News Article: David Desharnais ranked 9th in the NHL for shoot outs

[Hoople]

Something DD's good at, among other things.

But but, wait, no shootouts in POs.

*looks at anti-DD avatar*

I ain't even a hater, but you, you fanboy, you needed to create yet another DD thread where I'll have to tear my shirt to shreds to convince you all that Eller deserved his spot, even in shootouts, yes, hear me, I'm great.

Pshhhh, let's all forget his 51 pts in 59 games, Eller would've done much better in the same circumstances *pats himself in the back* I'm so good I could've outcoached Michel Therrien, in NHL15 I'll win a Stanley cup with an all prospect team, because I'm that good of a coach.

I enjoyed this post.

 

[Rosso Scuderia]

Ok then I'll bite, who's better offensively than DD on the Habs right now, at center ? We can use cold hard facts if you want. And nope, Plekanec leeching off of red hot Kovalev dosen't apply (if DD had a winger with 80+ points you can bet he would've 70+ points).

Eller ? Plek ? Galchenyuk ? Manny ?

Eller isn't a playmaker / hasn't demonstrated the ability to distribute the puck and feed his wingers.

Plek is a two-way center that thinks defense first, and we need one like that.

Galchenyuk hasn't proved anything at center.

Manny is a quality plumber.

So who's better than DD right now ? IMO only Galchenyuk can replace him, and will do in time. Gally is pretty raw though. Do you think he's ready for the spotlight ? Don't you think the pressure can burn him ?

Well, you say like your opinions are facts.

I do think if Plekanec, Eller and Galchenyuk, can actually produce more than Desharnais in the same role. Plekanec has already shown that (he got 69 and 70 pts because he was playing an offensive role, and he's 6 time 20 g scorer, so i don't see what's wrong having a center capable to score, produce as much and much better defensively), Eller has shown he can outproduced DD even without PP. Ok it was a shortened season, Ok it was 17 playoffs games but he also doesn't have PP or the best wingers so that balances things out.


I also think Galchenyuk can outproduced DD if he centers lets say Pacioretty and Gallagher. I think it's unfair to say Galchenyuk didn't do **** as a center when we never gave him a real chance (30 games+) to adapt. It took DD 20 games last season to get it going so saying Galchenyuk didn't do much as a center in the 5-7 games is kinda unfair. As a winger, in the last 2 seasons and playoffs, Galchenyuk is at 0.52ppg while DD is at 0.59. Pretty sure Galchenyuk could easily get that 0.07ppg difference if he plays with a 30 goals scorer and our best RW on the other side.

I'm tired of hearing Galchenyuk is too young, is not ready, is not good enough, never proved anything. I think he's good enough to take a big role as soon as this season. I think he is a special player that will learn, develop properly even if the pressure is big. He's special, like Price is special. I never had a problem to see Price plays with the Habs that young. I always believe he's gonna learn more with the Habs than in Hamilton. What he got to learn was his mental toughness, to face adversity, to play under pressure. Would he be better if we send him back to Hamilton? We never know but I'm just happy that he's this good now. Same should apply to Galchenyuk. I rather see him learn and make mistake as a center, even if it's the top offensive center than see him lose his time on the wings.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

I dont think that many of us underrates him.

He gets a lot of criticism due to his role, not how he plays. Put DD on the middle 6 and Im pretty sure he won't get criticize anymore.

If he's good enough and I think he is, he can easily produce like any middle 6 player in the league but hard to blame those who are not happy to see DD playing the most important role as a forward which is the #1 offensive center.

The problem is that we don't have spot in the middle 6 for him, especially at center.

Bold: I'd bet my life savings he would.

I see him as a 2nd line C personally.

50% or so faceoff guy
Shootout specialist
Point producer

Add the fact I think his D game is underrated. I don't think he's as good as Plekanec or Eller but I don't think his Parros on the ice either. He backchecks hard and does fairly cell in the neutral zone. The area of weakness is despite his work ethic and drive his board battles are far legendary. He doesn't have the size to be dominant there and he's not a shot blocker type either. He has no physical game either. So overall his defensive game relative to a Plekanec, Backes, etc... is weak but it's NHL caliber IMO. I don't think he's a liability that some claim. I think he's just a guy who doesn't excel at that. Slightly below average IMO, not terrible though.

Still, I genuinely think the fans on this board are really over doing it with regards to him. He's not a #1C offensively or defensively, he isn't. Yet many questioned his ability to be an NHL player, that's just too much. He's got skills that a team can use and despite what people think I feel guys like Bourque benefit off playing with guys like DD. Eller and Plekanec aren't pass first centers so guys like Bourque don't do as well as we'd like with them.

I've openly said I'd try the following combos with DD in it:

Pacioretty-Plekanec-Parenteau
Galchenyuk-DD-Gallagher/Sekac/Whoever
Bourque-Eller-Gallagher/Sekac/Whoever

OR

Galchenyuk-DD-Bourque

OR

Pacioretty-DD-Gallagher/Parenteau(the current one)

and even him as a winger:

Pacioretty-Eller-DD

I think there's plenty of opportunity here. I don't even feel he's a great PP player, I think he's decent-good but nothing special so his PP time doesn't mean **** to me. I think he can be good at ES though. I see why he plays the ES minutes he does though, he's not a defense first center so it wouldn't really help the team. Still, there's compromise and ways to make an ideal fit for everyone with more balance. I don't feel that DD stops us from doing anything really. I think he's a good enough player that he can adapt. My issue comes primarly from those who think he sucks no matter what and those who feel we'd do X times better just by getting rid of him. That doesn't make sense to me. Replace him with a winger? Sure. Trade him for nothing or a pick? How are we better? If this is overrating him then people need their head checked. This isn't an extreme opinion.

End of the day, I absolutely disagree with you saying not many of us underrate him. I think the majority of those who discuss DD here do. Some to extremes and others less. The number of posters who overrate him? You can count it on one hand and have fingers to spare.

 

[Mario le Magnifique]

Well, you say like your opinions are facts.

I do think if Plekanec, Eller and Galchenyuk, can actually produce more than Desharnais in the same role. Plekanec has already shown that, Eller has shown he can outproduced DD even without PP. Ok it was a shortened season, Ok it was 17 playoffs games but he also doesn't have PP, or the best wingers should also be taken into consideration.

I also think Galchenyuk can outproduced DD if he centers lets say Pacioretty and Gallagher. I think it's unfair to say Galchenyuk didn't do **** as a center when we never gave him a real chance (30 games+) to adapt. It took DD 20 games to get it going so saying Galchenyuk didn't do much as a center in the 5-7 games is kinda unfair. As a winger, in the last 2 seasons and playoffs, Galchenyuk is at 0.52ppg while DD is at 0.59. Pretty sure Galchenyuk could easily get that 0.07ppg difference if he plays with 30 goals center and our best RW on the other side.

I'm tired of hearing Galchenyuk is too young, is not ready, is not good enough, never proved anything. I think he's good enough to take a big role as soon as this season. I think he is a special player that will learn, develop properly even if the pressure is big. He's special, like Price is special. I never had a problem to see Price plays with the Habs that young. I always believe he's gonna learn more with the Habs than in Hamilton. What he got to learn was his mental toughness, to face adversity, to play under pressure. Would he be better if we send him back to Hamilton? We never know but I'm just happy that he's this good now. Same should apply to Galchenyuk. I rather see him learn and make mistake as a center, even if it's the top offensive center than see him lose his time on the wings.

Well, my opinions ain't facts and forgive me if I sound like they are.

Ok as far as 'best wingers' go, Pac is undoubtedly our best. How about our best RW ? IMO last season Gionta was our best RW. Gallagher isn't a top line RW nor is anyone else on the Habs, but Gionta could've outproduced Gallagher if he would've played a more offensively oriented role. So, Plek had our best RW.

Last season I disliked how they dealt with the training camp, it seemed like the vets didn't have enough preparation games in preseason to gel and that was pretty apparent, then Pac got injured and DD was in shambles (I don't excuse anything, just stating facts). DD seems to have good chemistry with Pac but little with anyone else, and that is also a problem per say, as he's signed to significant $$ that can't rot in the pressbox. If we want to try Gally centering Pac, we have to find room for DD on the wing of Eller / with Bourque (not a bad fit actually). I hope they try some different things at the camp this preseason. Actually I like this third line of DD - Eller - Bourque but I doubt they can get out of their own zone, so they'd need some sheltering, unless Eller can carry them and boss like he did in the playoffs. DD's boards work isn't really his strenght, and Bourque is Bourque, inconsistent effort.

Also, Gally is what 20 years old ? Still raw and young. That is possible but still I wouldn't hold my breath on that. I hope I'm wrong though. I too want an upgrade at center, don't get me wrong.

oh I'm here mostly to support all Habs players I really dislike how DD's being thrown under the bus and even some fans have anti-DD avatars, so gross.

 

[WeThreeKings]

How about you stay on topic ? This thread is about shootout specialists, not playoffs performers, but I'll bite.

Christensen wasn't in the NHL last year, so your post is irrelevant. Also, Christensen is a LW and you want him at RW, clearly you need more practice at NHL14.

Of course people need to understand that being good at shootout dosen't guarantees you a spot in the NHL, but DD also had 51 points in 58 games, and was ranked 52nd in PO production, not too shabby if you ask me.

Don't ge the hate for the guy, that avatar (makes me puke) and all. That's irrationnal. I wish you'd cheer for another team.

First, how about you switch that avatar for something else, you're painting yourself in the 'hater' corner, no matter your arguments. Second, did DD stole your lunch money and gurlz IRL or what ?

Omg yes. He did. He came to nova Scotia.. Specifically stole my lunch money (let's forget that I would bully him due to insane size mismatch).. Then with his shortness and ugliness he managed to steal some 'gurlz'.

I will never forgive him for that. Instead I painted this avatar.. Specifically designed to turn the stomach of those that are so irrationally in His corner that they get physically ill when he is dissed.

Lastly.. My hater designation is a means to an end to make posters so infuriated that I want to upgraded this faulted player.. That they bully me into cheering for another team than the one i have been watching and want to experience a cup win with.

Maybe I should get physically sick when I see someone defending Desharnais? Maybe I should wish you cheer for another team instead of defending players who are ineffectively occupying the critical points of the roster. Since it seems you would rather defend him than want the improvement required to be a true contending team.

Regular season points due to pp overuse.. Offensive zone starts and soft opposition and top wingers and shootout goals do not impress me one bit. It has been and always will be about the other aspects that a top center needs to make this team more competitive.

Anyways.. I'm done. I'm tired of arguing the same points and beig accosted with the same childish insults (omg did he steel ur gurlz and drink ur orange juice).. Desharnais will prove me right and if he doesn't.. Then we won the cup.. Or got damn close. Hard for me to lose.

 

[Sorinth]

Ok then I'll bite, who's better offensively than DD on the Habs right now, at center ? We can use cold hard facts if you want. And nope, Plekanec leeching off of red hot Kovalev dosen't apply (if DD had a winger with 80+ points you can bet he would've 70+ points).

Eller ? Plek ? Galchenyuk ? Manny ?

Eller isn't a playmaker / hasn't demonstrated the ability to distribute the puck and feed his wingers. Bourque had the worst season of his career with him, and Bourque can score goals, yet both couldn't do **** with each other.

Plek is a two-way center that thinks defense first, and we need one like that.

Galchenyuk hasn't proved anything at center.

Manny is a quality plumber.

So who's better than DD right now ? IMO only Galchenyuk can replace him, and will do in time. Gally is pretty raw though. Do you think he's ready for the spotlight ? Don't you think the pressure can burn him ?

ES scoring per 60 min over the last 2 seasons + playoffs
Galchenyuk: 2.086
Eller: 1.825
Desharnais: 1.818
Plekanec: 1.524

So despite the most favourable role he's actually only the 3rd most productive center. And if we factor in role Plekanec is better as well.

It's hilarious that you want to exclude Plekanec's 69 point season because he was "leeching off" Kovalev. Does that mean we also exclude Desharnais's last 3 seasons because he was leeching off Pacioretty? Not too mention Plekanec has a 70 point season where he led the team in points so had no one to leech off of.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Omg yes. He did. He came to nova Scotia.. Specifically stole my lunch money (let's forget that I would bully him due to insane size mismatch).. Then with his shortness and ugliness he managed to steal some 'gurlz'.

I will never forgive him for that. Instead I painted this avatar.. Specifically designed to turn the stomach of those that are so irrationally in His corner that they get physically ill when he is dissed.

Lastly.. My hater designation is a means to an end to make posters so infuriated that I want to upgraded this faulted player.. That they bully me into cheering for another team than the one i have been watching and want to experience a cup win with.

Maybe I should get physically sick when I see someone defending Desharnais? Maybe I should wish you cheer for another team instead of defending players who are ineffectively occupying the critical points of the roster. Since it seems you would rather defend him than want the improvement required to be a true contending team.

Regular season points due to pp overuse.. Offensive zone starts and soft opposition and top wingers and shootout goals do not impress me one bit. It has been and always will be about the other aspects that a top center needs to make this team more competitive.

Anyways.. I'm done. I'm tired of arguing the same points and beig accosted with the same childish insults (omg did he steel ur gurlz and drink ur orange juice).. Desharnais will prove me right and if he doesn't.. Then we won the cup.. Or got damn close. Hard for me to lose.

FWIW, that's called stacking the odds in your favour.

It's akin to me saying Subban isn't a D-man you win the cup with. I mean, he will prove me right and if he doesn't, we'll win a cup. 29/30 teams lose every year, it's pretty easy to say this when I have 97% chance of being right no? Ignoring the fact that it's a ridiculous statement.

FWIW, not comparing Subban/Price or anyone's impact to that of DDs but just illustrating the odds are kind of in your favor and don't justify much.

What's worse is plenty of good players don't win the cup in their career, are they trash? No, I mean, that would be wrong.

Still, don't get me wrong WTK, DD needs to step up his game anyway even if the success is based on team results, the go to individuals need to steal a few games and Subban and Price did that, our first line didn't last year's playoff.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

ES scoring per 60 min over the last 2 seasons + playoffs
Galchenyuk: 2.086
Eller: 1.825
Desharnais: 1.818
Plekanec: 1.524

So despite the most favourable role he's actually only the 3rd most productive center. And if we factor in role Plekanec is better as well.

It's hilarious that you want to exclude Plekanec's 69 point season because he was "leeching off" Kovalev. Does that mean we also exclude Desharnais's last 3 seasons because he was leeching off Pacioretty? Not too mention Plekanec has a 70 point season where he led the team in points so had no one to leech off of.

Imagine Eller in DD's role, 3.0 per 60 min?

FWIW, that's sarcasm.

 

[MXD]

Carey Price isn't a starting goaltender, and if he is, we will win the Cup.

 

[pine*]

Hey WTK, do you mind if I use your avatar also?

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Carey Price isn't a starting goaltender, and if he is, we will win the Cup.

Pretty much what I'm thinking, guy was our 'starter' for years and we haven't won. When will people realize enough is enough with this guy? "addition by subtraction", he's in the way of Tokarski.

 

[Rosso Scuderia]

Well, my opinions ain't facts and forgive me if I sound like they are.

Ok as far as 'best wingers' go, Pac is undoubtedly our best. How about our best RW ? IMO last season Gionta was our best RW. Gallagher isn't a top line RW nor is anyone else on the Habs, but Gionta could've outproduced Gallagher if he would've played a more offensively oriented role. So, Plek had our best RW.

Last season I disliked how they dealt with the training camp, it seemed like the vets didn't have enough preparation games in preseason to gel and that was pretty apparent, then Pac got injured and DD was in shambles (I don't excuse anything, just stating facts). DD seems to have good chemistry with Pac but little with anyone else, and that is also a problem per say, as he's signed to significant $$ that can't rot in the pressbox. If we want to try Gally centering Pac, we have to find room for DD on the wing of Eller / with Bourque (not a bad fit actually). I hope they try some different things at the camp this preseason. Actually I like this third line of DD - Eller - Bourque but I doubt they can get out of their own zone, so they'd need some sheltering, unless Eller can carry them and boss like he did in the playoffs. DD's boards work isn't really his strenght, and Bourque is Bourque, inconsistent effort.

Also, Gally is what 20 years old ? Still raw and young. That is possible but still I wouldn't hold my breath on that. I hope I'm wrong though. I too want an upgrade at center, don't get me wrong.

oh I'm here mostly to support all Habs players I really dislike how DD's being thrown under the bus and even some fans have anti-DD avatars, so gross.

I also think Bourque-Eller-DD would make one hell of a third line.

I know it sound risky to put Galchenyuk in such important role but like I said, I think he's a special player. He will learn, adapt, progress and develop in high pressure, just like Price did.

Also let's not pretend that DD put the standards really high playing the top offensive center with his .60 point per game ratio. He's NOT that hard to replace. I actually think his production would not dropped that much if he's being used as a winger of a middle 6 line. Pretty sure he would be able to get 40 pts easily in a line like the one you suggested. That's only a 12 pts difference with last season which not much considering the different roles. That would give us one really good third line and give the chance to Galchenyuk the chance to potentially become the center we've been waiting for decades.

 

[Sorinth]

Imagine Eller in DD's role, 3.0 per 60 min?

FWIW, that's sarcasm.

Even if it stayed the same he'd still be the better offensively.

 

[habsfanatics*]

I know most don't like DD, but there's a decent sample size that says he's pretty good in the shootout, wtf is the problem here?

 

[Milhouse40]

Yeah and it's all DD's fault.

But seriously, you're right, but think about it for a second.

You replace DD with someone else that might be slightly better at ES play, but then would be worse than DD in shootouts. In the end, the team might end up with LESS points in the regular season, despite a stronger ES statistical performance (and we all know special teams can tilt the balance just as much as ES play). It's all speculation but without good shootouts the Habs could've been in the Devils shoes last year (plus or minus 10 points and you're out of the playoffs). I doubt a slightly stronger ES play could've been translated in 10 more points in the standings.

Shootouts are a special beast to analyse, how much points do you think DD earned the team (with the help of Price and a few other players as well, but DD stands head and shoulders above the rest of the team in that regard). IMO it shouldn't be regarded too highly, but don't dismiss that fact. Yet another fact in DD's favor, proving he's valuable for the Habs (not saying I wouldn't upgrade for a better top line center though).

Head and shoulders above everybody else.......even if Eller has a higher % of success than him last year? Not his fault if Therrien didn't used him more.

DD didn't earned this team a single points in shootout....mayby 1.....a shootout is 3 shooters and a goalie. It's impossible to say that one player give the win in shootout, goalie always has to stop the puck.....unless you watched hockey on RDS where DD is a good/magician/impressive small player.

He helped for sure to get some points just like his 5on5 game take some away from the team.

Y'know it's all mental at this point. DD KNOWS he needs to shoot the puck more, it's just mentally, he will always be a pass first guy.

The guy can have a hell of a wrister and some incredible dekes, but his split second reaction when he has an oportunity is to pass the puck. You can't teach goal scoring, shootouts isn't the same thing, you can teach players how to shootout.

Seriously...you're wrong....our best goal scorer totally sucked in shootout. Some players are good in actual action, others when they're alone on the ice. Look at Nigel Dawes who was a monster in shootout but not good enough to make the NHL (but he's one of the top player in KHL....was too small for Montreal)

Ok then I'll bite, who's better offensively than DD on the Habs right now, at center ? We can use cold hard facts if you want. And nope, Plekanec leeching off of red hot Kovalev dosen't apply (if DD had a winger with 80+ points you can bet he would've 70+ points).

Eller ? Plek ? Galchenyuk ? Manny ?

Eller isn't a playmaker / hasn't demonstrated the ability to distribute the puck and feed his wingers. Bourque had the worst season of his career with him, and Bourque can score goals, yet both couldn't do **** with each other.

Plek is a two-way center that thinks defense first, and we need one like that.

Galchenyuk hasn't proved anything at center.

Manny is a quality plumber.

So who's better than DD right now ? IMO only Galchenyuk can replace him, and will do in time. Gally is pretty raw though. Do you think he's ready for the spotlight ? Don't you think the pressure can burn him ?

Galchy's performance in the PO tells me he can handle the pressure. I know let Galchenyuk develop into a grinding center/winger for 2 more years, that kind of thinking worked out really well with Eller.

 

[MXD]

Head and shoulders above everybody else.......even if Eller has a higher % of success than him last year? Not his fault if Therrien didn't used him more.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=89456379&postcount=40

 

[pine*]

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=89456379&postcount=40

5/7
3/4
0/0

Gee, I wonder which one looks out of place.

But yes, head and shoulders, eh

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Omg yes. He did. He came to nova Scotia.. Specifically stole my lunch money (let's forget that I would bully him due to insane size mismatch).. Then with his shortness and ugliness he managed to steal some 'gurlz'.

I will never forgive him for that. Instead I painted this avatar.. Specifically designed to turn the stomach of those that are so irrationally in His corner that they get physically ill when he is dissed.

Lastly.. My hater designation is a means to an end to make posters so infuriated that I want to upgraded this faulted player.. That they bully me into cheering for another team than the one i have been watching and want to experience a cup win with.

Maybe I should get physically sick when I see someone defending Desharnais? Maybe I should wish you cheer for another team instead of defending players who are ineffectively occupying the critical points of the roster. Since it seems you would rather defend him than want the improvement required to be a true contending team.

Regular season points due to pp overuse.. Offensive zone starts and soft opposition and top wingers and shootout goals do not impress me one bit. It has been and always will be about the other aspects that a top center needs to make this team more competitive.

Anyways.. I'm done. I'm tired of arguing the same points and beig accosted with the same childish insults (omg did he steel ur gurlz and drink ur orange juice).. Desharnais will prove me right and if he doesn't.. Then we won the cup.. Or got damn close. Hard for me to lose.

Stop beating around the bush and tell us how you really feel.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Even if it stayed the same he'd still be the better offensively.

So if it stayed the same there would be no point in changing roles.

Besides, how about last 3 years? too far back?

 

[MXD]

5/7
3/4
0/0

Gee, I wonder which one looks out of place

Who knows, Bournival could've been 82/82 ?!?!?!

Besides, there are usually at least three shooters in the shootout.

Putting in Desharnais and Eller is totally in totally possible, so I don't exactly see why Eller in means DD out, unless one is purposefully trying to show that 2 > 3.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

I know most don't like DD, but there's a decent sample size that says he's pretty good in the shootout, wtf is the problem here?

It's DD.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Who knows, Bournival could've been 82/82 ?!?!?!

83/82 most likely...underrating everyone but DD...as usual.

 

[pine*]

83/82 most likely...underrating everyone but DD...as usual.

I see you're still having trouble with your basic statistics

Who knows, Bournival could've been 82/82 ?!?!?!

Besides, there are usually at least three shooters in the shootout.

Putting in Desharnais and Eller is totally in totally possible, so I don't exactly see why Eller in means DD out, unless one is purposefully trying to show that 2 > 3.

Statistical probabilities dictate otherwise, thank you. If the shootout is the only reason why DD is on the team, then might as well pickup them classic shooters e.g. Erik Christensen amirite?!?!?!

 

[habitue*]

Lirl.

Let's sign Erik Christensen.. He can play on the top line in Gallaghers spot

Gotta have those shootout specialists.

I'll give ya a hint what all those centers do in the play offs that Desharnais doesn't (produce).

As usual. you are not responding properly to an answer to one of your numerous previous spot. You were saying that teams with good centers rarely have to go to shootout. I proved you wrong. But you are unable to admit that you are wrong. NEVER.

 

[S Bah]

DD has also shown he's a very capable shooter during game situations, accuracy in last seconds of the game. (last year with under 10 seconds left) That's a talent in itself, besides making tricky passes that create goals. Team effort has always been a trademark of the Habs teams that are playoff winners, a habit that helped in job situations through the yrs. for my crews and myself. Imitating that type of unity has helped in most life situations for this poster and most likely many small businesses. Scorers don't always create their own space, it's usually a combination of efforts by all the players in unison, at least from what I've observed over decades of watching the Habs teams that won numerous SC Titles.

Winning organizations almost always have good character & leadership along with very good interpersonal skills, which make very good teamwork a key to success.