David Rundblad

[PhoPhan]

Since so many threads keep focusing on him, I thought I'd start a new one just for this topic.

I had a suspicion Tippett had been using Connor Murphy in sort of a shutdown role (and he sort of is, in terms of quality of competition), but something else jumped out at me when I looked at the numbers.

Basically, Tippett is sheltering Rundblad (when he plays) roughly the same way he's sheltering Stone. Stone's offensive zone start percentage is 56.2, while Rundblad's is 56.9. There's a little more daylight between their quality of competition (0.143 for Stone vs. 0.479 for Rundblad), but Morris and Klesla are facing even easier competition (while Yandle and Schlemko are sandwiched between them, and OEL, Michalek and Murphy are all way higher).

The major difference, though, is in Corsi. Only four players on the team have negative Corsi: Stone, and then the three guys who face much tougher opponents. Rundblad, meanwhile, has far and away the best Corsi on the team at 11.94 (#2 is Yandle at 5.76). So while Rundblad is getting very easy 5-on-5 minutes, he's performing about as well as he could. Eleven games is an admittedly tiny sample size, but he's doing great in that span.

I understand these guys bring different dimensions to the team. Stone is definitely bigger, and he might have the heaviest slapshot on the team (while Rundblad is more of passer and seems to opt for wrist/snap shots when putting the puck on net). But that's about it, in my eyes. Stone is a little bigger, but neither is really a bruiser, and both are below average skaters for defensemen. I think Stone's positioning is, on balance, a little better, but as the numbers above bear out, that doesn't translate to more effective play, and he's no less prone to major blunders.

Stone gets less PP time (1:21 to 2:00) and more SH time (1:32 to 0:03), but he's no more effective on the powerplay (3 points in 47:15 versus 1 point in 22:00) and he's dog **** on the penalty kill (3.5 PP goals allowed per 20 minutes when he's on the ice, which is by far the highest of anyone who has played 15+ minutes of PK this year).

Y'all keep complaining about Tippett's "man crush" on Schlemko, and I'm in agreement that Schlemko is overplayed. But if you're looking for a whipping boy here, Stone is your guy.

Click to read more...

 

[PhoPhan]

This also seems like a good time to dust off this quote from Tippett regarding his time running the Houston Aeros:

"We had a player that was supposed to be a great, shut-down defenseman. He was supposedly the be-all, end-all of defensemen. But when you did a 10-game analysis of him, you found out he was defending all the time because he can't move the puck.

"Then we had another guy, who supposedly couldn't defend a lick. Well, he was defending only 20 percent of the time because he's making good plays out of our end. He may not be the strongest defender, but he's only doing it 20 percent of the time. So the equation works out better the other way. I ended up trading the other defenseman."

Source: http://www.azcentral.com/sports/coy...phoenix-coyotes-dave-tippett-perfect-fit.html

 

[SniperHF]

This also seems like a good time to dust off this quote from Tippett regarding his time running the Houston Aeros:



Source: http://www.azcentral.com/sports/coy...phoenix-coyotes-dave-tippett-perfect-fit.html

The major difference, though, is in Corsi. Only four players on the team have negative Corsi: Stone, and then the three guys who face much tougher opponents. Rundblad, meanwhile, has far and away the best Corsi on the team at 11.94 (#2 is Yandle at 5.76). So while Rundblad is getting very easy 5-on-5 minutes, he's performing about as well as he could. Eleven games is an admittedly tiny sample size, but he's doing great in that span.

Isn't that a reason to be skeptical of Rundblad's numbers then? If Tip is capable of recognizing the distinction between defenders who are actually a positive force for puck possession vs those who are constantly battling in their own zone then why isn't Rundblad playing more? He clearly doesn't agree with these numbers. Or maybe he doesn't look at them but based on the quote I kind of doubt that.

Then there is the whole results issue. Rundblad has a whopping 9 career points in 49 games. I can really only think of one game this year(The Jackets game) where I've said Rundblad looks great out there.

I'm all in favor of a longer and more consistent set of games for Rundblad. But I'm not expecting much.

Schlemko has been better lately but I think we discussed this before. Most of the angst over him is just that he's getting minutes a lot of people would rather see go to a younger D with more upside.

 

[PhoPhan]

That's where I'm stuck. Based on the numbers I looked at, Rundblad has been the superior player, but obviously Tippett uses different metrics. I'd love to know what they are, because I just can't figure out how you watch them play or look at their statistics and decide Stone should be playing three times as many games.

As for the raw production, I think we've all seen how tentative Rundblad has looked this year, especially on the powerplay. I (and a lot of others) suspect this skittishness comes from the long stretches without playing. That's the most frustrating thing for me. To my eyes, the key to Rundblad's development at this point is to just give him a few games in a row to get comfortable. Winning should take priority over development, but they're not mutually exclusive concepts, and Rundblad has not been a liability.

 

[SniperHF]

Winning should take priority over development, but they're not mutually exclusive concepts, and Rundblad has not been a liability.

For sure, and I think earlier in the season some more leeway on that should be given. That ship has kinda sailed though, oh well

That's what kind of threw me off about what happened after the Jackets game too. Rundblad played a lot of minutes that game because Yandle took that 5 min fighting major and I thought he looked great in the defensive zone. Figured it would lead to him getting at least another game but nope

 

[Grimes]

I wonder if they play him against teams they know have some interest in him.

I really wish they did a better job with time sharing Rundblad and Stone's spot. Stone seems to play better after having a little breather. Runblad seems like he needs more consistency. Never would I have ever though having so much depth at the blueline would be so frustrating. Of course without it we would have had some stretches of being very limited with who we could have played.

 

[indczn]

PhoPhan, I noticed similar not too long ago too, trying to figure out what the heck was going on with our PK. My only guess is that Rundblad doesn't PK, which messes up the pairings. It's not good to have 2 D who don't PK on different pairings (Yandle/Rundblad) Messes things up badly, especially if one of the other 4 get a penalty. I do agree, I think stone is the better trade bait. Love his shot, but the only time having the puck on his stick is good is when hes winding up.

Rundblad has played against:
CBJ
VAN
ANA x2
COL
TB
SJS x2
NYI
NYR

No Idea

 

[PhoPhan]

Well, maybe it's actually Stone or Schemko they're trying to inflate. I hadn't really given that much thought, but it could be a smart move. The Canucks straight up admitted that they were giving Hodgson cushy minutes to boost his trade value (and then moved him for Kassian, for some reason), and I believe the Pens did the same thing with Goligoski (and more wisely brought back James Neal in return).

I don't think the Coyotes have a James Neal coming their way any time soon, but Schlemko and Stone are both fairly young and, more importantly, cheap. For a team looking for defensive help without much cap room, they could have some value. This doesn't really fit Maloney's usual MO, but it makes more sense to me than "Tippett thinks Stone and Schlemko are that much better than Rundblad."

 

[letowskie]

PhoPhan, I noticed similar not too long ago too, trying to figure out what the heck was going on with our PK. My only guess is that Rundblad doesn't PK, which messes up the pairings. It's not good to have 2 D who don't PK on different pairings (Yandle/Rundblad) Messes things up badly, especially if one of the other 4 get a penalty. I do agree, I think stone is the better trade bait. Love his shot, but the only time having the puck on his stick is good is when hes winding up.

Rundblad has played against:
CBJ
VAN
ANA x2
COL
TB
SJS x2
NYI
NYR

No Idea

Yeah; unless the right deal comes along, it maybe good to hold onto Rundblad, as his trade value is very low for what he can actually do. In terms of his pure offensive, he might be our most skilled defender (maybe not Yandle). He has not been shown off very much, and most scouting operations probably does not have any recent impressions of what he can do.

Stone has been consistently displayed as a decent and fairly capable D that is NHL ready today; not very high upside, but is already considered very proven by our young D-men standard. We will probably obtain pretty full value for him, as teams are already very aware of what he can do for a team.

 

[PhoPhan]

PhoPhan, I noticed similar not too long ago too, trying to figure out what the heck was going on with our PK. My only guess is that Rundblad doesn't PK, which messes up the pairings. It's not good to have 2 D who don't PK on different pairings (Yandle/Rundblad) Messes things up badly, especially if one of the other 4 get a penalty. I do agree, I think stone is the better trade bait. Love his shot, but the only time having the puck on his stick is good is when hes winding up.

Rundblad has played against:
CBJ
VAN
ANA x2
COL
TB
SJS x2
NYI
NYR

No Idea

I suspect that plays a role, because Rundblad has only taken one PK shift all year. Yandle doesn't ever get hurt, so there won't be many opportunities for Rundblad to be the only defenseman on the team who can't kill penalties.

That said, while Tippett doesn't play Rundblad on the PK, he always could, and maybe he should. Killing penalties as a defenseman isn't so much about speed as it is stickwork and positioning, and while neither of those is a strength of Rundblad's, I think he's capable as a 2nd unit guy. Obviously Tippett disagrees, though, and so this is probably the case.

I'd be curious to see what the rest of the lineup (namely the defense) looked like in those games Rundblad has played. May be something there.

 

[CC96]

May as well hold on to him and see what happens next year. Can't imagine Rundblad has too much trade value right now, plus he still has decent potential if he could just get some playing time.

Obviously it needs to be taken with a grain of sand, but he did lead the team in scoring during the pre-season and lead all NHL players in assists during that time. Like I said, it's the pre-season but I'm still interested to see what can happen if he can just get some regular playing time under his belt.

 

[PhoPhan]

Stone has been consistently displayed as a decent and fairly capable D that is NHL ready today; not very high upside, but is already considered very proven by our young D-men standard.

On this, I disagree. I actually think Stone has fairly decent upside if he would be a little more assertive physically and improve his positioning. I don't think he'll ever be a Shea Weber, but something like the version of Adrian Aucoin that played in Phoenix isn't out of the question. I'm thinking Stone can be a guy who plays on the 2nd unit of both the powerplay and the penalty kill and chips in about 25-30 points.

But I also don't think he's "very proven" just yet. He's shown flashes of terrific play and his slapper is ridiculous, but on balance, he's been pretty ineffective given the situations he's been playing in.

 

[ParisSaintGermain]

That damn one way contract; it completely locks the situation here. This is turning in one wasted year for all parties involved.

Rundblad (still only 23 years old) has played two games since November 24th. The breakdown for the year is as follow:

- 3 games in October (in two separated stretches)
- 5 games in November (in two separated stretches)
- 1 game in December
- 1 game in January

For good or bad reason (I trust Tippett here) He clearly will find it hard to get into the line up.

So what are the options for him to have some game time outside the NHL?

Can he be loaned to Europe for the rest of the season?
Can the contract be changed upon his own request into a two way even if this would mean losing some $ for now?
Can he fake an injury and have a conditioning assignement?

This looks like the mother of all trade low situation. What a shame really.

 

[Grimes]

On this, I disagree. I actually think Stone has fairly decent upside if he would be a little more assertive physically and improve his positioning. I don't think he'll ever be a Shea Weber, but something like the version of Adrian Aucoin that played in Phoenix isn't out of the question. I'm thinking Stone can be a guy who plays on the 2nd unit of both the powerplay and the penalty kill and chips in about 25-30 points.

But I also don't think he's "very proven" just yet. He's shown flashes of terrific play and his slapper is ridiculous, but on balance, he's been pretty ineffective given the situations he's been playing in.

I agree with all of this. I just have a hard time seeing where he will fit in the coming years.
My speculation next year is; (sorry if the hand is off)

OEL-Z
Yandle-Murphy
Morris-Gormely
Stone/Schlem/Rundblad

I really don't want three players sitting night after night. I also think Summers is valuable for depth. I would rather see Stone and Schlemko traded and keep Rundblad. This way we still have Summers and Runblad to play through injuries. I'd really hate for Rundblad to hit his potential on a different team just because we have extra players we can play now. Morris probably has two more years left on this team depending on how the organization views his loyalty.

Klesla should at least bring back a pick at the deadline. Stone should at least begin conversation to bring back a top 6.

 

[indczn]

Rundblad +

CBJ (Mo, Yandle, OEL, Murphy, Klesla)
VAN (Yandle, Murphy, Schlemko, Stone, OEL)
ANA (Yandle, Klesla, OEL, Stone, Morris)
COL (Yandle Klesla, OEL, Stone, Morris)
TB ( Yandle, Murphy, Schlemko, OEL, Stone)
ANA (Yandel, Michalek, Klesla, OEL, Stone)
SJS (Yandle, Michalek, OEL, Stone, Morris)
NSH ( Yandle, Michalek, OEL, Stone, Morris)
NYI ( Yandle, Michalek, Schlemko, OEL, Stone)
SJS ( Yandle, Michalek, Schlemko, OEL, Morris)
NYR (Yandel, Michalek, Schlemko, OEL, Morris)

*missed a Nashville game.
*Also, the PK has given up multiple goals in some of those games.

 

[letowskie]

On this, I disagree. I actually think Stone has fairly decent upside if he would be a little more assertive physically and improve his positioning. I don't think he'll ever be a Shea Weber, but something like the version of Adrian Aucoin that played in Phoenix isn't out of the question. I'm thinking Stone can be a guy who plays on the 2nd unit of both the powerplay and the penalty kill and chips in about 25-30 points.

But I also don't think he's "very proven" just yet. He's shown flashes of terrific play and his slapper is ridiculous, but on balance, he's been pretty ineffective given the situations he's been playing in.

Sure, if you mean being a physical crease clearing D-man. Yeah, he can definitely use his size, and improve his strength. He is very useful in all situations, so that versatility makes him very valuable to a lot of teams looking for that #4 D man that can occasionally step up with contingencies. His reasonable expectation is to end up like a slightly more physical version of Nikita Nikitin, who has worked out well for CBJ, can play the PP as well as contribute in a variety of roles, but I would never confuse with a top-pairing D in the league.

I don't think he has the vision or the ability to make plays in tight quarters to be an elite D-man; not in the same way that Gormley or Rundblad would.

 

[Grimes]

Sure, if you mean being a physical crease clearing D-man. Yeah, he can definitely use his size, and improve his strength. He is very useful in all situations, so that versatility makes him very valuable to a lot of teams looking for that #4 D man that can occasionally step up with contingencies. His reasonable expectation is to end up like a slightly more physical version of Nikita Nikitin, who has worked out well for CBJ, can play the PP as well as contribute in a variety of roles, but I would never confuse with a top-pairing D in the league.

I don't think he has the vision or the ability to make plays in tight quarters to be an elite D-man; not in the same way that Gormley or Rundblad would.

I think with what we have in the prospect pool, and what we already have there is no reason to settle on someone who maxes out around #4. He is a great player and exceeded my expectations. But I just see him as our best trade bait right now and I think Rundblad needs to get playing time.

 

[letowskie]

I think with what we have in the prospect pool, and what we already have there is no reason to settle on someone who maxes out around #4. He is a great player and exceeded my expectations. But I just see him as our best trade bait right now and I think Rundblad needs to get playing time.

Yes, my thoughts as well.

I would not be opposed to moving Rundblad at some later point, after he has been given a real chance to show what he can do. Part of this is unfortunate timing, where Murphy has played far ahead of our projected time-line; many of us thought he wouldn't be ready until Fall of 2015 at earliest.

But we do need to make some type of accommodation for Rundblad this season or next, if we are still hoping to extract appropriate value from him (he has the tools to be a top RHD, which is what we need anyhow), either as a player for us, or as a trade piece that brings in a skilled winger.

 

[cobra427]

We really don't have to do anything with Runblad this year. We have him through next year under contract. We can sit him the rest of the year period, start over this summer or next year. In order to keep him, we had to sign the one way deal. His agent probably told him that the Coyotes will be forced to give you minutes or if they send you down, you will get claimed on waivers. The thinking might have been that a trade was coming to clear some of the log jam on D.

What has happened instead is: Runblad's D has not improved enough for him to surpass Stone or Schlemko, Murphy has been a surprise, and there have been no trades. I don't see Tip experimenting down the stretch with Runblad while we are clawing for a playoff spot. Same risk is involved with showcasing him. Why would we do that anyway since we have his rights for another year.

Runblad could have been playing and improving earlier this year like Murphy did in the AHL or like Gormley has been all year. The One way deal slowed his development. The good news for him and the Coyotes is that the log jam will lessen this summer one way or the other and going into next year he will play one way or the other. If Runblad just needs more time to develop, the coyotes will likely keep him and play him next year. If they see something that makes them hesitate or think that he is not worth anywhere near where he was drafted, they will move him in a package at the TDL or this summer for less then we all expect.

 

[hbk]

It's not the one way deal that is hurting Rundblad. It's the lack of waiver eligibility. Blame the Sens for playing him when he clearly wasn't ready.

 

[PhoPhan]

Whether he signed a one-way or a two-way deal, he would still have to clear waivers to be sent down. The one-way deal was likely a way to placate him when Maloney knew he wouldn't be playing a ton this year.

 

[ParisSaintGermain]

It's not the one way deal that is hurting Rundblad. It's the lack of waiver eligibility. Blame the Sens for playing him when he clearly wasn't ready.

Whether he signed a one-way or a two-way deal, he would still have to clear waivers to be sent down. The one-way deal was likely a way to placate him when Maloney knew he wouldn't be playing a ton this year.

Thanks for clarifying this- I had this wrong.

 

[SurMartin]

So what are the options for him to have some game time outside the NHL?

Can he be loaned to Europe for the rest of the season?

Sorry to barge in but as a fan of his former SEL-team I was wondering about this as well. Would he still have to clear waivers?

 

[Temulence]

Since so many threads keep focusing on him, I thought I'd start a new one just for this topic.

I had a suspicion Tippett had been using Connor Murphy in sort of a shutdown role (and he sort of is, in terms of quality of competition), but something else jumped out at me when I looked at the numbers.

Basically, Tippett is sheltering Rundblad (when he plays) roughly the same way he's sheltering Stone. Stone's offensive zone start percentage is 56.2, while Rundblad's is 56.9. There's a little more daylight between their quality of competition (0.143 for Stone vs. 0.479 for Rundblad), but Morris and Klesla are facing even easier competition (while Yandle and Schlemko are sandwiched between them, and OEL, Michalek and Murphy are all way higher).

The major difference, though, is in Corsi. Only four players on the team have negative Corsi: Stone, and then the three guys who face much tougher opponents. Rundblad, meanwhile, has far and away the best Corsi on the team at 11.94 (#2 is Yandle at 5.76). So while Rundblad is getting very easy 5-on-5 minutes, he's performing about as well as he could. Eleven games is an admittedly tiny sample size, but he's doing great in that span.

I understand these guys bring different dimensions to the team. Stone is definitely bigger, and he might have the heaviest slapshot on the team (while Rundblad is more of passer and seems to opt for wrist/snap shots when putting the puck on net). But that's about it, in my eyes. Stone is a little bigger, but neither is really a bruiser, and both are below average skaters for defensemen. I think Stone's positioning is, on balance, a little better, but as the numbers above bear out, that doesn't translate to more effective play, and he's no less prone to major blunders.

Stone gets less PP time (1:21 to 2:00) and more SH time (1:32 to 0:03), but he's no more effective on the powerplay (3 points in 47:15 versus 1 point in 22:00) and he's dog **** on the penalty kill (3.5 PP goals allowed per 20 minutes when he's on the ice, which is by far the highest of anyone who has played 15+ minutes of PK this year).

Y'all keep complaining about Tippett's "man crush" on Schlemko, and I'm in agreement that Schlemko is overplayed. But if you're looking for a whipping boy here, Stone is your guy.

Wait, what? I thought Rundblad's skating was one of his strengths? Prototypical offensive, smooth skating, Swedish defenceman.

 

[Sinurgy]

Wait, what? I thought Rundblad's skating was one of his strengths? Prototypical offensive, smooth skating, Swedish defenceman.

I'm not a skating expert by any stretch but Rundblad looks very awkward when he skates and smooth is probably the last word I'd use to describe it. So far the main strength I've seen from him is his uncanny ability to get the puck on the net from the point regardless of how clogged the shooting lane is.