC" and registered out of - St. Paul, Minnesota, at an address right next to the Xcel Energy Centre. So yeah - the Wild still own it.

I don't think a trademark (unlike copyright) can ever expire. All you have to do is sell a very tiny amount of merchandise once in a while to keep it valid. So it wouldn't shock me that if you went to say the Minnesota Wild official team store you can find a Houston Aeros, I dunno, key chain for sale - thus they're still using the trademark.

 

[KevFu]

I think my point was that if Houston is an expansion franchise the Wild are already getting $30+ million in expansion fees - would they really try and hold out for a little bit more?

Oh by the way - a USPTO search does reveal that the term Houston Aeros is an active trademark held by "Aeros Hockey Club, LLC" and registered out of - St. Paul, Minnesota, at an address right next to the Xcel Energy Centre. So yeah - the Wild still own it.

I don't think a trademark (unlike copyright) can ever expire. All you have to do is sell a very tiny amount of merchandise once in a while to keep it valid. So it wouldn't shock me that if you went to say the Minnesota Wild official team store you can find a Houston Aeros, I dunno, key chain for sale - thus they're still using the trademark.

Yeah, and the amount of money you'd get from Houston to buy the name is way more than what you'd sell in Houston Aeros merch out of Minnesota. It doesn't make sense for Minnesota to operate a brick and mortar shop, or cut a deal for like the Houston airport like the Whalers did.

Honestly, if Houston is serious about an NHL team: cut a deal with the Minnesota Wild to sell Houston Aeros merch in the Rockets team shop at the Toyota Center starting now. The revenue is shared heavily toward the Wild until the announcement that Houston is getting their own NHL team. Then it goes heavily the other way toward Houston until Houston announces their name and branding and merch; at which point the trademark is transferred to Houston.

 

[No Fun Shogun]

I somehow doubt that the Wild are so overly attached to the Aeros moniker that they'd want a bad PR hit to block a hypothetical Houston-based team to use the name.

Moreso though, it's been close to a decade since the Aeros were moved out. And while I fully recognize that the name has significant cache among area hockey fans, I don't think a dormant minor league name is really something that has the hugely immediate mainstream draw as exists/existedfor the Jets in Winnipeg, the Whalers in Hartford, or the Nordiques in Quebec that'd make teams returning utterly foolhardy to choose a different name.

My hunch is that if Houston gets a team, a) Minnesota wouldn't block the name and b) if Houston chose a different name it'd be more due to them not being overly attached to it.

 

[Yukon Joe]

Yeah, and the amount of money you'd get from Houston to buy the name is way more than what you'd sell in Houston Aeros merch out of Minnesota. It doesn't make sense for Minnesota to operate a brick and mortar shop, or cut a deal for like the Houston airport like the Whalers did.

Honestly, if Houston is serious about an NHL team: cut a deal with the Minnesota Wild to sell Houston Aeros merch in the Rockets team shop at the Toyota Center starting now. The revenue is shared heavily toward the Wild until the announcement that Houston is getting their own NHL team. Then it goes heavily the other way toward Houston until Houston announces their name and branding and merch; at which point the trademark is transferred to Houston.

So my point about selling a Houston Aeros keychain at the official Minnesota Wild store - it isn't because they're going to sell anything. It's the sheer fact that they're selling it - thereby they're using the trademark, thereby it never expires. Hell - I don't think they'd even need to actually sell any of my hypothetical keychains - just the fact it is on the market is enough.

 

[tornadowarning33]

So my point about selling a Houston Aeros keychain at the official Minnesota Wild store - it isn't because they're going to sell anything. It's the sheer fact that they're selling it - thereby they're using the trademark, thereby it never expires. Hell - I don't think they'd even need to actually sell any of my hypothetical keychains - just the fact it is on the market is enough.

Is that similar to what the University of North Dakota has to do with the Fighting Sioux logo? They were (not sure if they still are) making a limited run of small items with the logo on them to maintain the trademark so that third parties couldn't manufacture and sell legitimate replica jerseys and other apparel.

 

[Yukon Joe]

Is that similar to what the University of North Dakota has to do with the Fighting Sioux logo? They were (not sure if they still are) making a limited run of small items with the logo on them to maintain the trademark so that third parties couldn't manufacture and sell legitimate replica jerseys and other apparel.

Yes, I believe that's exactly the idea.

 

[KevFu]

So my point about selling a Houston Aeros keychain at the official Minnesota Wild store - it isn't because they're going to sell anything. It's the sheer fact that they're selling it - thereby they're using the trademark, thereby it never expires. Hell - I don't think they'd even need to actually sell any of my hypothetical keychains - just the fact it is on the market is enough.

Yeah, I was following you. I was thinking like "You know, instead of waiting and negotiating a dollar amount to own the trademark, be proactive and go for the win-win."

That's just always how I think. A lump-sum transaction when Houston gets a team and wants the name is going to be like, a million dollar donation to the Wild's charitable foundation or something, right?

But Minnesota licensing that trademark to the Rockets owner, selling the merch to the people of Houston who could wear it to show they WANT an NHL team, and then handing it over at the end helps everyone more.

 

[aqib]

Yeah, I was following you. I was thinking like "You know, instead of waiting and negotiating a dollar amount to own the trademark, be proactive and go for the win-win."

That's just always how I think. A lump-sum transaction when Houston gets a team and wants the name is going to be like, a million dollar donation to the Wild's charitable foundation or something, right?

But Minnesota licensing that trademark to the Rockets owner, selling the merch to the people of Houston who could wear it to show they WANT an NHL team, and then handing it over at the end helps everyone more.

I think the NHL wants to be in Houston badly enough that they will facilitate the transfer of the Houston Aeros name if Fertita wants it.

 

[Yukon Joe]

Is there anyone from Houton that can speak to how much (if at all) the Houston Aeros name still resonates?

They were one of the most successful WHA franchises, winning 2 AVCO Cups, but that was 50 years ago. The name was brought back for an IHL/AHL franchise, and were reasonable successful, but still they left town in 2013 which is a while ago.

It's a pretty cool logo, and yes it does fit in with the whole space/aeronautic theme the organization seems to be going for, but you can always imagine that a new owner wants to put their own stamp on a new team.

 

[StreetHawk]

Is there anyone from Houton that can speak to how much (if at all) the Houston Aeros name still resonates?

They were one of the most successful WHA franchises, winning 2 AVCO Cups, but that was 50 years ago. The name was brought back for an IHL/AHL franchise, and were reasonable successful, but still they left town in 2013 which is a while ago.

It's a pretty cool logo, and yes it does fit in with the whole space/aeronautic theme the organization seems to be going for, but you can always imagine that a new owner wants to put their own stamp on a new team.

They've had like 3 logos that I can recall. Original WHA logo with the light blue color scheme. Had a dark blue and green scheme with an old school plane with a propellor at the front while with the IHL. Then the Wild got them and went with like a F-18 fighter jet logo.

End of the day, comes down to the price that TF is willing to pay for the team vs the ask from the NHL. Houston is a big market, so whatever the NHL deems the market value of what Dallas would sell for is roughly what they would expect to receive for a team in Houston.

I do wonder how much TF really wants an NHL team because he's a fan of the sport vs just adding to his portfolio?

 

[Yukon Joe]

They've had like 3 logos that I can recall. Original WHA logo with the light blue color scheme. Had a dark blue and green scheme with an old school plane with a propellor at the front while with the IHL. Then the Wild got them and went with like a F-18 fighter jet logo.

End of the day, comes down to the price that TF is willing to pay for the team vs the ask from the NHL. Houston is a big market, so whatever the NHL deems the market value of what Dallas would sell for is roughly what they would expect to receive for a team in Houston.

I do wonder how much TF really wants an NHL team because he's a fan of the sport vs just adding to his portfolio?

Who knows? Sports team purchases are always at least in part an ago purchase, but how much is ego versus a sound business decision is impossible to say.

Your history of the logos did cause me to wonder - any chance the Winnipeg Jets would object to the name of the "Aeros", just on the basis that it interferes with their jet-themed name and logo? There were some rumblings that on relocation the Jets were considering going with something like "Polar Bears" as the name but that the Bruins might have objected. But I feel like Mark Chipman is enough of a hockey historian he'd be fine with the "Aeros" - but that's all total speculation.

 

[HisIceness]

Houston Apollos

 

[Headshot77]

They've had like 3 logos that I can recall. Original WHA logo with the light blue color scheme. Had a dark blue and green scheme with an old school plane with a propellor at the front while with the IHL. Then the Wild got them and went with like a F-18 fighter jet logo.

End of the day, comes down to the price that TF is willing to pay for the team vs the ask from the NHL. Houston is a big market, so whatever the NHL deems the market value of what Dallas would sell for is roughly what they would expect to receive for a team in Houston.

I do wonder how much TF really wants an NHL team because he's a fan of the sport vs just adding to his portfolio?

You don't need to wonder. He doesn't really care about the NHL at all. We know this.

 

[Tawnos]

You don't need to wonder. He doesn't really care about the NHL at all. We know this.

Which doesn't really distinguish him from most owners.

 

[GindyDraws]

You don't need to wonder. He doesn't really care about the NHL at all. We know this.

But aren't most sports owners like that?

 

[aqib]

But aren't most sports owners like that?

It really depends. There is a lot of negatives that go with owning a sports team. There are people who say the one thing better than being rich and famous is just being rich. Its why the Snyder kids pushed Dan Snyder to sell the Washington Commanders. Art Modell moved the Browns to Baltimore in 1996 and had someone pee on his grave in 2012. So he can't even get peace when he's dead.

Once you are in the category of people who can afford to buy a sports team there are many ways for you to make money that have less stress and hassle.

 

[No Fun Shogun]

Most owners buy teams for the social clout that teams afford them. Every market has a load of rich people, but only a few owners. If you're the proud owner a major league sports franchise, you're in an echelon of public attention and access that wealth alone doesn't buy you.

 

[GindyDraws]

Houston Apollos

Yeah, I'm sure they can go dumpster diving for an IP currently owned by the Pecos League for the worst of the worst as far as their prospects.

 

[LT]

Is there anyone from Houton that can speak to how much (if at all) the Houston Aeros name still resonates?

They were one of the most successful WHA franchises, winning 2 AVCO Cups, but that was 50 years ago. The name was brought back for an IHL/AHL franchise, and were reasonable successful, but still they left town in 2013 which is a while ago.

It's a pretty cool logo, and yes it does fit in with the whole space/aeronautic theme the organization seems to be going for, but you can always imagine that a new owner wants to put their own stamp on a new team.

A lot. The junior hockey teams here still use the old Aeros logo and are known as the junior Aeros. Fans from multiple generations know the name. It's difficult to see an NHL team in Houston with a name other than the Aeros.

The only other viable name is the Apollos, a former CHL team. But I'd be surprised to see that name ever used again, it just wasn't very popular or notable.

 

[LT]

They've had like 3 logos that I can recall. Original WHA logo with the light blue color scheme. Had a dark blue and green scheme with an old school plane with a propellor at the front while with the IHL. Then the Wild got them and went with like a F-18 fighter jet logo.

End of the day, comes down to the price that TF is willing to pay for the team vs the ask from the NHL. Houston is a big market, so whatever the NHL deems the market value of what Dallas would sell for is roughly what they would expect to receive for a team in Houston.

I do wonder how much TF really wants an NHL team because he's a fan of the sport vs just adding to his portfolio?

I don't think Fertitta gives two shits about the sport. This would strictly be a business decision and for him to further develop a hold on the entertainment business in downtown Houston. His primary business is restaurants and casinos (which are still illegal in Texas), and so in his mind something like a hockey team would likely just be used as a draw for those other parts of his portfolio.

 

[MMC]

 

[LT]

Would be nice if there were a bit more detail there, but I'm sure it will come out soon...