Edmonton Elks Thread

[Samus44]

Jones is a great coach...but has zero loyalty
he'll leave the first chance he gets

Or usurp the job of those above him, which is why he might not get hired.

You can't blame a guy for seeking promotions. A position coach is worth enough to be comparable to any position in the CFL and it presents promotional opportunities. If you can become a Coordinator in the NFL, ala Mark Trestman, it's a massive promotion financially that any reasonable person should want to take. Let's not even mention what being a head coach would mean. A man has to do what's best for his family. Moving back to your native country and for a big payday is a honest decision for a man to make even if it's inconvenient for CFL teams to accept.

Chris Jones is a very good coach and I for one really enjoyed watching the team in the years he coached. I'd be happy to see if he can repeat his previous success even if it's a short term arrangement. Winning is what matter most and that's what he does. A good QB with his D is a recipe for success IMO.

 

[Samus44]

Agreed for the league. I just look at it from the EE perspective that this is just a guy bailing on his contract for a perceived better opportunity. It reflects way moreso on him than the team. It also reflects poorly overall on the league because this is the second time in two years where a very key member of a teams management staff broke their contracts leading up to CFL free agency.

No one said it looked bad on Saskatchewan when Jones bailed on January 15 2019, but it reflected poorly on him and how positions in the CFL are viewed. I fail to see why this is different and reflects more on the EE.

I think it's clear that they're quite coveted but the opportunities in the NFL and even some college programs is just too big to turn down. It's common sense, you can become a multi-millionaire if you take advantage of your opportunity. Nobody bats an eye when a player leaves or asks for his release to go to the NFL, so why should they for coaches? The NFL is big money and the pinnacle of the sport, especially for Americans. Wouldn't you expect most Canadian coaches to leave a Euro coaching gig for the NHL? I would and the NHL is peanuts compared to the NFL and the disparity is likely less in compensation. Coaches are often disposable and opportunities are sometimes once in a lifetime in nature. If peoples perceptions are being changed by this then they were living in a fairy tale to begin with. This is real life and real people with real families. These people are following their dreams and best interests in a highly competitive and unstable line of work where opportunity is often fleeting.

Also, and this isn't specifically in regards to you or anyone, but when I see people talk of loyalty it confounds me. I can say without doubt that I love no company, including my employer, or any other entity more than my family. That's who I believe any man should always be most loyal to. The people in their life, especially those who rely on them. Loyalty to your employer is nice and all but it always needs to be less than the loyalty you have to yourself and loved ones.

 

[Del Preston]

I'd take Jones back as long as he's locked in a room during the offseason so he can't leave again.

 

[bellagiobob]

I think it's clear that they're quite coveted but the opportunities in the NFL and even some college programs is just too big to turn down. It's common sense, you can become a multi-millionaire if you take advantage of your opportunity. Nobody bats an eye when a player leaves or asks for his release to go to the NFL, so why should they for coaches? The NFL is big money and the pinnacle of the sport, especially for Americans. Wouldn't you expect most Canadian coaches to leave a Euro coaching gig for the NHL? I would and the NHL is peanuts compared to the NFL and the disparity is likely less in compensation. Coaches are often disposable and opportunities are sometimes once in a lifetime in nature. If peoples perceptions are being changed by this then they were living in a fairy tale to begin with. This is real life and real people with real families. These people are following their dreams and best interests in a highly competitive and unstable line of work where opportunity is often fleeting.

Also, and this specifically in regards to you or anyone, but when I see people talk of loyalty it confounds me. I can say without doubt that I love no company, including my employer, or any other entity more than my family. That's who I believe any man should always be most loyal to. The people in their life, especially those who rely on them. Loyalty to your employer is nice and all but it always needs to be less than the loyalty you have to yourself and loved ones.

While that is all true, he had been a coach in the NFL before signing with the Esks, so to me this is different than the guy who pays his dues coaching in Canada and then gets the opportunity to coach in the NFL. If he’s been asked to take a pay cut and his contract has been altered, then no issue. But don’t know the specifics.

 

[McAsuno]

Jones got it done, so I don't see why not.
His resume speaks for himself.

 

[Samus44]

While that is all true, he had been a coach in the NFL before signing with the Esks, so to me this is different than the guy who pays his dues coaching in Canada and then gets the opportunity to coach in the NFL. If he’s been asked to take a pay cut and his contract has been altered, then no issue. But don’t know the specifics.

Yeah that's fair. But it's not far fetched to believe there was an out or understanding that after 1 year he might pursue NFL opportunities, especially because of his background. He was coach for a year, even if that year didn't happen. It seems unlikely to me that he wasn't going to take a pay cut and/or have a lot less budget than what he was promised. It's difficult to blame a guy for taking an opportunity when the league didn't play last season and might have troubles playing again this year. It's annoying but I get it and don't blame him. Coaching is a ruthless profession with guys often casted aside quickly by teams so I see it as a guy making hay while the sun is shining. I don't care for double standards, if the team can toss him aside for something perceived to be better than he ought to be able to do likewise.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Can't say I blame him. Just imagine if Rodgers ends up in Indy.

 

[bone]

I think it's clear that they're quite coveted but the opportunities in the NFL and even some college programs is just too big to turn down. It's common sense, you can become a multi-millionaire if you take advantage of your opportunity. Nobody bats an eye when a player leaves or asks for his release to go to the NFL, so why should they for coaches? The NFL is big money and the pinnacle of the sport, especially for Americans. Wouldn't you expect most Canadian coaches to leave a Euro coaching gig for the NHL? I would and the NHL is peanuts compared to the NFL and the disparity is likely less in compensation. Coaches are often disposable and opportunities are sometimes once in a lifetime in nature. If peoples perceptions are being changed by this then they were living in a fairy tale to begin with. This is real life and real people with real families. These people are following their dreams and best interests in a highly competitive and unstable line of work where opportunity is often fleeting.

Also, and this specifically in regards to you or anyone, but when I see people talk of loyalty it confounds me. I can say without doubt that I love no company, including my employer, or any other entity more than my family. That's who I believe any man should always be most loyal to. The people in their life, especially those who rely on them. Loyalty to your employer is nice and all but it always needs to be less than the loyalty you have to yourself and loved ones.

I actually agree with this, but I don't see this as a loyalty issue at all and not once even used the word to describe any of my opinions on the matter

I don't expect his loyalty to a team that hasn't played a game yet with him to be more than his family and I don't begrudge him taking the opportunity even though he suggested he was done doing so when he accepted this position.

My point was moreso the fact that this has happened twice in the last three years deep into the offseason right before free agency opens reflects on how people like SM and CJ view these positions. As such, it reflects poorly on the league in general just as it reflects on these individual in how they view the value of these positions.

I do, however, think Chris Jones' contract bail was worse because he had just signed an extension a week before.

 

[bone]

Can't say I blame him. Just imagine if Rodgers ends up in Indy.

So he can go 1-5 in Championship games if he manages to get there?

 

[joestevens29]

So he can go 1-5 in finals games if he manages to get there?

Pretty sure Colts fans would take that as a win at this point. As would Milanovich. Getting that far would really open up a lot of options for the guy.

 

[bellagiobob]

Yeah that's fair. But it's not far fetched to believe there was an out or understanding that after 1 year he might pursue NFL opportunities, especially because of his background. He was coach for a year, even if that year didn't happen. It seems unlikely to me that he wasn't going to take a pay cut and/or have a lot less budget than what he was promised. It's difficult to blame a guy for taking an opportunity when the league didn't play last season and might have troubles playing again this year. It's annoying but I get it and don't blame him. Coaching is a ruthless profession with guys often casted aside quickly by teams so I see it as a guy making hay while the sun is shining. I don't care for double standards, if the team can toss him aside for something perceived to be better than he ought to be able to do likewise.

I was under the assumption that coaches contracts in the CFL were similar to those in the NHL, that if you fire the coach, you are still on the hook for paying him his salary. Which as we know is different than with CFL players, as most can be cut even with a contract. So if his contract had an out clause, then no problem, his choice to leave. My only issue is if he signed a longer term deal, and the club was still honoring the terms of the contract, then his leaving with the club's permission would irk me a bit. But like you said, very likely he was asked to take a pay cut, so contract was altered.

 

[bellagiobob]

So he can go 1-5 in Championship games if he manages to get there?

Ouch. I don't blame the loss yesterday on Rodgers, thought he had a decent game. His overall playoff statline is very good. Think only seven QB's historically have more playoff wins than him.

 

[joestevens29]

Ouch. I don't blame the loss yesterday on Rodgers, thought he had a decent game. His overall playoff statline is very good. Think only seven QB's historically have more playoff wins than him.

Back to back years the guy has been written off early and back to back years he finds a way to get the team to the Conference finals.

Green Bay might regret not getting him help this past year at the draft instead of drafting a QB.

 

[Samus44]

I actually agree with this, but I don't see this as a loyalty issue at all and not once even used the word to describe any of my opinions on the matter

I don't expect his loyalty to a team that hasn't played a game yet with him to be more than his family and I don't begrudge him taking the opportunity even though he suggested he was done doing so when he accepted this position.

My point was moreso the fact that this has happened twice in the last three years deep into the offseason right before free agency opens reflects on how people like SM and CJ view these positions. As such, it reflects poorly on the league in general just as it reflects on these individual in how they view the value of these positions.

I do, however, think Chris Jones' contract bail was worse because he had just signed an extension a week before.

I'm sorry I thought I tried to make it clear that I knew you hadn't. Perhaps I was too vague about that. My whole tangent in regards to loyalty was aimed at no one in particular just a general opinion I had on the matter. I tried to attach it to the end of my reply as an additional tangent I had wanted to articulate. I was not actually trying to be all that critical of you. EDIT: OMG sorry I just noticed the typo, it was supposed to say "isn't specifically" and not the broken english that was there. lol.

I understood your point but what I have been saying is that reality suggests no negative optics ought to exist. There is no diminishment in value, the CFL has always been a lesser opportunity than the NFL. Covid has only increased the massive disparity between the leagues. I think the position is plenty valuable I just don't think it's surprising that a relatively young man is seeking greener pastures after one nonexistent year.

I understand the negativity when I first heard it I said, "f*** him, hope he never gets a CFL job again.". But when trying to be empathetic I can't deny the honesty of doing what's best for yourself and family.

Chris Jones' contract bail did have awful optics but I don't know how it broke down so I can't judge.

 

[bone]

Ouch. I don't blame the loss yesterday on Rodgers, thought he had a decent game. His overall playoff statline is very good. Think only seven QB's historically have more playoff wins than him.

But how many have more championship game losses than him?

I'm just having a bit of fun, I was cheering for them yesterday big time, but seeing him miss opportunities to capitalize on multiple turnovers by Tampa Bay coupled with that record gave me some doubts about whether he can pull off the big game. Hopefully he goes and finishes off the career by pulling an Elway and proves me wrong.

 

[bellagiobob]

But how many have more championship game losses than him?

I'm just having a bit of fun, I was cheering for them yesterday big time, but seeing him miss opportunities to capitalize on multiple turnovers by Tampa Bay coupled with that record gave me some doubts about whether he can pull off the big game. Hopefully he goes and finishes off the career by pulling an Elway and proves me wrong.

He is undefeated when he gets to the Super Bowl.

 

[bone]

He is undefeated when he gets to the Super Bowl.

He does have that going for him!!

 

[Tyrolean]

As an Edmontonian and CFL fan, I suddenly feel very small ..

 

[Stoneman89]

Back to back years the guy has been written off early and back to back years he finds a way to get the team to the Conference finals.

Green Bay might regret not getting him help this past year at the draft instead of drafting a QB.

They might even be going to the Superbowl if they had used that pick to draft a DB and not had to throw King out there.

 

[Stoneman89]

Scott Milanovich

Once an Eskimo, never an Eskimo!

 

[bellagiobob]

 

[Cloned]

Not a huge surprise. Did anyone really think Sunderland was going to hire somebody who would be after his own job?

 

[I am the Liquor]

I'd take Jones back as long as he's locked in a room during the offseason so he can't leave again.

I’d take him back. The alternates could be something like Kavis Reed or Danny Macoicia.

 

[Stoneman89]

Not a huge surprise. Did anyone really think Sunderland was going to hire somebody who would be after his own job?

I'd fire Sunderland and hire Jones for his job AND headcoach.

 

[rboomercat90]

Everybody forget about all the rule breaking and shady shit Jones was doing in Saskatchewan or are we just excited about the possibility of him doing that here?