David Perron: From Love to Hate - the HF Story

Will Hunting

Immortal Adams
Dec 14, 2011
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Probably put it in the wrong thread, but here it is again.

I urge you guys to watch this video. Look at his snipes. Look at his hands. Look at how feisty he is. It's a travesty what's happened to him.



I liked the trade at the time, thinking what were the odds that a first rounder (None of us thought we'd make the playoffs on the last day of the season) is going to turn into a David Perron. Man was I wrong.

Odds are still odds though. You can find the best possible odds, then make a bet and still lose somehow. It doesn´t happen often, but it happens. I mean, I hate Perron now, but I don´t really blame JR for that trade. Every trade is a gamble and he made a bet that had around 80% chance of being succesful. Too bad that it went against us, but it was a logical trade in principle..

There is only David Perron to blame. He is the one who is disappointing us. He was supposed to be solid but he´s a failure despite being given every possible opportunity to succeed.
 

Gurglesons

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Dec 18, 2009
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Odds are still odds though. You can find the best possible odds, then make a bet and still lose somehow. It doesn´t happen often, but it happens. I mean, I hate Perron now, but I don´t really blame JR for that trade. Every trade is a gamble and he made a bet that had around 80% chance of being succesful. Too bad that it went against us, but it was a logical trade in principle..

There is only David Perron to blame. He is the one who is disappointing us. He was supposed to be solid but he´s a failure despite being given every possible opportunity to succeed.

Eh. Perron was a third liner on the Oilers. That should've tipped us off.
 

mpp9

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Dec 5, 2010
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I think it's a combination of things. Blues fans would tell you he's a frustrating player. Doesn't use his linemates and makes maddening decisions at times.

I think you combine that with playing with a center who demands the puck and for his linemates to be ready for a pass at any moment, along with how important skating is in today's league, and you have Perron where he is right now.

Billy's not far from the truth. He might have trouble staying in the league at this point.
 

billybudd

Registered User
Feb 1, 2012
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Pens have traded 3 first round picks and depth D man for 2 guys who cant score goals

Unless GMJR pulls off a miracle trade or these two start scoring they will go down as two of the worst trades this franchise has had. Not to mention the Despres one

Eh. Pull the brakes on the Kessel trade there. He's certainly been a disappointment, but so far all we've given up for him is Scott Harrington and Kasperi Kapanen. Harrington was b-rutal when he was up with the Leafs and (single important goal aside) Kapanen hasn't exactly distinguished himself in North American pros yet. Dominik Simon's about the same age and is having far more of an impact on that level and he's no sure thing.

Obviously Kapanen could improve, but if he doesn't, even if Kessel just scores 20 goals a year from here on out, we haven't gotten crushed in that trade because there's not much going back to Toronto.

In the annals of bad Rutherford trades, from worst to least worst, it goes

unprotected 2015 1st rounder for David Perron<bunch of stuff for Winnik~Despres for Lovejoy
 

AjaxTelamon

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Jul 8, 2011
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My point was just exasperation at people swatting flies when there's an enormous $5 million elephant that they want to ignore due to sunk cost phenomenon. Flies are dirty animals, but they don't crap as much as an elephant, so let's triage the threat proportionally. At least people are finally seeing him for what he is.

The damage Perron does is incalculable. I counted 4 brutal turnovers (I could say six, but I gave him the benefit of the doubt on two more plays) and 2 sucker-passes on his first five shifts last night (Daley came a fraction of a second from getting murdered and Sid saw what was coming ahead of time and just tried to steal it back instead of catching the pass--this worked by the way, but that doesn't excuse the stupidity of the pass). And this is without even going into anything he did (wrong) offensively or after the first period.

If a guy's going to do stuff like that, he better be a reliable bet to score 40, not something in the 4-8 range. Now that we have him, what we traded for him doesn't go toward what he actually does for us. Kael Mouillierat could score 5 or 6 goals without causing any of the problems in the previous paragraph. Hell, looks like Farnham put his money where his mouth was and actually did it.

Yes, it absolutely is. And to multiply the damage, Perron's usage has taken a scary turn.

I've been interested in how the coaches were going to cover up for his defensive deficiencies this year. Under MJ, he was heavily sheltered with O zone draws, the most heavily he's been sheltered since he's been in the league, which made sense. Under MS, that trend has changed, and that has a lot to do with playing with Crosby rather than Geno. This has probably contributed to him going from scoring at a poor rate, to not scoring at all, and for his mistakes becoming so noticeable.

He was a -6 through 28 games until MJ got fired, and he's been a -8 in 14 games under MS, and has only been a positive player once in 14 games. He was at almost 40% Ozone draws under MJ, and he's been closer to 30% under MS.

And even uglier, his teammates score less playing with him than they do on average (about 20% less), and his opponents score a ton more when they play against him than their averages (about 37% more). Most startling, we score only 35% of the goals scored when David Perron is on the ice, even though he starts a ton more in the O zone than the D zone. That's worse than Craig Adams during the final 4 years of his career when he was used as a Dzone checking forward.

And if you consider the alternative to Perron is typically Chris Kunitz, that really adds to how startling these stats are. And when you consider almost 70% of the goals scored when Kunitz is on the ice are scored by the Pens, it's pretty easy to see why the coaches have cemented him in the top 6. What's harder to understand is why Perron is still there.
 

SEALBound

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Jun 13, 2010
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Eh. Pull the brakes on the Kessel trade there. He's certainly been a disappointment, but so far all we've given up for him is Scott Harrington and Kasperi Kapanen. Harrington was b-rutal when he was up with the Leafs and (single important goal aside) Kapanen hasn't exactly distinguished himself in North American pros yet. Dominik Simon's about the same age and is having far more of an impact on that level and he's no sure thing.

Obviously Kapanen could improve, but if he doesn't, even if Kessel just scores 20 goals a year from here on out, we haven't gotten crushed in that trade because there's not much going back to Toronto.

In the annals of bad Rutherford trades, from worst to least worst, it goes

unprotected 2015 1st rounder for David Perron<bunch of stuff for Winnik~Despres for Lovejoy

If we squeek into the playoffs, we essentially pay 2 1sts + 1 2nd + 1 bottom 6 roster player for Kessel.

Think about this: Seguin+Hamilton+Knight for Kessel.

This is why I wasn't in favor of the trade. Soooo much gone from the future. Would Kappy have helped us this year, likely not. Harrington, yes. Spaling, no. So I mean, immediate impacts, meh. Future impacts...whoa boy...

Missing the playoffs is the best thing that could happen to us. Bottom 5 is the best actually. Bottom 10 slightly less bad. Making the playoffs, we is in trouble.
 

WayneSid9987

Registered User
Nov 24, 2009
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I still believe there will be a buyer at the TDL. It's just, if we go down another Top 6 wing...who will replace him? Like now, who replaces Perron? Rust? Kuhnhackl?

Our depth is scary...

I'd simply say "who cares" to that question cuz Perron @ 4M(or close to it) would be worse.
Just pick up a FA in the summer if need be.
This season, theres no point. Too many holes.
 

Will Hunting

Immortal Adams
Dec 14, 2011
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He is finally gone. I will remember him for a long time though. He was so bad, but that Carolina game probably was the final nail of coffin for him. Historically bad performance. It is great that JR identified the poison.
 

Shady Machine

Registered User
Aug 6, 2010
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Good bye Perron. I liked watching you dangle here and there but you sucked defensively and lost your offensive touch. Good luck in Anaheim and say hi to Despres for us.
 

xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Registered User
Sep 5, 2008
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I really can't believe how badly Perron worked out for us.

Agreed. It's insane to see the kind of player he was for several seasons before he came here, and then look at the player who is leaving the team. Two completely different players.
 

plaidchuck

Registered User
Feb 26, 2013
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There is something culturally wrong with this team to see a drop off like that. It's not like he's the first player to do that on the team.
 

systemsgo

fire mj
Apr 24, 2014
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Yes, it absolutely is. And to multiply the damage, Perron's usage has taken a scary turn.

I've been interested in how the coaches were going to cover up for his defensive deficiencies this year. Under MJ, he was heavily sheltered with O zone draws, the most heavily he's been sheltered since he's been in the league, which made sense. Under MS, that trend has changed, and that has a lot to do with playing with Crosby rather than Geno. This has probably contributed to him going from scoring at a poor rate, to not scoring at all, and for his mistakes becoming so noticeable.

He was a -6 through 28 games until MJ got fired, and he's been a -8 in 14 games under MS, and has only been a positive player once in 14 games. He was at almost 40% Ozone draws under MJ, and he's been closer to 30% under MS.

And even uglier, his teammates score less playing with him than they do on average (about 20% less), and his opponents score a ton more when they play against him than their averages (about 37% more). Most startling, we score only 35% of the goals scored when David Perron is on the ice, even though he starts a ton more in the O zone than the D zone. That's worse than Craig Adams during the final 4 years of his career when he was used as a Dzone checking forward.

And if you consider the alternative to Perron is typically Chris Kunitz, that really adds to how startling these stats are. And when you consider almost 70% of the goals scored when Kunitz is on the ice are scored by the Pens, it's pretty easy to see why the coaches have cemented him in the top 6. What's harder to understand is why Perron is still there.

Perron has the 4th most OZone rel % for forwards in the team, after Geno, Kessel and Sheary respectively, without the production of 71 & 81
 

systemsgo

fire mj
Apr 24, 2014
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curious, but who else had nearly that bad of a drop coming here? Not that I'm disagreeing exactly.

Perron's best season had him at a 0.73PPG, he's at 0.372PPG right now.
Bonino's best season had him at a 0.636PPG, he's now at 0.475PPG.
Kessel's best had him at PPG exactly, he's now at 0.581PPG
Hornqvist's best (last season) had him at 0.797PPG (otherwise, 0.697), he's now at 0.488PPG

A lot of players has had major drop offs with the Pens this season.
 

Ogrezilla

Nerf Herder
Jul 5, 2009
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Perron's best season had him at a 0.73PPG, he's at 0.372PPG right now.
Bonino's best season had him at a 0.636PPG, he's now at 0.475PPG.
Kessel's best had him at PPG exactly, he's now at 0.581PPG
Hornqvist's best (last season) had him at 0.797PPG (otherwise, 0.697), he's now at 0.488PPG

A lot of players has had major drop offs with the Pens this season.

ah you're just talking this season. Yeah, the whole team is scoring a lot less.
 

systemsgo

fire mj
Apr 24, 2014
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ah you're just talking this season. Yeah, the whole team is scoring a lot less.

well, Perron was playing injured/out of shape from a previous injury last season, so i try not to hold that against him. (though i wasn't the one who you quoted previously)
 

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