News Article: ESPN: Montreal has all the pieces to be legit Stanley Cup contenders
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Born in 1909
Hockey Royalty
He does stupid stuff, though.
McCarron is our guy... but he will likely not be developed enough for the 2016 PO.
Still... rookies call-ups have helped NHL teams win championships before.
TheBlindFan
Registered User
- Sep 7, 2008
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That not what I say, dump and chase is a strategy, pretty easy to find and know what it is...
Dump & Chase is not a system... It a strategy to enter to zone being the defense, and it's very effecient against "la trappe" and slow defense corp.
MT system cannot be dumb & chase has some claim, that all I was saying
DangerDave
Mete's Shot
Dump and chase was part of his system. Not that much anymore. Compared to last year, we are hardly utilizing dump ins. Pretty much only to change lines or if no other option is available.
And no it is not effective. Don't believe me. Look at these stats: http://nhlnumbers.com/2012/7/11/more-on-the-advantages-of-puck-possession-over-dump-and-chase
And if he has in fact not changed the system then it means that the players are not listening to him at practice because it is a drastic departure from last years play. I don't care if he denies that he has not changed it but these players do not have the same tendencies that they have had for the past couple years and I have a hard time believing that a whole team just changes the way they play because of 2 new players. It just makes no sense that a team randomly stops relying on dump ins and starts using an aggressive 1 high boards, 1 low forecheck out of the blue.
Also, when you have many experts like Lebrun saying Montreal is playing a different system, then they most likely are. That guy's life is hockey so he probably knows a thing or two more than anybody on this forum does.
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ECWHSWI
TOUGHEN UP.
- Oct 27, 2006
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that's pretty much the definition of an off. system.
You insist on using the word strategy you go ahead, others want to say system that's fine too...
don't get what you're trying to accomplish by fighting over a word (system/strategy) ?
outside insisting on the idea the system did not change... as if MT is too stupid to evolve or something ?? is that the point you're trying to make ?? MT idiocy ??
cause I don't know, I see A LOT of posters here happy with the way he is coaching NOW...
here's the definition for each (in french, for you), so you decide, strategy or system ?
strategy :
system :
from Larousse.
Stats back us up, too: http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=784241&navid=nhl:topheads
It's only 7 games, but we were also a real strong possession team in the playoffs and we have an even better team now.
This keeps up, we'll definitely be contenders heading into the deadline and Bergevin will most likely look at a move to add even more fire power to this lineup.
It's only 7 games, but we were also a real strong possession team in the playoffs and we have an even better team now.
This keeps up, we'll definitely be contenders heading into the deadline and Bergevin will most likely look at a move to add even more fire power to this lineup.
TheBlindFan
Registered User
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I'm happy the way the team is going since a while, and it evolve with the quality and show with the roster we have now.
Global plan didn't change, and people here should have giving credit year ago instead of complaining DAILY on MT and MB,
Be humble please
TheBlindFan
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System versus strategy...
a system included a lot of different strategies... to help our commun understanding...
Even if my english is so limited
I don't even understand why there's an argument about our system. The way we play is completely different compared to last year. Those arguing against it and saying Therrien was a great coach all along just lack a set of eyes.
Therrien last year:
Therrien so far this year:
Therrien last year:
Therrien so far this year:
TheBlindFan
Registered User
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I don't even understand why there's an argument about our system. The way we play is completely different compared to last year. Those arguing against it and saying Therrien was a great coach all along just lack a set of eyes.
Therrien last year:
Therrien so far this year:
that's the main problem...
anyway...
ECWHSWI
TOUGHEN UP.
- Oct 27, 2006
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Look, if you really want to fight over the use of the word system or strategy, you go fight with dictionnaire Larousse people as they seem to also think there's lots of similarities between the two.
Given that I posted the definitions in french, the language thing is just an excuse. Now you keep talking about this all you want, it will not change the fact you are dead wrong.
No point going any further.
Bye.
Lafleurs Guy
Guuuuuuuy!
- Jul 20, 2007
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The roster's a little better but it's not vastly improved. The core remains the same. There's more to work with but I think the players we had in the past (Sekac for example) would've had a lot more success with a different system.
Why not? Just stop telling the forwards to sit and wait at the side of the boards to chip in the puck...
It's not rocket science man, you simply change the system.
Everyone agrees.
That's what happens when you aren't using the dump and chase. You hang onto the puck longer and you can use your D to join in on the attack.
Lafleurs Guy
Guuuuuuuy!
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Yeah, I see no reason to add a guy like that.
Sure would be nice to add a scorer though.
If Iginla was in the final year of his contract(he isn't) he would be someone I would've looked at under controlled minutes.
Takeru
Registered User
- Oct 6, 2014
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I could've guessed, but if this is really what this debate is about, I think you're the one being biased around here. It's not some hipster challenge of who was right first so people can say "I told you so".
Lots of things changed since last year, including players. While the blame didn't fall solely on Therrien, he isn't the misunderstood genius you paint him to be either. He tried new stuff, adapted some aspects of our game, and it worked. The fact it is working now, rather than last year, isn't a basis for claiming that was his plan all along.
If you're whole point for denying changes to the system is "people should've given more credit to Therrien last year", despite all the evidence pointing otherwise, that says something about your credibility on the matter.
greyboy67
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- Feb 11, 2004
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"Habs are legit Stanley Cup contenders."
Well, duh!
The Canadiens are coming off two consecutive 100-point seasons. Last year's 110 points was second best in the NHL and the most by a Habs team since 1988-89, when the Canadiens lost in the Finals to Calgary.
Montreal's goalie is not just the best goalie in the NHL; he's the best player in the league and possibly the world. In addition to Price, the team features a core group of skilled players who are still improving, including Max Pacioretty, PK Subban, Alex Galchenyuk, and Brendan Gallagher. Not to mention that the roster was improved during the off-season.
Barring catastrophic injuries, how could the Canadiens NOT be a serious Cup contender?
But we all know that regular season records (and winning streaks) don't mean much when the playoffs roll around.
You can be certain management wants to start the playoffs with a well-rested Carey Price.
During the 7-game win streak, Montreal has only trailed once–for about 2 minutes—against Detroit. Playing with the lead lets you dictate strategy. On TSN talk radio, one of the Pierres—Lebrun or Maguire; I forget who—pointed out that when Montreal has to make up a deficit it will be harder to continue rolling 4 lines. Therrien will be forced to increase ice time for the guys who get paid to score goals—Pachioretty, Plekanec, Galchenyuk, etc.—reducing ice time for the fourth line.
Well, duh!
The Canadiens are coming off two consecutive 100-point seasons. Last year's 110 points was second best in the NHL and the most by a Habs team since 1988-89, when the Canadiens lost in the Finals to Calgary.
Montreal's goalie is not just the best goalie in the NHL; he's the best player in the league and possibly the world. In addition to Price, the team features a core group of skilled players who are still improving, including Max Pacioretty, PK Subban, Alex Galchenyuk, and Brendan Gallagher. Not to mention that the roster was improved during the off-season.
Barring catastrophic injuries, how could the Canadiens NOT be a serious Cup contender?
But we all know that regular season records (and winning streaks) don't mean much when the playoffs roll around.
You can be certain management wants to start the playoffs with a well-rested Carey Price.
During the 7-game win streak, Montreal has only trailed once–for about 2 minutes—against Detroit. Playing with the lead lets you dictate strategy. On TSN talk radio, one of the Pierres—Lebrun or Maguire; I forget who—pointed out that when Montreal has to make up a deficit it will be harder to continue rolling 4 lines. Therrien will be forced to increase ice time for the guys who get paid to score goals—Pachioretty, Plekanec, Galchenyuk, etc.—reducing ice time for the fourth line.
TheBlindFan
Registered User
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In fact is not, if you read Michel Therrien on is hockey vision, it's pretty consistent. That what dedicated the game plan and the system.
The 7 first games, habs are playing with a lead, score more and most thing workup. Last season habs were 7-1. we lost just one game, but badly (7-1), winning games just by one goal... but still... and we were giving the first goal almost every game... so you cannot play the same way...
what change is not the system in my opinion, but the result... and yes we have mainly a better roster. Players have more control, generate more turn-over and score more.
I will stop arguing anyway cause is not very constructive... MT can only be bad, only switching DD with Galchenyk solved all.
MT say to play "Da, Stop Dumb and chase, play possessive game!", players start to be good...
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TheBlindFan
Registered User
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pretty much... Price only reason we win, switch Galchy and DD we win...
again
MT dumb...
and corsi win... who?
again
MT dumb...
and corsi win... who?
LastWordArmy
Registered User
The guy to add might not be a rental free agent, it might be a guy who has this year and next year on his contract. I'm talking about Jarome Iginla.
Lars - Chucky - Iginla
Lars - Chucky - Iginla
Iginla is a nice option but that extra year is a killer. He makes 6 mil per I believe. That's hard to fit under the cap. You have to remember Flash, Semin and Kassian aren't exactly getting paid big dollars. You may get Iginla but it will be hard to replace the other two. Of course, maybe one of the rookies would step in full time next year but we'd need more than a few games in the AHL before concluding that.
Besides, Iginla is 38 and will be 39 next season. Even if we can fit it, I don't want to pay him 6 million at that age. I believe we'd be over the cap and screwed and it's just not worth it for someone that old.
LastWordArmy
Registered User
With 18 minutes a game.
Know how much Gallagher gets this year? 15:59.
Besides, you're referencing 2014-15 which is fine but I'm not even talking 2015-16. I'm talking 2016-17. An obvious regression would happen. Few forwards are leading their team in points at that age. Sure guys like Selanne did okay in later years but the regression happens pretty damn quick. It's not worth the risk and again, we'd have to trade someone in order to keep him. Who should we trade(6 million worth) in order to keep a 39 year old?
Compile
Registered User
He's 38, making $6m and still has time left. Doesn't matter if he is still scoring, the following season the Habs will most likely be over the cap.
pretty much if were improving we have to improve big time and the player has to be worth the cap hit with players going back to get us under the cap, or we pick up someone who is going to be ufa next year so we don't have to worry about be stuck with a big contract.
The problem with iginla is that he is neither of these things, we will be stuck with his contract while we won't be making a big improvement, I don't expect him to produce as much here anyways.
We're in a tricky situation but we don't have anyone that can't be traded, meaning we can be very flexible with trading players if we do want to fit someone under the cap. We also have a lot of prospects that can be traded in a large package.
I think the best thing to do is to wait another 20-30 games before we start looking to make trades, it's too early to be making judgements on players, good or bad. We should wait until teams commit to selling and are looking for prospects/picks or a player starts looking for a trade out of a team. Patience is key for a competitive team, we don't want to get stuck with a bad contract and player that might not fit our team.
