Devils 2019 offseason team discussion (news and notes) XI

[Emperoreddy]

I'll patiently wait for the "he's got to want to come here" people, yes....

but it makes sense on our end to offer it. Make him say no.

No one will say that because most of us rightfully don’t want him here.

 

[beekay414]

No one will say that because most of us rightfully don’t want him here.

"Rightfully"

Right. We vehemently defend Severson but shit on Gardiner.

Makes TOTAL sense.

 

[beekay414]

Gardiner gets unnecessarily shat on here despite the fact that this team has been terrible on the blue line for years.

Makes total sense.

 

[Oneiro]

*Wants to trade a defenseman who got 40 pts in his rookie season and 30 last year on one of the worst teams in the league*

*Wants to bring in a 29-year old Gardiner who has only cleared 40 pts twice on one of the best offenses in the league*

Makes sense.

 

[beekay414]

*Wants to trade a defenseman who got 40 pts in his rookie season and 30 last year on one of the worst teams in the league*

*Wants to bring in a 29-year old Gardiner who has only cleared 40 pts twice on one of the best offenses in the league*

Makes sense.

Call me when Butcher handles top pairing duties.

 

[beekay414]

For how "valuable" everyone on this roster is...we should be annual playoff competitors.

Wait..what? We've picked #1 overall two times in the last 3 years? YOU DON'T SAY?!

Man, I'd hate to trade anyone from this VAUNTED roster.

 

[beekay414]

Fine.

Let's slot Butcher in as top pair LHD and see how good he really is.

 

[Oneiro]

Butcher has accomplished the same things as Gardiner in a less prominent role, playing less minutes on a bad team. But your argument is that since it hasn't happened on the top pair, it is therefore invalidated and we should trade him and sign Gardiner.

Yup. Still makes sense.

 

[beekay414]

Fine.

Let's slot Butcher in as top pair LHD and see how good he really is.

Newsflash: There's a reason why he was a 5th round, unsigned college free agent. But who am I to not oversell my own players!?!?

 

[Oneiro]

Yes, I enjoy watching the games where Butcher can get the puck to our skilled forwards faster and better than Gardiner ever has in his career.

I especially enjoy it when our forwards are healthy and our goaltending is not historically bad. But who cares about context? Let's sign Jake to a multi-year contract that will surely not interfere with any important RFAs in 3-5 years.

 

[beekay414]

Yes, I enjoy watching the games where Butcher can get the puck to our skilled forwards faster and better than Gardiner ever has in his career.

I especially enjoy it when our forwards are healthy and our goaltending is not historically bad. But who cares about context? Let's sign Jake to a multi-year contract that will surely not interfere with any important RFAs in 3-5 years.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight

Man, with all the talent we have, it's a f***ing wonder we only had 72 points this year.

Spoken like a true person that's never watch Jake Gardiner

 

[beekay414]

f*** it, let's give Will Butcher $5+ Million and slot him in top pair. What could go wrong? I mean, he's so good. Right?

 

[Bleedred]

If a goalies can’t do better than a .907% save percentage (there’s one I’m talking about in particular) then it won’t matter how the D plays. We’ll still see Severson blamed for turning the puck over leading to some weak 5-hole goal or some questionable half a screen from 40 feet out or some dead angle goal after Butcher fails to block a shot and lets the goalie handle some low percentage chance.

Because it’s been a while since I’ve thrown that grenade (a goalie debate) and it feels like I haven’t posted much lately.

 

[Cheddabombs]

If Gardiner signs elsewhere for three or less years and the dollar amount isnt insane, and we plan on playing Vatanen on his off-side or playing Greene or Butcher there - id be pretty disappointed with Ray.

Theres no reason we cant throw good dough at Gardiner to temporarily patch a hole we have. His contract wouldnt be a worry and hes MOST CERTAINLY better than our current options for the top LD spot

Lol what if he just doesn't want to play here?

 

[beekay414]

Lol what if he just doesn't want to play here?

I'll patiently wait for the "he's got to want to come here" people, yes....

but it makes sense on our end to offer it. Make him say no.

 

[Davegarri]

Gardiner sucks, would rather roll what we have unless he signed a ridiculously team-friendly deal

 

[Forge]

*Wants to trade a defenseman who got 40 pts in his rookie season and 30 last year on one of the worst teams in the league*

*Wants to bring in a 29-year old Gardiner who has only cleared 40 pts twice on one of the best offenses in the league*

Makes sense.

Disingenuous post as it leaves out the return for butcher. Am I trading butcher for picks? No. No reason to do that. Am I signing Gardiner and then using butcher as a piece in a deal for a potential top 6 if available? Absolutely. If I can turn butcher into Nylander or ehlers or something along those lines, I'm certainly listening. That team is better. Obviously depends on if that option is on the table, of course

 

[Bleedred]

We had less points than the friggin' Red Wings and you clowns are arguing over Miles Wood, Blake Coleman and Will Butcher. This is why we'll always be second rate in the metro.

The Red Wings also had the luxury of not having to ice 41 games of Keith Kinkaid’s .891% last year or the worst (probably the worst) 9 game stretch a goalie had in the entire NHL last year with the 9 games of .851% that Cory gave us from October-December.

And their goalies weren’t even that good, but they were also stopping more shots from all their useless boat anchors like POS fake shutdown guy Abdelkader, useless defensemen like Jonathan Ericsson and useless bum Luke “I wish I could play hockey even as well as Blake Coleman’s nasty jock strap can” Glendening.

The Red Wings PK was an abomination, but Jimmy Howard actually had a .924% at even strength, which was quite a bit better than average. The two goalies on our team that played the most last year didn’t even combine for better than .90% goaltending at even strength.

 

[beekay414]

Gardiner sucks, would rather roll what we have unless he signed a ridiculously team-friendly deal

Yay, more hyberpole. I love this site.

Gardiner "sucks" in the same way that Severson "sucks"

 

[Nico the Draft Riser]

Lol what if he just doesn't want to play here?

If thats the excuse we have every time a free agent who makes sense doesnt sign here and goes elsewhere for less than we could have offered - then somethings wrong

Not saying thats the case but that comment gets tiring when its everyones reasoning, like as if Jersey is a place no one wants to go to be paid more and played more...

 

[beekay414]

The Red Wings also had the luxury of not having to ice 41 games of Keith Kinkaid’s .891% last year or the worst (probably the worst) 9 game stretch a goalie had in the entire NHL last year with the 9 games of .851% that Cory gave us from October-December.

And their goalies weren’t even that good, but they were also stopping more shots from all their useless boat anchors like POS fake shutdown guy Abdelkader, useless defensemen like Jonathan Ericsson and useless bum Luke “I wish I could play hockey even as well as Blake Coleman’s nasty jock strap can” Glendening.

The Red Wings PK was an abomination, but Jimmy Howard actually had a .924% at even strength, which was quite a bit better than average. The two goalies on our team that played the most last year didn’t even combine for better than .90% goaltending at even strength.

We sucked, they sucked. Who gives a shit how we both sucked. We still sucked more than they did. Yet, we're here arguing over a 3rd pairing winger (Coleman), a 4th pairing winger (Wood) and a 3rd pairing defensemen (Butcher) like they are valuable pieces we can't live without.

Tell me what's more likely here...that they aren't what you all think they are or that I'm a huge pessimist and we don't suck like I think we suck?

 

[Bleedred]

We sucked, they sucked. Who gives a **** how we both sucked. We still sucked more than they did. Yet, we're here arguing over a 3rd pairing winger (Coleman), a 4th pairing winger (Wood) and a 3rd pairing defensemen (Butcher) like they are valuable pieces we can't live without.

Tell me what's more likely here...that they aren't what you all think they are or that I'm a huge pessimist and we don't suck like I think we suck?

I think Butcher is a middle pairing guy right now. I think he’s being underrated around here. Maybe he didn’t score as much last year as his rookie year. I don’t know why.

Coleman probably is a third line guy, that I do agree. I do think Wood could be a decent third line guy or possibly a “Middle 6 forward” but not a can’t miss or god forbid untouchable guy.

Other than that, I don’t think Gardiner is as bad as this board believes or as bad as the media in Toronto tells us we need to believe. I don’t really think we need to sign him though. Not sure we have room.

 

[Jack Be Quick]

so…..hall's going to calgary in FA?

They're far more competitive now than Minnesota ever was. And Alberta is pretty dope if mountains are your thing.

 

[beekay414]

I think Butcher is a middle pairing guy right now. I think he’s being underrated around here. Maybe he didn’t score as much last year as his rookie year. I don’t know why.

Coleman probably is a third line guy, that I do agree. I do think Wood could be a decent third line guy or possibly a “Middle 6 forward” but not a can’t miss or god forbid untouchable guy.

Other than that, I don’t think Gardiner is as bad as this board believes or as bad as the media in Toronto tells us we need to believe. I don’t really think we need to sign him though. Not sure we have room.

Oh, look at that, a respectful response. Thanks.

 

[Triumph]

Newsflash: There's a reason why he was a 5th round, unsigned college free agent. But who am I to not oversell my own players!?!?

This is asinine - you go off about absolutes on here and then say some garbage like this. Butcher's draft position has almost nothing to do with how good of a player he is now.

The Devils should not be trading Butcher. He gets excellent results with what he's given and he should be given more. Gardiner is better, but who knows for how long? One year, maybe?