Datsyuk vs Fedorov

[Sasha Orlov]

Now that is hilarious. Lidstrom fighting for Norris trophies against the greatest crop of d-men playing at the same time that we have ever seen, but Federov would have snagged one.

Fedorov was playing D in 1996, Lidstrom did not win a Norris until 2001 lmfao

Just say you didn’t watch these players, it’s fine

 

[authentic]

Fedorov was playing D in 1996, Lidstrom did not win a Norris until 2001 lmfao

Just say you didn’t watch these players, it’s fine

He probably should have though. Also didn’t Scotty Bowman put Fedorov on defense as a punishment for coasting? There’s no chance in hell he would’ve won a Norris trophy playing defense.

 

[MuckOG]

Why do people pretend it’s not a close comparison I wonder? Strange how underrated Datsyuk is

I don't think Datsyuk is underrated, I think its Federov who is underrated. Federov was an absolute beast in his prime, he could do it all. Datsyuk had the better mitts and was a great player, for sure, but I would take a prime Federov over a prime Datsyuk.

 

[Sasha Orlov]

He probably should have though. Also didn’t Scotty Bowman put Fedorov on defense as a punishment for coasting? There’s no chance in hell he would’ve won a Norris trophy playing defense.

No?

ESPN.com: NHL - Position switch a sign of greatness, not disrespect

 

[I Hate Blake Coleman]

Ya I am just saying I don't see how Fedorov was so much better in the playoffs. They produced around ppg. Fedorov was on much better teams that went a lot further. He only once led his team in scoring on those runs.

Actual results matter though. It's one thing to pace for 20 points in the post-season. It's another thing to actually do it.

 

[Voight]

Fedorov will never get his flowers since he played on a really good team that happened to have one of the best centers of all time.

 

[Toby91ca]

Ya I am just saying I don't see how Fedorov was so much better in the playoffs. They produced around ppg. Fedorov was on much better teams that went a lot further. He only once led his team in scoring on those runs.

My assessment of Fedorov being better doesn't factor in playoffs, that said, you seem to suggest they relatively produced the same in the playoffs, both around ppg. Maybe I'm misinterpreting, but I don't see 113pts in 157 games being on the same level as 176pts in 183 games. I recognize this is the cumulative impact of few games each year over many years....which is why I don't place a ton of weight on it, but at the same time, it's a pretty significant difference, so at a min, I wouldn't use to suggest they were fairly consistent.

 

[dalewood12]

Federov - peak
Tie for longevity

 

[DFC]

Fedorov was playing D in 1996, Lidstrom did not win a Norris until 2001 lmfao

Just say you didn’t watch these players, it’s fine

Watched them both throughout their primes, Fedorov more than Datsyuk. I also remember the reason why Fedorov spent some time on D was because, paraphrasing/but almost quoting Scotty Bowman here: "He wasn't getting anything done at Forward."

I feel like we remember Fedorov with rose-colored glasses. He was arguably one of the most skilled players ever to play the game, but he was also very frustrating to watch for large stretches of his career. He left a lot of untapped potential on the table, IMO.

To me, Datsyuk was a top-10 player for a lot longer, although Fedorov's peak was undeniably higher.

I feel like this would be pretty close among Wings fans. Depends on what you value, really.

 

[DFC]

He probably should have though. Also didn’t Scotty Bowman put Fedorov on defense as a punishment for coasting? There’s no chance in hell he would’ve won a Norris trophy playing defense.

This is exactly what happened. Nobody remembers it now, but that's kind of the story of Fedorov's career. He would go long, long stretches of barely giving a fxxx, and then turn it on for a game or two to remind you he was probably the most skilled player in the league. Then there were the embarrassing dives that it seemed even his own teammates weren't a fan of. I remember talk of "can't help his pain tolerance."

 

[redwings25]

He probably should have though. Also didn’t Scotty Bowman put Fedorov on defense as a punishment for coasting? There’s no chance in hell he would’ve won a Norris trophy playing defense.

They put him on d for signing a offer sheat qith someone else. And he played d like a all star.

 

[DFC]

They put him on d for signing a offer sheat qith someone else. And he played d like a all star.

They didn't. Bowman put him on D because he was having a rough go of it at forward that year. He did play very well at D, but it was 100% a wake up call move at the time.

 

[MacMacandBarbie]

Fedorov was playing D in 1996, Lidstrom did not win a Norris until 2001 lmfao

Just say you didn’t watch these players, it’s fine

Isn’t that the whole point of my post? Just ask for clarification if you’re confused. Lidstrom not being able to win a Norris until 2001 despite being runner up, kinda shows how difficult it was to win a Norris. Seeing the names he lost to sort of confirms my point.

Federov would not have even sniffed a nomination if he played defense, sorry.

 

[Sasha Orlov]

Isn’t that the whole point of my post? Just ask for clarification if you’re confused. Lidstrom not being able to win a Norris until 2001 despite being runner up, kinda shows how difficult it was to win a Norris. Seeing the names he lost to sort of confirms my point.

Federov would not have even sniffed a nomination if he played defense, sorry.

Weird considering their coach, Scotty Bowman, said that during Fedorov’s 6 week stint on D in 96-97 he was “the best defenseman in the league”

I’m sure 15 years of experience as a D wouldn’t have made him even better

 

[norrisnick]

Watched them both throughout their primes, Fedorov more than Datsyuk. I also remember the reason why Fedorov spent some time on D was because, paraphrasing/but almost quoting Scotty Bowman here: "He wasn't getting anything done at Forward."

I feel like we remember Fedorov with rose-colored glasses. He was arguably one of the most skilled players ever to play the game, but he was also very frustrating to watch for large stretches of his career. He left a lot of untapped potential on the table, IMO.

To me, Datsyuk was a top-10 player for a lot longer, although Fedorov's peak was undeniably higher.

I feel like this would be pretty close among Wings fans. Depends on what you value, really.

It would skew even further into Fedorov's favor.

 

[MacMacandBarbie]

Weird considering their coach, Scotty Bowman, said that during Fedorov’s 6 week stint on D in 96-97 he was “the best defenseman in the league”

I’m sure 15 years of experience as a D wouldn’t have made him even better

Ahh yes, Scotty Bowman, now that is a stand up guy who would never lie or deceive to protect his players’ egos.

 

[norrisnick]

Ahh yes, Scotty Bowman, now that is a stand up guy who would never lie or deceive to protect his players’ egos.

Ah yes, the noted player-coddler Scotty Bowman. Always looking out to make sure there are no hard feelings...

 

[MacMacandBarbie]

Watched them both throughout their primes, Fedorov more than Datsyuk. I also remember the reason why Fedorov spent some time on D was because, paraphrasing/but almost quoting Scotty Bowman here: "He wasn't getting anything done at Forward."

I feel like we remember Fedorov with rose-colored glasses. He was arguably one of the most skilled players ever to play the game, but he was also very frustrating to watch for large stretches of his career. He left a lot of untapped potential on the table, IMO.

To me, Datsyuk was a top-10 player for a lot longer, although Fedorov's peak was undeniably higher.

I feel like this would be pretty close among Wings fans. Depends on what you value, really.

Federov is one of those players who got immortalized on here much like forberg is being in another thread I recently hopped out of, and it has never really made sense.

You’ll hear people say crazy things like he had raw skill that rivaled a generational player or something. He was never the best player in the league. Not even 94.

The 94 season probably did it, and people are using it as a separator, which is silly because datsyuk easily matched that in 2008, and finished the year with a fantastic playoff run that ended in a cup.

Ah yes, the noted player-coddler Scotty Bowman. Always looking out to make sure there are no hard feelings...

We are talking about Scotty Bowman’s media relationship. The guy has lied to protect his players, and certainly has made bias statements that coaches do for their players all the time.

 

[DFC]

Federov is one of those players who got immortalized on here much like forberg is being in another thread I recently hopped out of, and it has never really made sense.

You’ll hear people say crazy things like he had raw skill that rivaled a generational player or something. He was never the best player in the league. Not even 94.

The 94 season probably did it, and people are using it as a separator, which is silly because datsyuk easily matched that in 2008, and finished the year with a fantastic playoff run that ended in a cup.


We are talking about Scotty Bowman’s media relationship. The guy has lied to protect his players, and certainly has made bias statements that coaches do for their players all the time.

As critical as I am of Fedorov, I'm also one of those who believes that, on raw skill, he was pretty close to generational. My issue is always that how rarely he actually brought all those skills to the table.

 

[MacMacandBarbie]

As critical as I am of Fedorov, I'm also one of those who believes that, on raw skill, he was pretty close to generational. My issue is always that how rarely he actually brought all those skills to the table.

I think the same, he was close. I think the same of datsyuk, however. I found both of them to be lazy at times as well as injury prone so they seemed unwillingly to consistently get chippy.

These players had similar impacts on both sides of the ice, just went about it differently. Federov legacy is bigger now, but give it 10 years and Datsyuk may be right there with him. Need just a little more time for kids to get a little older who remember datsyuk being on the cover of NHL and practicing his deke in the game.

 

[CanadienShark]

Fedorov no question.

 

[WingsFan95]

Datsyuk and a a disclaimer that Fedorov Wings jersey was the first I ever got and one of my all-time favourites even know I learned more about him as I got older.

Anywho the knock on Fedorov should be that like Brett Hull he has a pretty ridiculous peak stretch but the more you extend the window the worse it gets and THEN you start accounting for the support in terms he played for. I mean, yes he was one of the best players on SOME of those teams but it's really hard to evaluate overall when they become so ostensibly stacked.

If you're asking me on an even level if I take 10 years of Fedorov or 10 years of Datsyuk I'm going Datsyuk. Also how his 98 season turned out has to be considered as it's fairly different from Datsyuk being way older opting to leave to go home. Fedorov essentially had 92-96 as 5 top level seasons and if you count 02-03 as has been mentioned many times a contract year he all of a sudden seemed to put up better numbers. That 92-96 stretch includes a shortened season which ultimately saw a sweep in the Final where on paper he looks like the only guy who tried but of his team leading 5 points and 3 goals, 2 of those goals came in complete garbage time down 0-5 in the 3rd. What I'm saying is before the team went into stacked mode though still with Coffey and Lidstrom, he wasn't exactly this legendary force.

Datsyuk carried his team in a lot of seasons with Zetterberg having nagging injuries and Lidstrom aging. I remember those teams well since I saw them live many times and let me tell you Datsyuk was such an anchor those would have been struggling years without him. And I really don't think we have the 08-09 success without him either despite Zetterberg getting the Smythe in 08.

Again, here's what I focus on with Dats: Much longer period of consistency and reliability, elevating the team.

Fedorov was clearly the more talented player but was more a singular force that at his peak was one of the greatest of all time, as a singular force. Datsyuk was just as reliable defensively but obviously not as much offensively though still top level.

I also think there's something to be said how Datsyuk might get his jersey retired whereas Fedorov never will. And let's not beat around the bush how post Wings, Fedorov didn't have much of a career.

 

[norrisnick]

Datsyuk and a a disclaimer that Fedorov Wings jersey was the first I ever got and one of my all-time favourites even know I learned more about him as I got older.

Anywho the knock on Fedorov should be that like Brett Hull he has a pretty ridiculous peak stretch but the more you extend the window the worse it gets and THEN you start accounting for the support in terms he played for. I mean, yes he was one of the best players on SOME of those teams but it's really hard to evaluate overall when they become so ostensibly stacked.

If you're asking me on an even level if I take 10 years of Fedorov or 10 years of Datsyuk I'm going Datsyuk. Also how his 98 season turned out has to be considered as it's fairly different from Datsyuk being way older opting to leave to go home. Fedorov essentially had 92-96 as 5 top level seasons and if you count 02-03 as has been mentioned many times a contract year he all of a sudden seemed to put up better numbers. That 92-96 stretch includes a shortened season which ultimately saw a sweep in the Final where on paper he looks like the only guy who tried but of his team leading 5 points and 3 goals, 2 of those goals came in complete garbage time down 0-5 in the 3rd. What I'm saying is before the team went into stacked mode though still with Coffey and Lidstrom, he wasn't exactly this legendary force.

Datsyuk carried his team in a lot of seasons with Zetterberg having nagging injuries and Lidstrom aging. I remember those teams well since I saw them live many times and let me tell you Datsyuk was such an anchor those would have been struggling years without him. And I really don't think we have the 08-09 success without him either despite Zetterberg getting the Smythe in 08.

Again, here's what I focus on with Dats: Much longer period of consistency and reliability, elevating the team.

Fedorov was clearly the more talented player but was more a singular force that at his peak was one of the greatest of all time, as a singular force. Datsyuk was just as reliable defensively but obviously not as much offensively though still top level.

I also think there's something to be said how Datsyuk might get his jersey retired whereas Fedorov never will. And let's not beat around the bush how post Wings, Fedorov didn't have much of a career.

More often than not, if you swap names in this post it becomes more accurate.

 

[authentic]

I think the same, he was close. I think the same of datsyuk, however. I found both of them to be lazy at times as well as injury prone so they seemed unwillingly to consistently get chippy.

These players had similar impacts on both sides of the ice, just went about it differently. Federov legacy is bigger now, but give it 10 years and Datsyuk may be right there with him. Need just a little more time for kids to get a little older who remember datsyuk being on the cover of NHL and practicing his deke in the game.

Don’t recall laziness ever being an issue for Dastyuk, he was always known for his effort and consistency.

 

[Albatros]

Puck handling, puck protection and overall defensive play go to Dastyuk I would say

Datsyuk was a smart player defensively and great at stealing the puck, but overall his defense was rather mediocre to weak in many aspects. Fedorov could have become a fairly decent defenseman full time, better than a Phil Housley.