Confirmed with Link: Ethan Bear traded to Carolina for Warren Foegele

[CornKicker]

the blues and bruins are 2 of the best teams in the league and we won both those game. take away the breakaways vs buffalo and the slow start vs detroit and this team is 13-1.

that being said i dont like the goals koskinen does let in. thank god that one was offside because that was a save all goalies should make from NHL to Novice 8 year olds

 

[McTonyBrar]

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We are also worse in shots against and goals against compared to last season.

I still feel that having Kassian and Shore out has brought our 5v5 play down more.

 

[Oilslick941611]

Interesting claim. Do you have some sort of data to back this up? D looks pretty chaotic most nights to me.

The record speaks for itself.

 

[Czechboy]

I still feel that having Kassian and Shore out has brought our 5v5 play down more.

I've never thought of either as that great defensively to be honest.

I think our D is just not as strong defensively. Having said that. we have 5 guys that can move the puck very well and it has been a long time since we had 5 good puck movers. Keith, Ceci, Nurse, Bouch and Barrie can all pass and get it going the other way. Maybe firewagon hockey is where it is at for us? Maybe guys like Connor and Drai love playing with Barrie while guys like me point out how bad he is defensively?

A very quick look shows me that we have only won 2 games all season where we don't score at least 5 goals (the 2 Nucks wins).

Having said that... I'll move on since I"m part of the threadjack problem.

Happy to see Foegele get an assist.. I think it was accidental but he was driving the puck the right way and was a huge part of a very important goal! His last 2 playoff series were very poor for points so hopefully that is cured by April.

I can't wait to play the Canes and hope Bear is healthy and in the lineup... that'll be a hillarious GDT by then. December 11th! Could be for first in the league. Mods will be busy that night.lol

 

[K1984]

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We are also worse in shots against and goals against compared to last season.

All because of Ethan Bear.

 

[nabob]

It is so frustrating. Hope they can fix that. Last post, because this has nothing to do with the trade.

Using last year standings is a lot better way. Of course then you need to gauge off-season transactions etc. Basic opinions differ a lot and people are prone to weigth recent results/too small sample sizes too much. 18-19 season horrible Sabres team won 10 games in a row and lead the league in November. Ended up with 76 points, they weren't a great team in November. Of course that is extreme example.

I have said in multiple threads that Oilers are finally good enough to be contenders. Playoffs were basically lock before the season started, barring injury troubles. No need to downplay, just trying to be realistic. When I make evaluations(estimations/projections what ever is the correctt word in english) I can't hate Calgary and give too much credit for Oilers because that is the team a cheer for.

14 games (13 opponenst) and Oilers have faced three teams that made playoffs last year (VGK, BOS and STL). And Vegas had injury troubles (Stone, Pacioretty, Tuch and Martinez were out), their second line against Oilers was Roy-Stephepson-Krebs. Seattle didn't exist.

That isn't downplaying, that is a fact. 28th (could be different date for you in NA) onwards Oilers will play 8 game stretch were they play against Vegas (probably a tad healhtier version, Stone is back at least), Pittsburgh, Seattle, Los Angeles, Minnesota, Boston, Carolina and Toronto. 6/8 made playoffs last year, that is massively harder stretch. I am eagerly waiting how the team looks against better competition. Not even interested about results that much, I would like to see the team dominate 5on5 play. First two lines can keep sustained pressure, but bottom6 isn't able to continue that cycle and the games end more or less 50-50 back and forth battle. Luckily the top6 is so stacked that they will win majority of the close games.

So you expect the top 6 to totally dominate and have the bottom six continue that? Most teams win games because of their best players (top 6 forwards / top 4 D) that’s just how sports works or anything that is competitive…you’re best beat their best and the others just need to go 50-50. In a salary cap world (unless you’re Tampa and play by your own rules) that’s how it works. The Oilers have now played 11/14 games against teams that aren’t the three that were cherry picked to try to say we’ve had an easy schedule. Hell you just made this post after we just beat one of the best teams in the league.

 

[voxel]

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We are also worse in shots against and goals against compared to last season.

Matches the eye test too. I was pro Keith before and just after the trade... but he's not been good enough. We have too many low-end 2nd pair or bottom-pair D types. Larsson is missed.

 

[nabob]

Matches the eye test too. I was pro Keith before and just after the trade... but he's not been good enough. We have too many low-end 2nd pair or bottom-pair D types. Larsson is missed.

Honestly I think Larsson 90% of the time is the same type of Dman that we have too many of.

Carolina’s D is able to be really strong because they have a stud RHD in Peche on one pairing, and a stud LHD in Slavin on another pairing. Then they have Skjei who is a solid #3. If we had a RH version of Nurse who could anchor the second pair we’d be in a lot better spot. I had hoped that Bear could become that guy but he’s just a 18 minute a night guy who needs a partner like Slavin/Nurse to cover for him to look good in the top 4.

 

[McCombo]

So you expect the top 6 to totally dominate and have the bottom six continue that? Most teams win games because of their best players (top 6 forwards / top 4 D) that’s just how sports works or anything that is competitive…you’re best beat their best and the others just need to go 50-50. In a salary cap world (unless you’re Tampa and play by your own rules) that’s how it works. The Oilers have now played 11/14 games against teams that aren’t the three that were cherry picked to try to say we’ve had an easy schedule. Hell you just made this post after we just beat one of the best teams in the league.

Yes your 3rd and 4th lines are allowed to play well too. If you look elite teams in the past (full season sample sizes) you will find that more often their bottom6 are on positive side too. You just have to have better bottom6 than most of the teams. In the Oilers case most of the cap goes to stars it is harder to accomplish for sure. But even being close to 50-50 would be massive improvement to what we are getting currently.

Yes the schedule has been soft. That isn't even debatable imo. Like comparing winger and defensemen is. A one game a doesn't really change anything, win or lose. Remember anything about small sample sizes? What makes you think that St. Louis is one the best teams in the league?

 

[Trafalgar Sadge Law]

I still feel that having Kassian and Shore out has brought our 5v5 play down more.

Shore has been a dumpster fire at even strength for most of his career. That's most certainly NOT related to our even strength defensive issues.

 

[nabob]

Yes your 3rd and 4th lines are allowed to play well too. If you look elite teams in the past (full season sample sizes) you will find that more often their bottom6 are on positive side too. You just have to have better bottom6 than most of the teams. In the Oilers case most of the cap goes to stars it is harder to accomplish for sure. But even being close to 50-50 would be massive improvement to what we are getting currently.

Yes the schedule has been soft. That isn't even debatable imo. Like comparing winger and defensemen is. A one game a doesn't really change anything, win or lose. Remember anything about small sample sizes? What makes you think that St. Louis is one the best teams in the league?

If you’re going to try to deny that the Blues are one of the best teams in the league then cleary you either don’t watch much hockey or you’re trolling. Doesn’t seem to matter what the sample size is or what the topic is you’ll find somewhere to move the goalposts so that you can think that you’re right. We did debate the schedule, not sure why, but you somehow felt it meant that we shouldn’t have traded Bear lol. The only point that you can make as to why our schedule was soft so far is that we’ve played 3/14 games against bad teams. Haven’t seen you make a post in this entire thread that’s actually worth responding to, I was hoping you might, be clearly it’s not happening.

 

[cyberpunk]

Oilers fold less chairs this year. The D is moving the puck, the 3rd line was producing. It is about being balanced. Running an effective 3rd line is as important as Bear to the canes. This was definitely a hockey trade.. Would goals against be lower if Smith was back possibly. Foegle, Ryan and Kassian are forechecking and cashing in on opportunities . Now the trick is it sustainable or just start of season. Playing top teams in other divisions or deep teams will tell if the Oilers are for real or not. Jets is a good test, so was blues and B's.

 

[McCombo]

If you’re going to try to deny that the Blues are one of the best teams in the league then cleary you either don’t watch much hockey or you’re trolling. Doesn’t seem to matter what the sample size is or what the topic is you’ll find somewhere to move the goalposts so that you can think that you’re right. We did debate the schedule, not sure why, but you somehow felt it meant that we shouldn’t have traded Bear lol. The only point that you can make as to why our schedule was soft so far is that we’ve played 3/14 games against bad teams. Haven’t seen you make a post in this entire thread that’s actually worth responding to, I was hoping you might, be clearly it’s not happening.

They really aren't one of the best. Unless "one of the" is about 10 teams. 63 points in 56 games last year. 15th league wide. Got swept 4-0 in the first round. Lost Schwartz, Hoffman and Sanford, acquired Buchnevich, Saad, (healthy Tarasenko). Sure that is improvement, but that doesn't push them from slightly above average to top5. Close to top10 is more realistic.

They were without Schenn and Krug on top of that. They have nice forward depth so they can do okay without Schenn. They lack game breaking talent. D is bad. Scandella-Parayko, Rosen-Faulk, Walman-Bortuzzo is that good in your opinion? And the Oilers were favourites in an away game, that doesn't happen against actual best teams in the league.

The main point was we have played against 3 teams that made playoffs last year. 9 (Van twice) that didn't and expansion team. Team strengths doesn't change severely year to year, it is not like there are 10 new playoff teams every year compared to last.

If it would be other way around 9 last years playoff teams, 3 non playoff teams and an expansion team we would have had extremely tough schedule. Should be pretty easy concept to understand.

 

[McTonyBrar]

Matches the eye test too. I was pro Keith before and just after the trade... but he's not been good enough. We have too many low-end 2nd pair or bottom-pair D types. Larsson is missed.

Larsson is playing like crap on the Kraken

 

[oilers'72]

They really aren't one of the best. Unless "one of the" is about 10 teams. 63 points in 56 games last year. 15th league wide. Got swept 4-0 in the first round. Lost Schwartz, Hoffman and Sanford, acquired Buchnevich, Saad, (healthy Tarasenko). Sure that is improvement, but that doesn't push them from slightly above average to top5. Close to top10 is more realistic.

They were without Schenn and Krug on top of that. They have nice forward depth so they can do okay without Schenn. They lack game breaking talent. D is bad. Scandella-Parayko, Rosen-Faulk, Walman-Bortuzzo is that good in your opinion? And the Oilers were favourites in an away game, that doesn't happen against actual best teams in the league.

The main point was we have played against 3 teams that made playoffs last year. 9 (Van twice) that didn't and expansion team. Team strengths doesn't change severely year to year, it is not like there are 10 new playoff teams every year compared to last.

If it would be other way around 9 last years playoff teams, 3 non playoff teams and an expansion team we would have had extremely tough schedule. Should be pretty easy concept to understand.

Carolina's schedule so far: NY Islanders, Nashville, Montreal, Columbus, Chicago (2), Arizona, Florida, Tampa Bay, Philadelphia, St. Louis. 2 top 5 teams and a good team. Montreal being a SC finalist last season means nothing this season. Rather easy schedule as well.

Edit: the teams we lost to were lower ranked and more because the Oil played down to them.

 

[North]

@Cloned we need one of your poll threads lol.

All other things being equal, would this team be 11-3 with Bear instead of Foegele?

 

[nabob]

They really aren't one of the best. Unless "one of the" is about 10 teams. 63 points in 56 games last year. 15th league wide. Got swept 4-0 in the first round. Lost Schwartz, Hoffman and Sanford, acquired Buchnevich, Saad, (healthy Tarasenko). Sure that is improvement, but that doesn't push them from slightly above average to top5. Close to top10 is more realistic.

They were without Schenn and Krug on top of that. They have nice forward depth so they can do okay without Schenn. They lack game breaking talent. D is bad. Scandella-Parayko, Rosen-Faulk, Walman-Bortuzzo is that good in your opinion? And the Oilers were favourites in an away game, that doesn't happen against actual best teams in the league.

The main point was we have played against 3 teams that made playoffs last year. 9 (Van twice) that didn't and expansion team. Team strengths doesn't change severely year to year, it is not like there are 10 new playoff teams every year compared to last.

If it would be other way around 9 last years playoff teams, 3 non playoff teams and an expansion team we would have had extremely tough schedule. Should be pretty easy concept to understand.

Wait so should we only consider what the Oilers did as well last season if that’s where you’re going to move the goal posts to? So we can’t judge at all how good the Oilers are right now until the season is over then we’ll use the previous season to judge how good they are currently. That’s asinine and completely disingenuous. Last year is last year. This year is this year. How well teams are playing this year is a reflection of how good they are. How they played last year is not a reflection of their play this year lol. That, is a very simple concept to understand.
What I think is happening here is that you’re actually deep down disappointed in how good the Oilers have been this season, and everything you said all off-season has been proven wrong, so you’re trying to create narratives and move goal posts to defend your bad takes. It’s weak.

 

[nabob]

Carolina's schedule so far: NY Islanders, Nashville, Montreal, Columbus, Chicago (2), Arizona, Florida, Tampa Bay, Philadelphia, St. Louis. 2 top 5 teams and a good team. Montreal being a SC finalist last season means nothing this season. Rather easy schedule as well.

Edit: the teams we lost to were lower ranked and more because the Oil played down to them.

Nope according to McCombo Montreal should still be considered the second best team in the NHL because of what they did last year. How a team is playing this season has no bearing on how good they are at all


Clearly he went all in that the Oilers would regret trading Bear and can’t handle that he hasn’t been missed at all and that the players who have taken his minutes have provided much better and much more consistent play than Bear ever did for the Oilers, then you add in that Foegele has been a solid addition to our forward depth and it just too much for him to handle.

 

[CornKicker]

I've never thought of either as that great defensively to be honest.

I think our D is just not as strong defensively. Having said that. we have 5 guys that can move the puck very well and it has been a long time since we had 5 good puck movers. Keith, Ceci, Nurse, Bouch and Barrie can all pass and get it going the other way. Maybe firewagon hockey is where it is at for us? Maybe guys like Connor and Drai love playing with Barrie while guys like me point out how bad he is defensively?

A very quick look shows me that we have only won 2 games all season where we don't score at least 5 goals (the 2 Nucks wins).

Having said that... I'll move on since I"m part of the threadjack problem.

Happy to see Foegele get an assist.. I think it was accidental but he was driving the puck the right way and was a huge part of a very important goal! His last 2 playoff series were very poor for points so hopefully that is cured by April.

I can't wait to play the Canes and hope Bear is healthy and in the lineup... that'll be a hillarious GDT by then. December 11th! Could be for first in the league. Mods will be busy that night.lol

sure they scored 5 goals but there was only 3 games they needed to score 4 to win

 

[nabob]

sure they scored 5 goals but there was only 3 games they needed to score 4 to win

Apparently winning 5-1 means that you were worse defensively than if you won 2-1

 

[Drivesaitl]

Nope according to McCombo Montreal should still be considered the second best team in the NHL because of what they did last year. How a team is playing this season has no bearing on how good they are at all


Clearly he went all in that the Oilers would regret trading Bear and can’t handle that he hasn’t been missed at all and that the players who have taken his minutes have provided much better and much more consistent play than Bear ever did for the Oilers, then you add in that Foegele has been a solid addition to our forward depth and it just too much for him to handle.

Couple days ago he stated the Bruins were the best team we faced. I pointed out we had played 6, now 7 clubs with a better record, lol, already this season. It must be dark in that cave.

 

[Forgot About Drai]

Nope according to McCombo Montreal should still be considered the second best team in the NHL because of what they did last year. How a team is playing this season has no bearing on how good they are at all


Clearly he went all in that the Oilers would regret trading Bear and can’t handle that he hasn’t been missed at all and that the players who have taken his minutes have provided much better and much more consistent play than Bear ever did for the Oilers, then you add in that Foegele has been a solid addition to our forward depth and it just too much for him to handle.

I mean the team has looked good, but can you say for sure that the defense would not be better with Bear? Its been pretty chaotic on the defensive end and we are on pace to allow more 5on5 goals then we did last year.

Since Bouch is on the top pair now, Barrie is pretty useless and is bleeding goals against, my opinion is that the team would be way better with Bouch, Bear, Ceci on the RD side.

 

[nabob]

I mean the team has looked good, but can you say for sure that the defense would not be better with Bear? Its been pretty chaotic on the defensive end and we are on pace to allow more 5on5 goals then we did last year.

Since Bouch is on the top pair now, Barrie is pretty useless and is bleeding goals against, my opinion is that the team would be way better with Bouch, Bear, Ceci on the RD side.

Can you say for sure that it would be better with him?

Bouchard is clearly an upgrade on Bear, Bouchard took Bear’s minutes. So I guess yeah I can say it would be worse with Bear in that scenario.

Bear can’t handle carrying his own pairing. That’s why he only plays 18 minutes a night still and plays with Slavin instead of playing 20+ minutes a night with a lesser partner. Bear being paired with Keith could be decent, but no better than Ceci with Keith IMO as they’ve been very good. Bear with Russell or Kkkk would be a nightmare, probably worse than Barrie with them as he doesn’t provide anywhere close the offense Barrie does. Barrie is playing the same role that Bear would be if he was still here, except that Barrie is an elite PP guy, and our PP has been a large factor in our success this year.

 

[nabob]

Couple days ago he stated the Bruins were the best team we faced. I pointed out we had played 6, now 7 clubs with a better record, lol, already this season. It must be dark in that cave.

That’s when he changed to the narrative that when you play a team this season you can only judge how good they are based on their record from last year

 

[Forgot About Drai]

Can you say for sure that it would be better with him?

Bouchard is clearly an upgrade on Bear, Bouchard took Bear’s minutes. So I guess yeah I can say it would be worse with Bear in that scenario.

Bear can’t handle carrying his own pairing. That’s why he only plays 18 minutes a night still and plays with Slavin instead of playing 20+ minutes a night with a lesser partner. Bear being paired with Keith could be decent, but no better than Ceci with Keith IMO as they’ve been very good. Bear with Russell or Kkkk would be a nightmare, probably worse than Barrie with them as he doesn’t provide anywhere close the offense Barrie does. Barrie is playing the same role that Bear would be if he was still here, except that Barrie is an elite PP guy, and our PP has been a large factor in our success this year.

I think Bear handles those third pairing minutes way better then Barrie. I dont know why Bouch should be the comparison. Bear last year was never stapled to Nurses side, it was Barrie. And now whos stapled to Nurse side Bouch.

I much rather have Bouch take over all Barrie PP mins. If Barrie was so good on the PP nurse wouldnt have taken so many minutes from his him on the PP last year or the PP would of been less effective when Nurse was on it.

So to me - Bouch should of been the Barrie replacement. He's already done it 5v5 and hes offensively gifted enough to do it on the PP too. Now the question is, who would you rather have on third pairing, Bear or Barrie? For me its Bear all day.