Failing for Dahlin / The Official Tank Thread

[ottawa]

Forgive me for being pessimistic here, but to me it doesn't matter where Montreal finishes...even if we get the 1 overall pick. They will screw him up ....

Secondly ,we always really SUCK IN YEARS where there is no Crosby McDavid Matthews etc!!!!

Gally27 never changed our fortunes at 3rd overall...

The first overall pick this year is a D man ....

We need a 85-100 point forward franchise player

So even if we get 1st overall this year , it sucks

We need defense too for a team that's so heavily focused on building around price (dumb Bergevin). Having an elite defenseman will help tons.

 

[Adam Michaels]

Forgive me for being pessimistic here, but to me it doesn't matter where Montreal finishes...even if we get the 1 overall pick. They will screw him up ....

Secondly ,we always really SUCK IN YEARS where there is no Crosby McDavid Matthews etc!!!!

Gally27 never changed our fortunes at 3rd overall...

The first overall pick this year is a D man ....

We need a 85-100 point forward franchise player

So even if we get 1st overall this year , it sucks

I forgive you.

 

[Habs Icing]

Should the habs make a run for the playoffs or tank?

Do we have a choice. The team is going in one direction.

 

[Lshap]

No, when Gainey showed up we was a disaster...so it couldn't get any worse....Yes he did bring back some respectability for a few years BUT when he blew the team up and went for the second rebuild?? It was a utter failure big time..

I guess me sitting here with Bergevin 6 years in and seeing the team sitting back in the bottom of the NHL they same way it was when he took over, and no real contender was ever built here over last 6 years....I can't see a second rebuild under Bergevin working any better than Bob Gainey's second try...

I can't see any way Bergevin would ever undo what he did. It'll be the next GM who sets the course and does the work.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Because a tank thread 10 games into a season is ridiculous.

I disagree. It was absolutely obvious the team was garbage. And there should be no censorship on the forums for a group of people who want to monitor a tank year for their team if that's what they think will make the team better.

Call it what it was, an attempt to diffuse tensions between two groups of the fambase at the time.

The Leafs were allowed a tank thread every year under the new management until they made the playoffs. Don't see why there's a double standard.

 

[Lshap]

I disagree. It was absolutely obvious the team was garbage. And there should be no censorship on the forums for a group of people who want to monitor a tank year for their team if that's what they think will make the team better.

Call it what it was, an attempt to diffuse tensions between two groups of the fambase at the time.

The Leafs were allowed a tank thread every year under the new management until they made the playoffs. Don't see why there's a double standard.

Despite the dumb playoffs, Montreal charged into the playoffs with a 16-6-1 finish and 103 points. You can believe whatever you want, but there's no legitimate case that all previous success disintegrates and the entire season is doomed after 8 games.

Leafs fans talked tanking after a decade of failure and after the tank actually happened. Not after 8 games.

 

[le_sean]

Still think the team deserves a Dahlin type. Sucked for 25 years but never tried to suck. Selling out games, providing the chance to poor franchises to survive with revenue sharing. Haven’t had a 1st pick since Wickenheiser. Plus Dahlin vs. Matthews would be a duel that the NHL will eat up for years. The Habs need some luck finally.

 

[Habaneros]

Also, how about we try hiring a GM how wasn't a defense man...lol I mean Gainey gave us Jacques Martin D that couldn't score more than 2 a night

Bergy gave us MT who's team also struggled to score(grinders)
Now Claude J , his team can't score...more the same
The team we got on the ice is a mirror image of Marc Bergevin's NHL career....A bunch of 4 liners and plumbers.


Take a look in Tamapa who has a GM Stevie Y who was a forward
and in 1514 NHL games scored 1755 pts. Look at how Tamapa Bay is playing

Can we hire a GM who BELIEVES IN OFFENSE???

 

[OldCraig71]

A lot of fans could tell this team would suck after an atrocious off season and a poor start.

The most knowledgeable posters here predicted it when we didn't bring back Markov and Radulov and held on to 9 million in cap space. All you really had to do was look at the roster, we struggled to score last year and we lost two of our better offensive catalysts from 2016-17, it's not rocket science. Add that to the fact that Tampa fans told us about Drouins 5 on5 play and a la peanut butter sandwiches, we suck.

 

[SquiddFX]

We are tanking already without actually tanking

 

[Price is Wright]

Still think the team deserves a Dahlin type. Sucked for 25 years but never tried to suck. Selling out games, providing the chance to poor franchises to survive with revenue sharing. Haven’t had a 1st pick since Wickenheiser. Plus Dahlin vs. Matthews would be a duel that the NHL will eat up for years. The Habs need some luck finally.

Deserve? There's nothing deserved. This isn't pro wrestling where a guy works hard so they book him to be champion. There's nothing deserved in pro sports.

 

[Habaneros]

Still think the team deserves a Dahlin type. Sucked for 25 years but never tried to suck. Selling out games, providing the chance to poor franchises to survive with revenue sharing. Haven’t had a 1st pick since Wickenheiser. Plus Dahlin vs. Matthews would be a duel that the NHL will eat up for years. The Habs need some luck finally.

You don't think the Habs will take Dahlin and turn him into a boring Dman ,just like they tried to do with Subban ? Everyone see the high flying Mete for Team Canada??? Not in Montreal...da system..lol

Seriously...We need a GM and coach who believes offense and creativity is a good thing

 

[McGuires Corndog]

Forgive me for being pessimistic here, but to me it doesn't matter where Montreal finishes...even if we get the 1 overall pick. They will screw him up ....

Secondly ,we always really SUCK IN YEARS where there is no Crosby McDavid Matthews etc!!!!

Gally27 never changed our fortunes at 3rd overall...

The first overall pick this year is a D man ....

We need a 85-100 point forward franchise player

So even if we get 1st overall this year , it sucks

I get what you’re saying, we do need that franchise forward.. But Dahlin is incredible, this guy projects to be the next Erik Karlsson. That’s a pretty sweet consolation price for losing Subban..

 

[le_sean]

Deserve? There's nothing deserved. This isn't pro wrestling where a guy works hard so they book him to be champion. There's nothing deserved in pro sports.

I don’t buy that. Habs give some of the most amount to revenue sharing. Pittsburgh was about to fold and survived because of that. They got a handful of 1st overalls and now have a new arena. Habs helped keep them afloat.

Plus the added difficulty of being in a cap world and having the tax issue. It’s more difficult for this franchise to sign players. I think the Habs need to be thrown a bone.

 

[Habaneros]

I get what you’re saying, we do need that franchise forward.. But Dahlin is incredible, this guy projects to be the next Erik Karlsson. That’s a pretty sweet consolation price for losing Subban..

They same way they tried to change Subban's game, they will do it with Dahlin also.....
UNLESS there is a total new management team ,who actually believes offense is a good thing

See the Drouin highlight reel goals in Tamapa Bay??
You don't see that in Montreal why? Because they found a way to screw that up....

Same will happen to Dahlin if Habs get him....

 

[Adam Michaels]

We are tanking already without actually tanking

Which may be encouraging because once they officially decide to be sellers and get rid of some assets (vets and expiring contracts), the tank could go even better.

 

[Price is Wright]

I don’t buy that. Habs give some of the most amount to revenue sharing. Pittsburgh was about to fold and survived because of that. They got a handful of 1st overalls and now have a new arena. Habs helped keep them afloat.

Plus the added difficulty of being in a cap world and having the tax issue. It’s more difficult for this franchise to sign players. I think the Habs need to be thrown a bone.

You want a hand full of firsts? Play Rico Fata on your first line. Pittsburgh was gifted nothing. They sucked hard for those picks. Montreal wants some first overall picks? Suck hard.

 

[SquiddFX]

Which may be encouraging because once they officially decide to be sellers and get rid of some assets (vets and expiring contracts), the tank could go even better.

Who knows. With our luck it might have the opposite effect and improve the team to finish just outside of a playoff spot.

 

[Adam Michaels]

Who knows. With our luck it might have the opposite effect and improve the team to finish just outside of a playoff spot.

The unpredictability is disconserting.

 

[Habaneros]

Who knows. With our luck it might have the opposite effect and improve the team to finish just outside of a playoff spot.

The good thing for the tank crowd , is Montreal's roster is already the Laval Rocket.....So any call ups wont help in the win dept..lol

I said this a while ago, Bergevin built 2 AHL TEAMS IN 2017..
He got 1 AHL team playing in the NHL ,and the other one plays in the AHL...

AND THEY BOTH STINK.

 

[NotProkofievian]

Not sure what you're asking (or cleverly implying), but there's a difference between venting your emotions after 8 games -- the 1-6-1 start -- and accepting hard evidence after almost half the season. I thought we'd make the playoffs despite the downgrades, but I'm not going to keep yelling at the mountain of facts that says otherwise. 38 games carries weight. 8 games does not.

Well, the [current number of games] argument had a way of expanding, until the people who made it disappeared. To address your point about the number of games: you can make some predictions based on a limited number of samples. Those predictions are less meaningful, but they're not worthless either. You could say a lot about what our team was doing after, say 15 games. We had a pretty good idea that our team was crap. Now it's all but incontrovertible. But there is no game before which it's too early to say anything, and after which things are set in stone.

 

[Halakitlikethat]

Not a tank but a retool is in order, needs to start with management first hopefully.

Best case scenario we get a top 5 pick, and trade patch for another young prospect and a late first, sell off Shaw and plek for whatever picks we can get for them .

 

[The Great Weal]

Byron would probably be the best asset to move. A contending team would love his PK ability, his speed and his ability to play up and down the line-up.
Plekanec is another asset to move at the deadline, like you said, retain some salary and he's your 3rd line C to do some heavy lifting.

Shawful is immovable at the deadline, imo.

Pacioretty could go and for a high premium, his salary makes it easy to do so.

You could probably dupe a team on Jordie Benn, but the return would be average.

Shaw is definitely movable, there will always be an idiot and desperate gm. Probably not Alzner though.
Also, with Kreider out long term, rangers might want Pacioretty. I don't think it's totally unreasonable to think we can return Chytil+1st.

 

[NotProkofievian]

Shaw is definitely movable, there will always be an idiot and desperate gm. Probably not Alzner though.
Also, with Kreider out long term, rangers might want Pacioretty. I don't think it's totally unreasonable to think we can return Chytil+1st.

 

[Cole Caulifield]

Tank but it could also be a rebuild on the fly (see below in bold).

Here's the list of moves that need to happen in order :

-Molson hires a Boivin type to manage commercial/marketing aspect of the team, and a Bobby Smith type to manage hockey operations with the latter being way more important although the former is important as well. Molson can remain president but only to sit on the board of governors to look princely. Actual real decision making and leadership needs to come from someone else.
-New president should fire Bergevin immediately, hire Julien Brisebois. Let Brisebois decide if he keeps Julien and his assistants. The new coach, if there's one, or even if it's still Julien gets to pick his own assistants.
-Kick Niemi to the curb. Call up Lindgren, start Lindgren in half the games. Rest Price a lot, no point in him playing, plenty to gain by giving experience to Lindgren.
-Trade Plekanec for whatever you can get, eat cap if it helps.
-Trade Wax Statueretty for prospects/picks, I'd be ecstatic with a Samuel Girard + 1st type return but I doubt it.
-If the new GM can manage to rid us of Alzner that would be great but I doubt it
-Trade/waive immediately guys like Schlemko, Morrow, Froese, Benn.
-Give lots of ice time to guys like Scherbak, De La Rose, Mete, Juulsen, Scherbak, Jerabek.
-Hopefully get lucky at the draft lottery (Dahlin - the dream), and you could possibly do a quick rebuild on the fly with a good free agent signing or two (Tavares), a good trade or two (Schenn type trade). But be adaptable and if the big moves don't/can't/won't happen, we need to look at a more in depth rebuild. Trade Price, Weber, Petry, etc. Accept to retain salary, accept cap dumps for picks/prospects, etc.