Dave Hakstol Part III

[SolidSnakeUS]

Folin falls all over the ice on his own. Playing him is like playing hot potato with a live grenade.

 

[Lurch]

I will say it again...

FIRE HAK AND HIRE HARTLEY

LETS SEE WHAT THIS TEAM REALLY HAVE IN THE GUTS.

If they still suck after 1 year...remodel

The fact that a Jack Adams and Stanley Cup coach is sitting in Russia available while we have Hak behind the bench in Philly is just absurd. I don't know what Hexy is thinking.

 

[Hurricane28]

Find a young, progressive thinking coach with an aggressive system. No dinosaurs of the previous era.

 

[hatcher]

Find a young, progressive thinking coach with an aggressive system. No dinosaurs of the previous era.

Coaching in hockey isn't like football. The old coaches can get the point across better.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

Find a young, progressive thinking coach with an aggressive system. No dinosaurs of the previous era.

Knoblauch is only 40 years old. He won a championship in the OHL the year before we got him and McDavid credits him with being the player he is today.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

The fact that a Jack Adams and Stanley Cup coach is sitting in Russia available while we have Hak behind the bench in Philly is just absurd. I don't know what Hexy is thinking.

The same Hartley whose most recent NHL stint in Calgary was 4 seasons, 3 of which he both missed the playoffs & was under .500? That’s worse than what Hakstol has done.

 

[deadhead]

Folin falls all over the ice on his own. Playing him is like playing hot potato with a live grenade.

Voracek falls down, "crickets." Folin falls down, "he can't play."
A half dozen players have spun out, I think they're just doing a bad job on maintaining ice early in the season.

Folin: 0.91 pp/60, Corsi 54.39%, CFrel +2.04, xGF 62.70%, xGFrel +16.76, HDCF/CA 12/7.
A D-man can't play much better than that!
Now, is it sustainable? Doubtful, SSS effect.
But you can't blame Folin for this team's struggles.

 

[hatcher]

The same Hartley whose most recent NHL stint in Calgary was 4 seasons, 3 of which he both missed the playoffs & was under .500? That’s worse than what Hakstol has done.

That team didn't have much though.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Voracek falls down, "crickets." Folin falls down, "he can't play."
A half dozen players have spun out, I think they're just doing a bad job on maintaining ice early in the season.

Folin: 0.91 pp/60, Corsi 54.39%, CFrel +2.04, xGF 62.70%, xGFrel +16.76, HDCF/CA 12/7.
A D-man can't play much better than that!
Now, is it sustainable? Doubtful, SSS effect.
But you can't blame Folin for this team's struggles.

Why, it's almost like Voracek does a to make up for falling that Folin doesn't do.


It's that "context" thing you use flexibly.

 

[deadhead]

When Voracek puts up the kind of numbers Folin is currently doing, I'll praise him.
Does that mean I think Folin is a good player? Of course not, but he's doing a solid job in his role while Voracek is a "fail" so far in his role.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

That team didn't have much though.

His last season he went 35-40-7 with:
Gaudreau & Monahan, and a D consisting of Giordano, Hamilton, Brodie, & Wideman. Their 2nd level forwards weren’t bad, either. Backlund had 47 pts; Colborne 44; even Bennett had 18 goals/36 pts & Frolik put up 32 pts in 64 games. Goaltending very similar to what the Flyers got last year.

 

[hatcher]

His last season he went 35-40-7 with:
Gaudreau & Monahan, and a D consisting of Giordano, Hamilton, Brodie, & Wideman. Their 2nd level forwards weren’t bad, either. Backlund had 47 pts; Colborne 44; even Bennett had 18 goals/36 pts & Frolik put up 32 pts in 64 games. Goaltending very similar to what the Flyers got last year.

Young bunch that weren't at the level they are now though except girodano. That core has done shit also. Two way missing in that group.

 

[deadhead]

The split here is not between those who think Hakstol is a great coach and those who think Hakstol is a terrible coach.
Rather, the split is between those who think Hakstol is your generic coach and players are as much or more to blame and those who think Hakstol is a terrible coach and their favorites are blameless and would win a Cup with a good coach.

Giroux was a great player in his prime 22-26 , but despite a nice bounce back last season, at 31 he's not an elite player. He still has offensive chops, but the legs are going and he's becoming a defensive liability who needs to be sheltered. He was exposed in last year's playoffs. No injury excuse.

Voracek has had one decent playoff series, in 2011-12 on a loaded team, since then, 19g, [5x5] 1-2 3, 0.75 pp/60, CF 50.69, CFrel 4.15, GF/GA 3/12, xGF 42.98, xGFrel 1.35. That's below average for a 3rd line forward.

Simmonds 24g 1-4 5, CF 42.88%, CFrel -3.89, GF/GA 8/17, xGF 35.55, xGFrel -7.4. He has always struggled in the playoffs.

And that's the problem in a nutshell, three of your top 4 forwards simply can't match up against top talent, especially in the playoffs.
So Hakstol or no Hakstol, no coach is going to transform these aging players into elite performers.
Hextall should have blown it up two years ago and accelerated the rebuild.

Now I'm sure I'll here the excuses galore, but these are your top veteran forwards, if they can't carry a team in the playoffs, time to move on.
The future lies with Patrick, TK, et al.

 

[Tripod]

Giroux is 30, not 31. Another lie.

Not to mention, for a few years a bunch of us have been saying that G and Jake would play the Hossa/Williams like role when were hopefully contenders.

 

[freakydallas13]

Voracek falls down, "crickets." Folin falls down, "he can't play."

You live with Voracek falling down sometimes because he is skilled enough to do things like put up 5 points in a game. When Folin starts leading this team in ES points, he too will be given slack for blowing a tire.

 

[deadhead]

G yes for the Hossa role (31 in January, HR lists him as 31 this season).
I expect G to stay, both due to his NTC and as the spiritual leader of this team.
Just have to give him a lesser role and protect him from matchups against top lines.

Voracek has been a playoff nonperformer, he's expendable if the right deal comes along. He's just not essential to this team's future, and is the most tradeable commodity on the team (other than the "untouchables").

Couts, even if he can't stay 100% healthy, has value as a player who can fit anywhere in the lineup, his knee will dictate the terms of his extension in a couple years but not his future here. At worst, he slides back to a 3C role.

Simmonds is as good as gone, love his "grit," but there's no place on the future Flyers other than a 4th line/PP specialist, and obviously he won't accept the contract that would come with that role, nor should he.

 

[Beef Invictus]

The split here is not between those who think Hakstol is a great coach and those who think Hakstol is a terrible coach.
Rather, the split is between those who think Hakstol is your generic coach and players are as much or more to blame and those who think Hakstol is a terrible coach and their favorites are blameless and would win a Cup with a good coach.

Giroux was a great player in his prime 22-26 , but despite a nice bounce back last season, at 31 he's not an elite player. He still has offensive chops, but the legs are going and he's becoming a defensive liability who needs to be sheltered. He was exposed in last year's playoffs. No injury excuse.

Voracek has had one decent playoff series, in 2011-12 on a loaded team, since then, 19g, [5x5] 1-2 3, 0.75 pp/60, CF 50.69, CFrel 4.15, GF/GA 3/12, xGF 42.98, xGFrel 1.35. That's below average for a 3rd line forward.

Simmonds 24g 1-4 5, CF 42.88%, CFrel -3.89, GF/GA 8/17, xGF 35.55, xGFrel -7.4. He has always struggled in the playoffs.

And that's the problem in a nutshell, three of your top 4 forwards simply can't match up against top talent, especially in the playoffs.
So Hakstol or no Hakstol, no coach is going to transform these aging players into elite performers.
Hextall should have blown it up two years ago and accelerated the rebuild.

Now I'm sure I'll here the excuses galore, but these are your top veteran forwards, if they can't carry a team in the playoffs, time to move on.
The future lies with Patrick, TK, et al.

How can you not consider him great? I ask you to name a single flaw and you can't. You consider him to be flawless.

 

[deadhead]

No, you just like staying stupid things to irritate me.
Unfortunately, you can't slap an internet board mosquito.

 

[Beef Invictus]

No, you just like staying stupid things to irritate me.
Unfortunately, you can't slap an internet board mosquito.

Name a flaw if you don't consider him flawless.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

Firing Hakstol to replace him with Bob Hartley would be terrible. That’s not even a defense of Hakstol who’s garbage & a dinosaur himself too. Bring in someone who knows what works in 2018 not 1999.

 

[hatcher]

Firing Hakstol to replace him with Bob Hartley would be terrible. That’s not even a defense of Hakstol who’s garbage & a dinosaur himself too. Bring in someone who knows what works in 2018 not 1999.

Defensive hockey is whats winning still and Hartley love agressive push the play style.

 

[deadhead]

Name a flaw if you don't consider him flawless.

He needs better facial expressions, you know, get red in the face, show "real man" intensity, and so on.

 

[magnumpi]

The split here is not between those who think Hakstol is a great coach and those who think Hakstol is a terrible coach.
Rather, the split is between those who think Hakstol is your generic coach and players are as much or more to blame and those who think Hakstol is a terrible coach and their favorites are blameless and would win a Cup with a good coach.

Giroux was a great player in his prime 22-26 , but despite a nice bounce back last season, at 31 he's not an elite player. He still has offensive chops, but the legs are going and he's becoming a defensive liability who needs to be sheltered. He was exposed in last year's playoffs. No injury excuse.

Voracek has had one decent playoff series, in 2011-12 on a loaded team, since then, 19g, [5x5] 1-2 3, 0.75 pp/60, CF 50.69, CFrel 4.15, GF/GA 3/12, xGF 42.98, xGFrel 1.35. That's below average for a 3rd line forward.

Simmonds 24g 1-4 5, CF 42.88%, CFrel -3.89, GF/GA 8/17, xGF 35.55, xGFrel -7.4. He has always struggled in the playoffs.

And that's the problem in a nutshell, three of your top 4 forwards simply can't match up against top talent, especially in the playoffs.
So Hakstol or no Hakstol, no coach is going to transform these aging players into elite performers.
Hextall should have blown it up two years ago and accelerated the rebuild.

Now I'm sure I'll here the excuses galore, but these are your top veteran forwards, if they can't carry a team in the playoffs, time to move on.
The future lies with Patrick, TK, et al.

What about people who think

1) Hakstol is a terrible coach.
2) G, V, Simmonds are past their prime and would like V and Simmonds traded.
PErsonally I like G in the Lanny Mcdonald 1989 calgary flame role.

Just because someone doesn't like Hakstol means they think those veterans are great and simply need a good coach to win the cup.

 

[hatcher]

What about people who think

1) Hakstol is a terrible coach.
2) G, V, Simmonds are past their prime and would like V and Simmonds traded.
PErsonally I like G in the Lanny Mcdonald 1989 calgary flame role.

Just because someone doesn't like Hakstol means they think those veterans are great and simply need a good coach to win the cup.

The coach will go then we'll see how it goes. I'll admit I'm wrong about this team is a new coach gets it going but I haven't been wrong yet about them and hopefully we trade and get some new players to watch instead of this boring top players. They should want to leave Philly for a chance since there is no chance.

 

[Beef Invictus]

He needs better facial expressions, you know, get red in the face, show "real man" intensity, and so on.

So his actual coaching is flawless?