Devils 2019-20 team discussion (news and notes) - part XII

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AfroThunder396

[citation needed]
Jan 8, 2006
39,130
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If Edmonton wants Palmieri, my ask is their 1st 2021 lottery protected (we already have three and their 1st this year will be pretty low, but next year's 1st could be great because, you know, Edmonton) + either Kyler Yamamoto or Philip Broberg.

Pool Party carries very little value in my eyes, I'd be interested in him as a reclamation project but I don't value him any higher than a 3rd round pick right now.
 

TrufleShufle

Registered User
Aug 31, 2012
7,782
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And if the approach we're taking works I'll be as happy as everyone else but there are clear examples of bad teams constantly going young and doing nothing but staying bad as well as examples where the results are as you'd like so we'll see what happens.
No you don't understand, when all our kids are finally good, we go to the old folks home, grab a couple WWII vets, throw some pads on em and we will be good to go.
 

Blackjack

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Feb 13, 2003
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If Edmonton wants Palmieri, my ask is their 1st 2021 lottery protected (we already have three and their 1st this year will be pretty low, but next year's 1st could be great because, you know, Edmonton) + either Kyler Yamamoto or Philip Broberg.

Pool Party carries very little value in my eyes, I'd be interested in him as a reclamation project but I don't value him any higher than a 3rd round pick right now.

Less and less interested in Broberg the more I read about him. I don't think Bouchard or Yamamoto will be available, so I'd be very happy with Lavoie or Benson and a 1st.
 

Triumph

Registered User
Oct 2, 2007
13,527
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To be fair if our fan base had the Blues combination of regular season success and postseason duds before last year most people here would be complaining our GM should rebuild and was pulling a Lou trying to win with a team that wasn’t a real contender a la the late ‘00’s.

That's ludicrous. First off, the Devils in the late 00s were real contenders - the 09 and 10 teams had obvious holes but those teams easily could've gone to a Cup Final - and second, the Blues' core is not old, it's just not young. It was floated that the Blues were considering tearing it down last season and I thought that to be absurd then too.
 

SpeakingOfTheDevils

Devils Advocate
Jan 22, 2010
15,645
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Philadelphia, PA
If Edmonton wants Palmieri, my ask is their 1st 2021 lottery protected (we already have three and their 1st this year will be pretty low, but next year's 1st could be great because, you know, Edmonton) + either Kyler Yamamoto or Philip Broberg.

Pool Party carries very little value in my eyes, I'd be interested in him as a reclamation project but I don't value him any higher than a 3rd round pick right now.

I'd need the 1st to be this year. I wouldn't want to hedge on the Oilers missing next year, especially if they have Palmieri.

But I'm still not even sold on trading Palmieri. I'd have to be floored by the return (a la Coleman), and the Oilers don't wow me unless Bouchard is involved.
 
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NJDevs26

Once upon a time...
Mar 21, 2007
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That's ludicrous. First off, the Devils in the late 00s were real contenders - the 09 and 10 teams had obvious holes but those teams easily could've gone to a Cup Final - and second, the Blues' core is not old, it's just not young. It was floated that the Blues were considering tearing it down last season and I thought that to be absurd then too.

I personally agree with most of the bolded but I was here during that period when people were complaining we need to go younger, Lou’s kidding himself, these teams aren’t real contenders because they lost in the first round, etc.
 

JrFischer54

Registered User
Apr 4, 2017
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I personally agree with most of the bolded but I was here during that period when people were complaining we need to go younger, Lou’s kidding himself, these teams aren’t real contenders because they lost in the first round, etc.

lou builds great regular season hockey teams but horrible playoff hockey teams. thats a fact
 

Spoiled Bratt

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Jun 29, 2016
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Keeping Palmieri makes little to no sense. If we moved Hall and Coleman, why are we keeping Palmieri?

It’s been brought up multiple times but it’s true. The guy doesn’t fit our timeline and the market is drastically in our favour. We’re a garbage team with him, so why not add more pieces to get an even better foundation in the not too distant future.

With the moves we made and our current situation, there’s no way Palmieri is itching to sign an extension with us. Expecting to resign him is wishful thinking and that’s why I’d cash in now instead of getting a lower return next year.
 

Forge

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Jul 4, 2018
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People also act like you can never trade Palmieri again down the road after re-signing him with all this hand-wringing about 'not fitting the timeline'. Or that only players who are absolutely gonna be in their prime (or before it) fit the timeline of when this team can be competitive again.

So a 21-22 year old Nolan Foote who isn't a sure thing and will probably have growing pains fits the timeline of being competitive in 2-3 years? He'll have to be a top six winger by then if we're razing the barn of everyone who isn't a center or goalie. Would it be so bad to have a 32-year old Palmieri around as the team gets competitive again? Or trade him then if things are taking longer than expected again and/or we do wind up finding a bunch of top six guys.

People also act like we can't trade Palms and then re-sign him after next season ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I mean, it's not something that I would do, but it's unfair to acknowledge one side without the other. And while you certainly can trade him down the line if re-signing him, I don't know that you will get the value back. Bit like playing the stock market there.
 

SpeakingOfTheDevils

Devils Advocate
Jan 22, 2010
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i used to care but then we shipped out coleman

And you would still care if Coleman didn't yield what he did.

If Palmieri can pull an unbelievable package, then I'll listen. If not, I have no problem keeping him.

Kreider is the first domino here. The funny part is, I think the Rags view the Kreider situation the same way we view the Palmieri situation.
 
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Forge

Blissfully Mediocre
Jul 4, 2018
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If Edmonton wants Palmieri, my ask is their 1st 2021 lottery protected (we already have three and their 1st this year will be pretty low, but next year's 1st could be great because, you know, Edmonton) + either Kyler Yamamoto or Philip Broberg.

Pool Party carries very little value in my eyes, I'd be interested in him as a reclamation project but I don't value him any higher than a 3rd round pick right now.

Agreed. I threw out an offer before of like a 3rd round pick + mediocre prospect for Pool party. At first it was Zaitsev...but then I was like, wait, there's no topside potential there, but the fact that he's consistently gotten better is promising. So I can give them Schnarr or Bastian or something like that.
 

Forge

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Jul 4, 2018
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Less and less interested in Broberg the more I read about him. I don't think Bouchard or Yamamoto will be available, so I'd be very happy with Lavoie or Benson and a 1st.

Lavoie was actually a guy that I was thinking about. Wasn't sure about Broberg either (though I'd take a shot on him in that sort of deal).
 

NJDevs26

Once upon a time...
Mar 21, 2007
67,394
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lou builds great regular season hockey teams but horrible playoff hockey teams. thats a fact

*Ignoring that Lou has a track record pre-2004 where he won three titles and went on two other deep playoff runs in a ten year span.

You can criticize his post lockout record for sure, but these exaggerated blanket statements don’t help that argument.
 

OmNomNom

Taco is Love, Taco is Life
Mar 3, 2011
22,992
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And you would still care if Coleman didn't yield what he did.

If Palmieri can pull an unbelievable package, then I'll listen. If not, I have no problem keeping him.

Kreider is the first domino here. The funny part is, I think the Rags view the Kreider situation the same way we view the Palmieri situation.
lol that's what i kind of meant

i used to be sentimental but now my reason for living has gone off to TB. we'll see if a package materializes
 
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MachoDiablo

Registered User
Mar 12, 2012
1,334
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Jersey City
Keeping Palmieri makes little to no sense. If we moved Hall and Coleman, why are we keeping Palmieri?

It’s been brought up multiple times but it’s true. The guy doesn’t fit our timeline and the market is drastically in our favour. We’re a garbage team with him, so why not add more pieces to get an even better foundation in the not too distant future.

With the moves we made and our current situation, there’s no way Palmieri is itching to sign an extension with us. Expecting to resign him is wishful thinking and that’s why I’d cash in now instead of getting a lower return next year.
I think your key point is the market: given the return for Coleman, it really seems like there's a sellers market right now, so it makes all the sense in the world for a rebuilding team like us to try to get as much as we possibly can for whichever players make sense to deal. We could wait until the offseason or next year for a Palms trade, but then he'll have less time left on his current deal and, who knows, it could be more of a buyers market next season. That happened in baseball recently, in 2016 the one year the Yankees weren't making the playoffs they sold off a bunch of guys in a sellers market and got an enormous return for most of them. The Mets tried to do the same in 2017 when injuries derailed their season, but it was a buyers market by then and they got painfully little.

However, again, I think we all agree that there isn't much point in selling on Palms without a really good return (e.g. at least a first and a top 50 prospect, if not more), no point in trading him just for the sake of trading him. Simmonds, Vats, etc.? Yeah, deal those guys, they won't be here next year anyway, but Palms has some value to the organization if he chooses to stick around, so don't get lowballed and bite just because, deal him because someone bowls you over.
 

EnglishDevil

Registered User
Nov 11, 2009
6,395
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London, UK & Chicago, US
There's little point keeping Palmieri or Subban (along with Simmonds & Vatanen). We aren't going to be competitive in the next two seasons, we might as well get a decent return for them while we can. I wouldn't trade Severson though, I genuinely believe he can still be part of the solution.
 

britdevil

Tea with milk...
Feb 15, 2007
26,145
12,302
UK
Lou failed to address the embarrassing defensive situation year after year after year.

2012 just goes to show what could have been, given that D-core was at least competent. I still have nightmares about Colin White, Mike Mottau and the rest of the dross that was trotted out between 2007-2011.

AND BRENT SUTTER. Just the name sends chills down my spine.
 
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Patrik26

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Mar 12, 2016
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There's little point keeping Palmieri or Subban (along with Simmonds & Vatanen). We aren't going to be competitive in the next two seasons, we might as well get a decent return for them while we can. I wouldn't trade Severson though, I genuinely believe he can still be part of the solution.

They're stuck with Subban unless they retain a large chunk of that contract. Simmonds isn't going to bring back much - let him police the ice for Nico, Hughes and Bratt. Vatanen still on IR, so is there really a GM willing to risk moving him into their lineup at playoff time? That leaves Palmieri. Let's see what happens this weekend.
 

billingtons ghost

Registered User
Nov 29, 2010
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lou builds great regular season hockey teams but horrible playoff hockey teams. thats a fact

I'll completely ignore the silliness of this statement in general, and pretend it only applies to post-lockout 2005-onward.

I'll agree that our forwards corps was built upon guys that were two small and couldn't play playoff hockey - They could rack up wins during the regular season - but had a hard time when things got physical. This changed a bit for us with Kovy and Clarkson up front and clearly our fourth line came together and was a force in 2012.

Lou's adds at the end of that decade that were supposed to show up in the playoffs... maybe just didn't.
 
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