Proposal: DET - CGY

[DFF]

I wasn't commenting of the offer from OP. I was responding to @TS Quint 's comment about settling for a 3rd pair Dman (not Kylington) and not feeling bad about it. Say what you want about AA, but there's no way any GM gives him away for a 3rd pair Dman while in a rebuild like the Wings are. They will simply keep playing him and hope his stock rises. @TS Quint you still haven't convinced me why the Wings should trade AA for a 3rd pair dman during this rebuild.

Ok that makes more sense..

 

[TS Quint]

I wasn't commenting of the offer from OP. I was responding to @TS Quint 's comment about settling for a 3rd pair Dman (not Kylington) and not feeling bad about it. Say what you want about AA, but there's no way any GM gives him away for a 3rd pair Dman while in a rebuild like the Wings are. They will simply keep playing him and hope his stock rises. @TS Quint you still haven't convinced me why the Wings should trade AA for a 3rd pair dman during this rebuild.

If you could read more than 2 words without going into a blind rage and then follow how 2 reasonable people have a conversation like I'm having with Fameflame069 you would see Kylington is pretty much what I think is fair at least in his estimation of Kylington.

 

[Bounces R Way]

I liked everything about it until I read the name Oliver Kylington.

Not even that the value is out of whack here. AA should definitely fetch something worthwhile in trade. I just happen to believe Kylington is only scratching the surface on his potential, guy is seriously a phenomenal skater.

 

[Hammettf2b]

If you could read more than 2 words without going into a blind rage and then follow how 2 reasonable people have a conversation like I'm having with Fameflame069 you would see Kylington is pretty much what I think is fair at least in his estimation of Kylington.

I'll reiterate since you refuse to focus on the thing im asking. I'm not commenting on Kylington. Keep Kylington out of this conversation. I'm commenting on your take that you would be ok trading AA away for what ends up to being a 3rd pair guy. Why do you think Yzerman would be ok with that in this rebuild?

 

[TS Quint]

I'll reiterate since you refuse to focus on the thing im asking. I'm not commenting on Kylington. Keep Kylington out of this conversation. I'm commenting on your take that you would be ok trading AA away for what ends up to being a 3rd pair guy. Why do you think Yzerman would be ok with that in this rebuild?

Kylington is exactly what I described. The flames poster says he should be a 4D. That doesn't mean he will be a 4D. It's possible he might end up a 5 or 6. But if that's how it shakes out then it's how it goes, you get a useful bottom pair for a guy who is about to win the all time green jacket. There is risk on both sides. Maybe less for the Wings.

 

[newfy]

You keep him then. The guy fluked out on 30 goal once. Back to his normal pace and no defense on top of that...a second is more than enough let alone adding a potential NHL dman

This isnt completely true, or true at all really. In his 21, 22 and 23 year old seasons Athanasiou averaged over 20 goals per 82 games. It makes a lot of sense that at 24 he would hit 30 goals. Excluding just this season hes averaged 24 goals a season. For a young guy on a bad team those are pretty solid/consistent numbers.

So in reality this year is more of an outlier than him being back to his normal pace. A second is not more than enough and if you think it is you might as well stay out of the trade threads. An NHL executive on the athletic said he could draw a first rounder on his own.

 

[blankall]

Don't see the Flames shipping out Kylington after all the work they've put into him. The Flames can also get a 2nd line RW for a 2nd. If not, they'll just wait until the off-season and sign one. The Flames organization has been very hesitant to move futures. I can't see them moving one of their big 3 young defenders for AA, based on one good season.

 

[blankall]

This isnt completely true, or true at all really. In his 21, 22 and 23 year old seasons Athanasiou averaged over 20 goals per 82 games. It makes a lot of sense that at 24 he would hit 30 goals. Excluding just this season hes averaged 24 goals a season. For a young guy on a bad team those are pretty solid/consistent numbers.

So in reality this year is more of an outlier than him being back to his normal pace. A second is not more than enough and if you think it is you might as well stay out of the trade threads. An NHL executive on the athletic said he could draw a first rounder on his own.

His 2nd highest season is 18 goals. Even if you pro-rate it to 82 games/season (pacing is not the same as average), he's at 20.5 goals per season with the 23 year season being 18.4 goals/game. The 30 goal season looks like an outlier. There was no upward trend, and a 10 goal jump from the previous 3 seasons is a big jump.

 

[Hammettf2b]

His 2nd highest season is 18 goals. Even if you pro-rate it to 82 games/season (pacing is not the same as average), he's at 20.5 goals per season with the 23 year season being 18.4 goals/game. The 30 goal season looks like an outlier. There was no upward trend, and a 10 goal jump from the previous 3 seasons is a big jump.

Heres a good article that demonstrates why Wings fans think 30 goals could be somewhat common for AA going forward.
Go Greece Lightning - Evaluating Andreas Athanasiou’s impact on the Red Wings

 

[newfy]

His 2nd highest season is 18 goals. Even if you pro-rate it to 82 games/season (pacing is not the same as average), he's at 20.5 goals per season with the 23 year season being 18.4 goals/game. The 30 goal season looks like an outlier. There was no upward trend, and a 10 goal jump from the previous 3 seasons is a big jump.

A guy in his early 20s on a bad team is averaging 20 goals a year, at 24 he makes the jump to 30.. are we really going to pretend its more normal for him to be a 14 goal guy? Seriously?

I'm not saying hes a consistent 30 goal guy, but I find it hard to believe he wont be a 20+ goal scorer from here on out. Being a winger on the worst team in 20 years is having an impact on his season. So is being ridiculously unlucky Detroit Red Wings Andreas Athanasiou is the Unluckiest Player in the NHL - Last Word on Hockey

Nothing points to him being on pace for 14 goals being back to normal for him at all. If you put his shooting percentage to his career normal number 12.1, he has 12 goals already this year and is on pace for 24 goals on the year. He looks like what will be a consistent 20-25 goal guy, especially on a team with a bit of talent on it.

So ya 14 goals being normal for him is complete BS

 

[FameFlame069]

Kylington is exactly what I described. The flames poster says he should be a 4D. That doesn't mean he will be a 4D. It's possible he might end up a 5 or 6. But if that's how it shakes out then it's how it goes, you get a useful bottom pair for a guy who is about to win the all time green jacket. There is risk on both sides. Maybe less for the Wings.

No no i didn't, i said i see him as a 4, as his low, i think he'll be good

 

[Voodoo Glow Skulls]

Athanasiou@50%
Green@50%

For

Czarnik
Calgary 2020 2nd
Calgary 2020 3rd
Pospisil

 

[TS Quint]

This isnt completely true, or true at all really. In his 21, 22 and 23 year old seasons Athanasiou averaged over 20 goals per 82 games. It makes a lot of sense that at 24 he would hit 30 goals. Excluding just this season hes averaged 24 goals a season. For a young guy on a bad team those are pretty solid/consistent numbers.

So in reality this year is more of an outlier than him being back to his normal pace. A second is not more than enough and if you think it is you might as well stay out of the trade threads. An NHL executive on the athletic said he could draw a first rounder on his own.

It takes Larkin for AA to not get absolutely caved in for possession over that span.

 

[Hammettf2b]

Athanasiou@50%
Green@50%

For

Czarnik
Calgary 2020 2nd
Calgary 2020 3rd
Pospisil

Isn't Czarnik already 27? Why get older during this rebuild?

Edit: Totally didn't see Pospisil on the proposal. My bad

 

[FameFlame069]

Athanasiou@50%
Green@50%

For

Czarnik
Calgary 2020 2nd
Calgary 2020 3rd
Pospisil

How much cap is that coming to Cgy? 1.5 AA and 2.75 Green? It could be okay

 

[Remember2004]

Don't see the Flames shipping out Kylington after all the work they've put into him. The Flames can also get a 2nd line RW for a 2nd. If not, they'll just wait until the off-season and sign one. The Flames organization has been very hesitant to move futures. I can't see them moving one of their big 3 young defenders for AA, based on one good season.

Maybe this season but in the past... Not sure about that. A 1st and 2 2nds is pretty steep. They are magic beans for a guaranteed player.

2015- Hamilton - 1st/2nd/2nd
2016- Elliot 2nd/3rd
2017- Stone- 3rd/5th
2017- Smith- 3rd
2017- Hamonic- 1st/2nd/2nd

 

[Wingsfan 4 life]

I'd do that in a heartbeat. Can Calgary even afford to trade Kylington now with Gio out?

 

[newfy]

It takes Larkin for AA to not get absolutely caved in for possession over that span.

Thats fine I wasnt talking about that though. I was talking about how calling him a 14 goal scorer is complete BS. Theres plenty of good teams that have depth and better possession players than the wings where they could afford to stick him on a wing and get a boost of offense even if its sacrificing possession play.

Hes dynamic and can create his own offense which can be a weapon for teams, especially if they have good defensive and possession players already. I dont think hes an amazing player but I also dont think hes worthless. Hes a weird, polarising player. I could see some GMs offering quite a bit for his skillset and I could see some having him completely off their radar

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

I would do a second and prospect for sure. Like Matt Phillips or Zavgorodniy. Not Kylington though

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

I'd do that in a heartbeat. Can Calgary even afford to trade Kylington now with Gio out?

No lol. We also don’t have Hamonic at the moment. And Brodie and Hamonic are UFAs too

Our blue line prospects are absolutely non existent. Yet we have some underrated forward prospects. And yet I always see us trading D in proposals... makes a ton of sense

 

[blankall]

Maybe this season but in the past... Not sure about that. A 1st and 2 2nds is pretty steep. They are magic beans for a guaranteed player.

2015- Hamilton - 1st/2nd/2nd
2016- Elliot 2nd/3rd
2017- Stone- 3rd/5th
2017- Smith- 3rd
2017- Hamonic- 1st/2nd/2nd

Yeah no.

Hamilton was a special case. Hamonic is seen as a big mistake the organization doesn't want to repeat. Not happening for AA.

The 2nd is in play though.

 

[Iggys Dome]

Athanasiou@50%
Green@50%

For

Czarnik
Calgary 2020 2nd
Calgary 2020 3rd
Pospisil

I'd do this.

 

[DingDongCharlie]

I think it’s a bad move to give up Kylington. OP seems pretty high for AA.

 

[TS Quint]

Thats fine I wasnt talking about that though. I was talking about how calling him a 14 goal scorer is complete BS. Theres plenty of good teams that have depth and better possession players than the wings where they could afford to stick him on a wing and get a boost of offense even if its sacrificing possession play.

Hes dynamic and can create his own offense which can be a weapon for teams, especially if they have good defensive and possession players already. I dont think hes an amazing player but I also dont think hes worthless. Hes a weird, polarising player. I could see some GMs offering quite a bit for his skillset and I could see some having him completely off their radar

Stopped reading at the bolded. If you want a response try again with something I actually said. If not no big deal.

 

[Lampedampe]

Stopped reading at the bolded. If you want a response try again with something I actually said. If not no big deal.

You responded to his comment which was literally about calling AA a 14 goal scorer with a completely inconsequential about how Larkin drives up AA's possesion?