Devils 2016-17 team discussion (player news and notes) - Part VI

[Bleedred]

Are we really playing an offensive system when we struggle to hit 20 shots on goal against the possession demons that are Montreal and the Rags?

It's a poor excuse for an offensive system when you struggle mightily to get 20 shots on those teams and struggle even more to keep the shots under 30.

 

[Bleedred]

I'm glad there is a little break from games, from a fan perspective.

My blood pressure was lower today and will be lower until Thursday. Not that it's ever too high but it's close to above average after Devils games.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

How is a more offensive system hurting our offensive players like Henrique and Palmieri? So we should play a 1-3-1 in order to maximize the talent of our top forwards? What kind of logic is that.

The only player who should be struggling with a more offensive system is Schneider but he's let in a boat load of stinkers so far and isn't playing like the Vezina candidate that he is.

To your first question, Hynes' coaching goes beyond his system. From my perspective, Hynes is struggling with motivating top guys and holding them accountable.



I think that a player like Hall can succeed in pretty much any system, so I question the wisdom of trying to play pond hockey when our defense is ill-suited to that, and this whole season our defense has been struggling. That, to me, points to a systematic issue that seems to exacerbate our lack of defensive talent.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

They were much, much better earlier on in the year.

It's the simple things that they need to work out on. The team seems way to lackadaisical on the breakout and in the defensive zone. Teams seem to set up their forecheck every time on us and we show no urgency or teamwork in getting the puck out of the zone. We're forced to either have one player skate the puck out of the zone on their own or just dump it down the other end of the ice. The team seems to forecheck, but never seems to put the opposing team under pressure the way other teams do to us.

Now is that systemic or a player issue? It's impossible to say from a fans point of view. Has our breakout been exploited by other teams? Are we not executing properly? Is the team's gameplan for the forecheck not working or are our players not forechecking well?

Just based off the players we have this year, I'm inclined to believe it's a personnel issue that Hynes and co. needs to work on. We're filled with inexperienced players and guys with defensive flaws. An up-tempo system could work as long as the players pay attention to detail. If they don't, they're going to get exposed, especially in an up-tempo system, by the experienced teams that do (see Rangers/Blues/Canadiens).

I just think by nature that inexperienced defensemen and defensemen not known for their defensive skill are going to struggle with those details that you mention and they are going to be prone to getting exposed. My concern is that the team defense isn't skilled enough to run the system that Hynes is implementing, so maybe a different structure would be wiser. It's not that this system could never work, just a question of whether it would work in a sustainable way with our current roster. I suppose we'll see as time unfolds (assuming Hynes remains coach).

 

[Triumph]

To your first question, Hynes' coaching goes beyond his system. From my perspective, Hynes is struggling with motivating top guys and holding them accountable.



I think that a player like Hall can succeed in pretty much any system, so I question the wisdom of trying to play pond hockey when our defense is ill-suited to that, and this whole season our defense has been struggling. That, to me, points to a systematic issue that seems to exacerbate our lack of defensive talent.

They're not trying to play pond hockey. They're trying to play higher-event hockey, which makes sense given their forwards, defense, and goalie.

 

[njdevil26]

I was waiting for detailed updates from practice.... then:

Andrew Gross ‏@AGrossRecord 46m46 minutes ago
Sorry. Company computer (new one) just crapped out. Bailing on practice to get it looked at. Hopefully back with you tomorrow.

 

[None Shall Pass]

From Yung Chere:

Chris Ryan ‏@ChrisRyan_NJ 9m9 minutes ago
Things winding down at Devils practice after about 75 minutes. Most intense practice I've seen since training camp

 

[Zippy316]

I just think by nature that inexperienced defensemen and defensemen not known for their defensive skill are going to struggle with those details that you mention and they are going to be prone to getting exposed. My concern is that the team defense isn't skilled enough to run the system that Hynes is implementing, so maybe a different structure would be wiser. It's not that this system could never work, just a question of whether it would work in a sustainable way with our current roster. I suppose we'll see as time unfolds (assuming Hynes remains coach).

Not just defense, forwards too.

We went from a veteran-laden roster filled with veterans who do the little things right after years and hundreds of games of experience to a largely youth-filled roster who still make inexperienced mistakes. Those mistakes compile and we don't have a defense that is good enough to cover for them. Of our three veteran forwards in the top nine, Parenteau is terrible defensively and Cammalleri is offensive-minded, for good reason.

Which is why I said, this comes down to Hynes and the staff preaching and getting the kids to playing smart and disciplined and doing all the little things right. I know the last part is a tired, at times overused phrase, but it's true. It's about getting back to that attention to detail to make the game easier to play as a team. Cutting out the bad decisions, preventing guys from winning board battles clean and creating chances, being more methodical with dump-ins, etc.

 

[FooteBahl]

From Yung Chere:

Chris Ryan ‏@ChrisRyan_NJ 9m9 minutes ago
Things winding down at Devils practice after about 75 minutes. Most intense practice I've seen since training camp

Not surprised at this at all.

 

[The Devil In I]

I'm not saying the system is the only problem. Just that it is a problem and there are some here who refuse to acknowledge that.

You've framed your "there's a problem with the system" argument within a larger one of "Hynes is a problem". Saying he's to blame for certain players under performing, while giving no credit for a) the players that over-performed for him last year and b) the players who are playing at/above expectations this year. Saying that he doesn't appear to be a leader, that he looks lost and over his head, etc. Saying that he should/could be fired as soon as next game. Throwing away the previous ~90 games of exceeding expectations due to 10-15 games of a young team not playing well.

It's possible that you're right about the system needing adjusting, but the reason you've gotten so much blow back on this is the over-the-top reactionary points in the broader part of the argument.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

Not just defense, forwards too.

We went from a veteran-laden roster filled with veterans who do the little things right after years and hundreds of games of experience to a largely youth-filled roster who still make inexperienced mistakes. Those mistakes compile and we don't have a defense that is good enough to cover for them. Of our three veteran forwards in the top nine, Parenteau is terrible defensively and Cammalleri is offensive-minded, for good reason.

Which is why I said, this comes down to Hynes and the staff preaching and getting the kids to playing smart and disciplined and doing all the little things right. I know the last part is a tired, at times overused phrase, but it's true. It's about getting back to that attention to detail to make the game easier to play as a team. Cutting out the bad decisions, preventing guys from winning board battles clean and creating chances, being more methodical with dump-ins, etc.

I hope Hynes can be the coach to do that. Nobody will be happier than me if my reservations with regard to Hynes' coaching and system prove to be wrong. As I've said before, I just want this team to be a success. I'd much rather watch this team win than see Hynes fired.

 

[Devils Dominion]

From Yung Chere:

Chris Ryan ‏@ChrisRyan_NJ 9m9 minutes ago
Things winding down at Devils practice after about 75 minutes. Most intense practice I've seen since training camp

Good, as long as no injuries come out of it.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

You've framed your "there's a problem with the system" argument within a larger one of "Hynes is a problem". Saying he's to blame for certain players under performing, while ignoring a) the players that over-performed for him last year and b) the players who are playing at/above expectations this year. Saying that he doesn't appear to be a leader, that he looks lost and over his head, etc. Saying that he should/could be fired as soon as next game. Throwing away the previous ~90 games of exceeding expectations due to 10-15 games of a young team not playing well.

It's possible that you're right about the system needing adjusting, but the reason you've gotten so much blow back on this is the over-the-top reactionary points in the broader part of the argument.

I'm not saying Hynes is necessarily the problem, just that there is a chance that he could be a problem, and some signs that he could be part of the issues that we are seeing. Nor am I demanding that he be fired, just that it wouldn't shock me if he was. I think some of my earlier posts express that.

 

[MichaelJ]

I thought this would work too, but if you look at it from their side. Trade a D man you would loose in expansion, and you still have to expose one
So in the end trade for trade sake and potentially loose 2 d man if LV picks one.

Maybe trading with a team like Minny post expansion?
They need cap relief, have no 2nd rounder upcoming.
Maybe Brodin (+ adds of some kind)for a first or similar

These teams can also offer picks to LV to stay away from key assets.

I'm curious to see what moves might be possible with Las Vegas in the wake of the expansion draft.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

From Yung Chere:

Chris Ryan ‏@ChrisRyan_NJ 9m9 minutes ago
Things winding down at Devils practice after about 75 minutes. Most intense practice I've seen since training camp

Good. They need to wake the **** up.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

From Yung Chere:

Chris Ryan ‏@ChrisRyan_NJ 9m9 minutes ago
Things winding down at Devils practice after about 75 minutes. Most intense practice I've seen since training camp

Let's hope that works.

 

[HitemwiththeHyne]

How about we all keep all arrows in the quiver for the real enemy here: The Esa Tikanen era in Devils history.

 

[Better Call Sal]

I think we all experienced our own ballet today....a ballet of emotion...and feelings.





God, when is the next game?

 

[HitemwiththeHyne]

If I'm Shero I'm on the phone with Sakic asking what time the firesale by the tire fire/dumspter starts.

 

[Cheddabombs]

If I'm Shero I'm on the phone with Sakic asking what time the firesale by the tire fire/dumspter starts.

I wonder if Sakic was thinking of doing the same with Shero

I don't know if a hard practice will do it to be honest but let's see what happens Thursday

 

[FooteBahl]

NJD def John Moore: "I think guys are sick of it, It stops here. We've addressed it as a group and it's on us now to pick it up"

Per Morreale.

Let's see how they respond Thursday.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

NJD def John Moore: "I think guys are sick of it, It stops here. We've addressed it as a group and it's on us now to pick it up"

Per Morreale.

Let's see how they respond Thursday.

They are saying the right things, but talk is cheap. Need to see the talk translated into action.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

NJD def John Moore: "I think guys are sick of it, It stops here. We've addressed it as a group and it's on us now to pick it up"

Per Morreale.

Let's see how they respond Thursday.

Hopefully the group made the decision to keep Moore on the pine.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

I can somewhat understand people being upset at the "System" we're playing since the past few games it has not worked. However, it was working for about a month there, so what changed? Do you maybe think its the ebs and flows of the season catching up to a mediocre team? Do you maybe think its that our all-world goalie has been struggling for a few weeks now?

I'm not sure what "system" you think will be successful in the longterm with the personnel we have on the blue line. We basically have a #2, a #3 and then 5 third pairing guys.

 

[billingtons ghost]

I can somewhat understand people being upset at the "System" we're playing since the past few games it has not worked. However, it was working for about a month there, so what changed? Do you maybe think its the ebs and flows of the season catching up to a mediocre team? Do you maybe think its that our all-world goalie has been struggling for a few weeks now?

I'm not sure what "system" you think will be successful in the longterm with the personnel we have on the blue line. We basically have a #2, a #3 and then 5 third pairing guys.

I think the assertion that playing an up-tempo aggressive system requires talented forwards.

It's clear that we are in the progress of obtaining those talented forwards and going through some growing pains.

It's also clear that the fact that our forwards aren't particularly good exposes our D to a degree it hasn't been exposed in roughly 30 years.

I think Hynes has to make a few adjustments in personnel, and I think Hynes' tinkering with lines early in the season had a negative effect upon guys like Henrique and Palmieri who had been successful in a role.

It's just a perfect storm right now of sub-par goaltending, bad team defense, green forwards, poor defensive forwards, poor defensive play in front of our net, sub-par defensmen in general. Couple that with shaken confidence for all of our top forwards not named Zajac or Hall and you have a losing streak and a style of losing that is particularly egregious to a fan-base that rarely saw 4 goals against for the past 20 years.

If it isn't PaP, its Bennet giving the puck away. If it isn't Moore, its Quincy. And at the end, it is Cory simply not helping himself nor playing with confidence.

It's just ugly right now. A kick-ass practice will help. Hopefully we'll see some results.

What a roller coaster ride this thread is.