Dressing Sheep in Wolves Clothing II

[BruinsFanSince94]

the fact that you can identify all the other comments as mocking from one point of view yet can't see that my comments were mocking in the same way from a different point of view.... hence touchy.

You're kind doing the whole 'jumping all over things' here.

P.S. let me know when I can have opinion on players. Or an opinion on the value of physical play, k.

I don't recall saying you couldn't have an opinion on players or an opinion on physical play, but "k".

 

[LouJersey]

I think the Bruins brass was very aware of how soft they were for some of the season and most certainly vs Tampa. They weren't blind watching Krug and Gryz get engulfed and stapled into the boards continually. They brought in Moore who is big, can skate very well and not what I would call "tough" but he can hit, and absorb hits.

Wagner was clearly what they said they were looking for. they want guys that can hit, and hit hard but most importantly skate.

If Kuraly plays the 3rd line you have 2 forwards that can hit there, and 2 forwards on the 4th line that can hit. With Moore in and Gryz out you have 5 of your 6 defensemen that can it.

Would imagine that they are looking for top six help, but we will see.

 

[Fenian24]

Can we kill this thread already? Absolutely nobody is advocating non-physical play. This is just gonna keep going round and round

That would be what I believe today is called an "alternative fact"

As seen be the first handful of posters here who hate anybody physical that isn't a Cam Neely clone (and I'm sure some would complain about him) and can't wait to take shots at anyone who realizes physical hockey, hitting and fighting have a place. You always preach about how nobody says they don't want physical hockey but it just isn't the case. The lie of speed and skill alone will win is just that a lie.

Also not everyone is a fascinated and entertained by watching the Disney Princess' on Ice as some.

And no Wagner alone is not enough of a physical presence up front, but maybe we can get noted new age "tough" players like Loui Eriksson in here, that would be exciting to watch.

But I'm a barbarian, a thug or Troglodyte so what do I know.

 

[LouJersey]

Ross Johnston 4 years 4 mil. Lou Lams loves his tough guys.

 

[DrJustice]

That would be what I believe today is called an "alternative fact"

As seen be the first handful of posters here who hate anybody physical that isn't a Cam Neely clone (and I'm sure some would complain about him) and can't wait to take shots at anyone who realizes physical hockey, hitting and fighting have a place. You always preach about how nobody says they don't want physical hockey but it just isn't the case. The lie of speed and skill alone will win is just that a lie.

Also not everyone is a fascinated and entertained by watching the Disney Princess' on Ice as some.

And no Wagner alone is not enough of a physical presence up front, but maybe we can get noted new age "tough" players like Loui Eriksson in here, that would be exciting to watch.

But I'm a barbarian, a thug or Troglodyte so what do I know.

Are you not a morning person or are you always this angry

Not that I mind, I respect that you stick to your beliefs and I agree with the general theme of what you want to add to the team.

As always for me, it comes down to the targets people have in mind.

A guy like Wagner was easy to get on board with because he was not only free but cheap.

While I don't need a Cam Neely clone I do think a capable top-9 forward with some size and toughness would be a good addition, especially a right shot.

What I don't agree with was what the Canucks did. Rousell and Beagle are in a vacuum good bottom-6 players but at a combined $6M for the next four years seems far too much.

 

[BruinsFanSince94]

That would be what I believe today is called an "alternative fact"

And what you do is create what I believe today is called a "strawman argument" (as seen below).

As seen be the first handful of posters here who hate anybody physical that isn't a Cam Neely clone (and I'm sure some would complain about him) and can't wait to take shots at anyone who realizes physical hockey, hitting and fighting have a place. You always preach about how nobody says they don't want physical hockey but it just isn't the case. The lie of speed and skill alone will win is just that a lie.

The first handful of posters here are mocking what this thread is. That doesn't mean they don't like physical hockey. I mocked this thread, because it's useless, and I love hitting/fighting. I also love speed and skill. You can have lineups that consist of both. The Bruins do....Not as much as you'd like, and that bothers you.

Also not everyone is a fascinated and entertained by watching the Disney Princess' on Ice as some.

No one wants this. Stop saying it.

And no Wagner alone is not enough of a physical presence up front, but maybe we can get noted new age "tough" players like Loui Eriksson in here, that would be exciting to watch.

Ah, isn't a Fenian Special without taking a dig at Loui Eriksson, he owns some nice real estate in your head.

But I'm a barbarian, a thug or Troglodyte so what do I know.

Don't make it this easy, please.....

 

[LSCII]

Ross Johnston 4 years 4 mil. Lou Lams loves his tough guys.

That's great. Ross can throw a punch as everyone on the ice blows past him with actual skating ability...

 

[LSCII]

That would be what I believe today is called an "alternative fact"

As seen be the first handful of posters here who hate anybody physical that isn't a Cam Neely clone (and I'm sure some would complain about him) and can't wait to take shots at anyone who realizes physical hockey, hitting and fighting have a place. You always preach about how nobody says they don't want physical hockey but it just isn't the case. The lie of speed and skill alone will win is just that a lie.

Also not everyone is a fascinated and entertained by watching the Disney Princess' on Ice as some.

And no Wagner alone is not enough of a physical presence up front, but maybe we can get noted new age "tough" players like Loui Eriksson in here, that would be exciting to watch.

But I'm a barbarian, a thug or Troglodyte so what do I know.

You're tilting at windmills with this logic. Like Chief said, nobody is saying physical play should be outlawed and every player needs to be a Lady Byng candidate. I think what most reasonable folks are saying is that the league is moving towards speed and skill, and the concept of having a roster spot occupied by a player that brings nothing but fighting skills is outdated. Nobody is saying you can have a fighter on the team, but only if he can also score 50 goals. What they're saying is that it's okay to have a guy on the team that's willing to drop the gloves, but that can't be his only redeeming value. He has to have more skills other than being able to eat punches and throw some back in return. In other words, no more goons. Real hockey players that can and are willing to fight are always welcome.

That's all.

 

[ODAAT]

That's great. Ross can throw a punch as everyone on the ice blows past him with actual skating ability...

I`ve never even heard of this guy

 

[LSCII]

I`ve never even heard of this guy

He's a career goon. 25 career games at the NHL level, 6 points and 7 NHL fights.

 

[LouJersey]

That's great. Ross can throw a punch as everyone on the ice blows past him with actual skating ability...

He's actually not a bad player. I def don't see him being able to PK well though, so it's 1 mil for a 12th-13th forward.

He is a great team guy though. He sticks up for them, and pretty much beats your ass if you do someone wrong.

 

[LSCII]

He's actually not a bad player. I def don't see him being able to PK well though, so it's 1 mil for a 12th-13th forward.

He is a great team guy though. He sticks up for them, and pretty much beats your ass if you do someone wrong.

He's a dinosaur. He fills one roll and the roll he does fill is being phased out by the league. Not worth the money and roster spot given his singular skill set.

 

[Fenian24]

Are you not a morning person or are you always this angry

Not that I mind, I respect that you stick to your beliefs and I agree with the general theme of what you want to add to the team.

As always for me, it comes down to the targets people have in mind.

A guy like Wagner was easy to get on board with because he was not only free but cheap.

While I don't need a Cam Neely clone I do think a capable top-9 forward with some size and toughness would be a good addition, especially a right shot.

What I don't agree with was what the Canucks did. Rousell and Beagle are in a vacuum good bottom-6 players but at a combined $6M for the next four years seems far too much.

Vancouver overpaid for Roussel but they have the cap space, are going to have a few players on ELC's and not have to be worried about the cap for a few years. Also Roussel in a top 9 roll will put up points as well as being a pain.

Curtis Mckenzie was signed by Las Vegas to a low dollar contract, he led the AHL in playoff goals and is a good sized, physical player who can scrap. Couldn't Sweeney have beaten McPhee's offer instead of getting Nordstrom as your 13th forward?

Reaves was overpaid as well but you have to over pay for players if you are not drafting them, Sweeney has not drafted a physical forward besides Gabrielle yet.

While mourning the loss of players like Dan Kordic, Bruce Shoebttom, Riley Cote etc I get that the league has opted for it's current brand of hockey and if they wish to be competitive the Bruins need to have a flexible line up of forwards, which is fine, the lack of toughness is unacceptable especially when a player like Bjork may wind up on your fourth line rather than a player who brings physicality.

I would move highly rated prospects for a Josh Anderson, while you may wind up overpaying in the future by giving up a Bjork/Senyshyn level prospect you have those types of players you do not have an Anderson style player in the system.

There are options available that Sweeney is not opting to explore, which is unfortunate, I fear he and Cassidy's disregard for physical, big layers will continue to burn the Bruins in the playoffs.

Oh and I'm not a morning person and I'm a Democratic Socialist living in the Trump presidency, so my normal level of anger has been honed to a razor's edge over the past 18 months.

 

[Fenian24]

He's a dinosaur. He fills one roll and the roll he does fill is being phased out by the league. Not worth the money and roster spot given his singular skill set.

Yet a Hall of Fame GM in Lamoriello feels he is worth a contract and the money.

 

[Glove Malfunction]

He's a dinosaur. He fills one roll and the roll he does fill is being phased out by the league. Not worth the money and roster spot given his singular skill set.

Sounds like he's exactly the type of player you describe here.

You're tilting at windmills with this logic. Like Chief said, nobody is saying physical play should be outlawed and every player needs to be a Lady Byng candidate. I think what most reasonable folks are saying is that the league is moving towards speed and skill, and the concept of having a roster spot occupied by a player that brings nothing but fighting skills is outdated. Nobody is saying you can have a fighter on the team, but only if he can also score 50 goals. What they're saying is that it's okay to have a guy on the team that's willing to drop the gloves, but that can't be his only redeeming value. He has to have more skills other than being able to eat punches and throw some back in return. In other words, no more goons. Real hockey players that can and are willing to fight are always welcome.

That's all.

 

[LSCII]

Yet a Hall of Fame GM in Lamoriello feels he is worth a contract and the money.

Yeah, because Lou Lams is old as f*** and he doesn't realize the game has bypassed him as well...

 

[Rubber Biscuit]

That would be what I believe today is called an "alternative fact"

As seen be the first handful of posters here who hate anybody physical that isn't a Cam Neely clone (and I'm sure some would complain about him) and can't wait to take shots at anyone who realizes physical hockey, hitting and fighting have a place. You always preach about how nobody says they don't want physical hockey but it just isn't the case. The lie of speed and skill alone will win is just that a lie.

How come you never, ever quote the posts that actually say these things?

 

[Rubber Biscuit]

Yet a Hall of Fame GM in Lamoriello feels he is worth a contract and the money.

How does that justify your point?

You keep pointing to the fact that some GMs are still acquiring these guys but I'm sure you wouldn't accept that logic if it was a player you didn't like.

 

[LouJersey]

He's a dinosaur. He fills one roll and the roll he does fill is being phased out by the league. Not worth the money and roster spot given his singular skill set.

I'd def take him as a 12 or 13 on my team. He doesn't like Tom Wilson lol.

 

[Fenian24]

How does that justify your point?

You keep pointing to the fact that some GMs are still acquiring these guys but I'm sure you wouldn't accept that logic if it was a player you didn't like.

True but the players I don't like tend to be the direction the league is heading, soft with the beloved speed and skill. My point of course being that while many members here believe tough players are no longer useful people actually paid to run NHL teams seem to be signing them, does our esteemed board believe they know more than NHL GM's? Is it possible our pacifist members are wrong and tough players aren't going to be run out of the NHL? That would be my point about GM's signing "those" types of players

 

[LSCII]

True but the players I don't like tend to be the direction the league is heading, soft with the beloved speed and skill. My point of course being that while many members here believe tough players are no longer useful people actually paid to run NHL teams seem to be signing them, does our esteemed board believe they know more than NHL GM's? Is it possible our pacifist members are wrong and tough players aren't going to be run out of the NHL? That would be my point about GM's signing "those" types of players

You keep using tough and physical as euphemisms for fighters, and those things are certainly not mutually exclusive. You can be a tough, physical player while not dropping the gloves very often. You can also be a fighter that is willing to drop the gloves at any time, but not be a very physical player, aside from when you're fighting.

 

[Rubber Biscuit]

True but the players I don't like tend to be the direction the league is heading, soft with the beloved speed and skill. My point of course being that while many members here believe tough players are no longer useful people actually paid to run NHL teams seem to be signing them, does our esteemed board believe they know more than NHL GM's? Is it possible our pacifist members are wrong and tough players aren't going to be run out of the NHL? That would be my point about GM's signing "those" types of players

I wish you could just make your point without the condescending nonsense. I don't even disagree with you all that much but this stuff is just stupid.

Anyway, if the league is trending toward "soft with the beloved speed and skill", then clearly the people actually paid to run NHL teams seem to think that's the right way to go... are you saying you know more than NHL GMs?

 

[Fenian24]

I wish you could just make your point without the condescending nonsense. I don't even disagree with you all that much but this stuff is just stupid.

Anyway, if the league is trending toward "soft with the beloved speed and skill", then clearly the people actually paid to run NHL teams seem to think that's the right way to go... are you saying you know more than NHL GMs?

My argument is there needs to be a mix. I appreciate speed and skill, but I don't want a league of Kessel's, also a league of Bill Goldthorpes would get boring eventually.
Of course I know more than real GM's, it's the reason I am currently rolling in money by being the silent voice, the Hand for Game of Thrones fans, to several GM's over the years.
And I just don't understand how someone could say I am condescending and sarcastic

 

[Rubber Biscuit]

My argument is there needs to be a mix. I appreciate speed and skill, but I don't want a league of Kessel's, also a league of Bill Goldthorpes would get boring eventually.
Of course I know more than real GM's, it's the reason I am currently rolling in money by being the silent voice, the Hand for Game of Thrones fans, to several GM's over the years.
And I just don't understand how someone could say I am condescending and sarcastic

I think virtually everyone here would agree with the bolded. I don't recall ever seeing posts from anyone saying they don't want any toughness.

 

[Dr Hook]

I think virtually everyone here would agree with the bolded. I don't recall ever seeing posts from anyone saying they don't want any toughness.

Unfortunately, if you disagree with a particular player becoming a Bruin (*cough* Ryan Reaves *cough*) then clearly you want a soft team full of Alex Semin's. Or, you might want toughness but couldn't care less if the player drops the gloves or can 'win' a fight, so you want a soft "speed and skill" team.