Confirmed with Link: Datsyuk Leaving Wings

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TheRatPoisoner

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...found this on the Trade Rumors board...

According to the Sportfact website , Datsyuk agreed to sign a two year deal with SKA and it will be officially announced after the world championships

http://www.sportfakt.ru/hockey/61707/


does KH have to wait until the SCF is over before he can trade the $7.5M cap hit to AZI ?

According to folks on this thread here, some people say yes, some people say no:

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1177863

Not completely sure, good question.
 

Number1RedWingsFan52

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...found this on the Trade Rumors board...

According to the Sportfact website , Datsyuk agreed to sign a two year deal with SKA and it will be officially announced after the world championships

http://www.sportfakt.ru/hockey/61707/


does KH have to wait until the SCF is over before he can trade the $7.5M cap hit to AZI ?

Since neither Detroit nor Arizona are in the cup finals i would think if Holland can make a deal either to Arizona or Carolina i would think he could do it now. But i could be mistaken i doubt that he has to wait until the SCF are over.
 

Frk It

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Since neither Detroit nor Arizona are in the cup finals i would think if Holland can make a deal either to Arizona or Carolina i would think he could do it now. But i could be mistaken i doubt that he has to wait until the SCF are over.

Cannot make any trades inbetween the Trade Deadline and the Draft.
 

njx9

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I don't get why he'd sign now... He kind of screwed us on the initial decision to leave, but I could live with that. It's his career and he signed the offer he was given. Whatever. But signing with the KHL in mid-May and basically screwing us out of getting out from under his cap (I imagine any trade at this point becomes obvious cap circumvention, but hopefully I'm wrong)? Either KH was dead serious that he wasn't going to move him, or this was a bit of a dick move. I hope I'm wrong, and I'm just misunderstanding some of the circumstances here...
 

Frk It

Mo Seider Less Problems
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Not true at all. Deadline just means players traded afterwards are ineligible for the playoffs.

I suppose maybe it's possible, but when's the last time it happened?

Kind of seems like it defeats the purpose of having a trade deadline.
 

Chris 84

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I suppose maybe it's possible, but when's the last time it happened?

Kind of seems like it defeats the purpose of having a trade deadline.

it is not unusual for trades to be made before the draft but after teams are out of the playoffs.
 

Reddwit

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I suspect that's more a half truth than anything else. Basically saying: Datsyuk has not officially engaged in negotiations with anyone yet. Unofficially? That's harder to say. I bet he's poking around a bit, figuring out what would fit. And I imagine every KHL team is lining up to offer him whatever they can.

Yeah, or he has a handshake agreement with SKA and someone in the SKA front office was so excited about the prospect of the legend joining the team (and hopefully the marketing/profit boost that would mean) that he couldn't keep his mouth shut about it. Wouldn't surprise me. :laugh:
 

Boomhower

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Is anyone sure Detroit will even be stuck with this 'cap penalty' ?

This is uncharted territory to my knowledge. This is a player who has defected the team and defected the league without permission or legal merritt according to the IIHF transfer agreement. Detroit (or any NHL team) will not be paying this man a red cent.

If this league has even a half competent commissioner he will identify Detroit as the victims and rectify the situation entirely. Everyone knows Detroit desperately wants Datsyuk to return and honor his contract. There is no shady cap eluding games going on here by the team.

With Kovalcuk NJ was only so happy to agree and allowed him out of his contract. It was mutual. Hence the cap penalty and draft pick sanctions.

Tim Thomas took a year away from hockey and did not play professional hockey in any IIHF league when BOS/NYI got stuck with his hit.

When Radulov abandoned Nashville mid contract. His contract was put on hold and he was not allowed to return to the NHL until he honored the remainder of his contract.

Since Datsyuk is not retiring from hockey and abandoning a contract mid term (contrary to transfer agreement). Just because he signed an over 35 contract, why shouldn't his contract be put on hold, so he can never return to the NHL until he honors his abandoned agreement. I know he is old and not coming back. However he is not retiring and could technically return.

I just think the original Radulov case is the closest thing to this case. The only difference is that Datsyuk is on an over 35 contract. Which shouldn't matter if he is still playing proffessioanl hockey next year in an IIHF sanctioned league.
 
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I mean, what is location, really
Is anyone sure Detroit will even be stuck with this 'cap penalty' ?

This is uncharted territory to my knowledge. This is a player who has defected the team and defected the league without permission or legal merritt according to the IIHF transfer agreement. Detroit (or any NHL team) will not be paying this man a red cent.

If this league has even a half competent commissioner he will identify Detroit as the victims and rectify the situation entirely. Everyone knows Detroit desperately wants Datsyuk to return and honor his contract. There is no shady cap eluding games going on here by the team.

With Kovalcuk NJ was only so happy to agree and allowed him out of his contract. It was mutual. Hence the cap penalty and draft pick sanctions.

Tim Thomas took a year away from hockey and did not play professional hockey in any IIHF league when BOS/NYI got stuck with his hit.

When Radulov abandoned Nashville mid contract. His contract was put on hold and he was not allowed to return to the NHL until he honored the remainder of his contract.

Since Datsyuk is not retiring from hockey and abandoning a contract mid term (contrary to transfer agreement). Just because he signed an over 35 contract, why shouldn't his contract be put on hold, so he can never return to the NHL until he honors his abandoned agreement. I know he is old and not coming back. However he is not retiring and could technically return.

I just think the original Radulov case is the closest thing to this case. The only difference is that Datsyuk is on an over 35 contract. Which shouldn't matter if he is still playing proffessioanl hockey next year in an IIHF sanctioned league.
Datsyuk will almost certainly officially retire from the NHL. Players on 35+ contracts who do that stick their teams with the cap hit. Them's just the breaks. There likely will be no IIHF or legal argument to make. The contract/money won't be the issue (if you don't report, you don't earn), but instead the league's policy on 35+ contracts.
 

Ezekial

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Is anyone sure Detroit will even be stuck with this 'cap penalty' ?

This is uncharted territory to my knowledge. This is a player who has defected the team and defected the league without permission or legal merritt according to the IIHF transfer agreement. Detroit (or any NHL team) will not be paying this man a red cent.

If this league has even a half competent commissioner he will identify Detroit as the victims and rectify the situation entirely. Everyone knows Detroit desperately wants Datsyuk to return and honor his contract. There is no shady cap eluding games going on here by the team.

With Kovalcuk NJ was only so happy to agree and allowed him out of his contract. It was mutual. Hence the cap penalty and draft pick sanctions.

Tim Thomas took a year away from hockey and did not play professional hockey in any IIHF league when BOS/NYI got stuck with his hit.

When Radulov abandoned Nashville mid contract. His contract was put on hold and he was not allowed to return to the NHL until he honored the remainder of his contract.

Since Datsyuk is not retiring from hockey and abandoning a contract mid term (contrary to transfer agreement). Just because he signed an over 35 contract, why shouldn't his contract be put on hold, so he can never return to the NHL until he honors his abandoned agreement. I know he is old and not coming back. However he is not retiring and could technically return.

I just think the original Radulov case is the closest thing to this case. The only difference is that Datsyuk is on an over 35 contract. Which shouldn't matter if he is still playing proffessioanl hockey next year in an IIHF sanctioned league.

It's 100% certain that a team will be paying Datsyuk's 7.5 million dollar cap hit next season.

Why would they make an exception? The bolded is the only difference that matters - that's the rule. They want to prevent contracts to old players that can be canceled with no penalty.
 

Reality Check

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I'm honestly not expecting him back.

The guy was instrumental in helping Detroit win a pair of cups and is in the twilight of his career. Fine by me.
 

Boomhower

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Datsyuk will almost certainly officially retire from the NHL. Players on 35+ contracts who do that stick their teams with the cap hit. Them's just the breaks. There likely will be no IIHF or legal argument to make. The contract/money won't be the issue (if you don't report, you don't earn), but instead the league's policy on 35+ contracts.

Yeah I mean the concept of that retirement is false considering he would be playing professional hockey in an IIHF league and collecting serious coin in the process.

By this theory signing any player of Russian descent to a long term contract is attached with far greater risks. As at any moment he could declare himself 'retired from his NHL contract' and go play in the KHL for virtually the same amount (if not more) than he was making in the NHL.

I'm just saying there is a commissioner for a reason. He can step in and make rulings when there is unprecedented territory like this.
By rule... yes technically it should count. But Detroit is getting hosed by a man of shady business practice.

Has this ever happened?
i) Over 35 contract
ii)Team desperately wants him to honor contract
iii)Claims he retires
iv) Continues Playing very high level pro hockey for a lot of money.

Yes the wording "all salary and bonuses continue to count against the team salary cap, regardless of where and whether or not that player is playing" is pretty clear cut black and white.
But Bettman could just say he found Datsyuk's 'retirement' was in bad faith of the IIHF transfer agreement and provide Detroit with relief in this situation. Make it more about the transfer agreement violation superceding the over 35 rule.
 
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Shoalzie

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I'm not believing any report until he gets back from the World Championships and makes an actual announcement. Everyone jumped all over the Albom story when that came out and Pavel backed off on the report. I want to hear from him when he gets back.
 

Ezekial

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Yeah I mean the concept of that retirement is false considering he would be playing professional hockey in an IIHF league and collecting serious coin in the process.

By this theory signing any player of Russian descent to a long term contract is attached with far greater risks. As at any moment he could declare himself 'retired from his NHL contract' and go play in the KHL for virtually the same amount (if not more) than he was making in the NHL.

I'm just saying there is a commissioner for a reason. He can step in and make rulings when there is unprecedented territory like this.
By rule... yes technically it should count. But Detroit is getting hosed by a man of shady business practice.

Has this ever happened?
i) Over 35 contract
ii)Team desperately wants him to honor contract
iii)Claims he retires
iv) Continues Playing very high level pro hockey for a lot of money.

Yes the wording "all salary and bonuses continue to count against the team salary cap, regardless of where and whether or not that player is playing" is pretty clear cut black and white.
But Bettman could just say he found Datsyuk's 'retirement' was in bad faith of the IIHF transfer agreement and provide Detroit with relief in this situation. Make it more about the transfer agreement violation superceding the over 35 rule.

He has always wanted to play in his country in front of his people, this was known before the last contract. He's skating on some dead guy's ankle tendons and doesn't know how much of a chance he has. He's retiring from the NHL, he's allowed to play hockey elsewhere.
Now to my point, Ken Holland knew there was a chance this could happen, he could've done a set of one year deals until Pav decided to leave. Now the Red Wings need to play the hand they've dealt themselves and either trade the contract or eat it. The NHL won't and shouldn't make an exception to the rule and open pandora's box on this 35+ contract penalty.

Edit: Also, the NHL doesn't officially recognize the KHL as a major professional league. If they were to void it, what's to stop a team from saying "Well, he's playing in the SHL now so we should get our cap space back." in the future?
 
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Bench

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I'll with boomhower on this. I don't think anybody in the league really cares if Datsyuk gets hit cap hit voided. It may not follow the letter of the law, but neither did Kovalchuk... and that one was miles and miles worse.

An injured NHL legend almost 40 leaves 1 year on his deal to play in Russia. This isn't cap circumvention or a scheme anyone can copy. Who seriously is worried this will be a thing that would happen again?

The league had allowed far greater breaches go unpunished. This is such a non-issue I think.
 

Shaman464

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I'll with boomhower on this. I don't think anybody in the league really cares if Datsyuk gets hit cap hit voided. It may not follow the letter of the law, but neither did Kovalchuk... and that one was miles and miles worse.

An injured NHL legend almost 40 leaves 1 year on his deal to play in Russia. This isn't cap circumvention or a scheme anyone can copy. Who seriously is worried this will be a thing that would happen again?

The league had allowed far greater breaches go unpunished. This is such a non-issue I think.

Actually the NHL will care if this happens, this is a huge development. Z or another recapture player retires to play in a different league and their cap hit disappears? It'll be the new way to sign old players long term and not worry about 35+, it would great a massive loophole.
 

Reddwit

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I'll with boomhower on this. I don't think anybody in the league really cares if Datsyuk gets hit cap hit voided.

Everyone will care, especially the league. The Wings get out from underneath a 35+ contract without penalty and no one will care? The league sets a precedent that a team can get out of a 35+ contract if their guy retires to Europe to play and no one will care? Of course they will. That totally eviscerates the intent of the rule.

It may not follow the letter of the law, but neither did Kovalchuk... and that one was miles and miles worse.

Kovalchuk leaving for Russia followed the letter of the law. He signed the voluntary retirement papers, New Jersey filed them, and he was under 35 when he signed the deal. Him retiring to Russia was 100% legal. Don't confuse that with the contract being deemed illegal. Those are two separate things. Anyone under the age of 35 could do what Kovalchuk did even today, so long as the deal wasn't subject to recapture.

An injured NHL legend almost 40 leaves 1 year on his deal to play in Russia. This isn't cap circumvention or a scheme anyone can copy. Who seriously is worried this will be a thing that would happen again?

The league had allowed far greater breaches go unpunished. This is such a non-issue I think.

How isn't this something that can be copied? Hell, do this, and Elias could sign a 2-3 year deal right after that when he only has the intention of playing out one year before going to the Czech liiga and New Jersey escapes a couple million dollars in cap. In the future, I'm sure Markov, Streit, Roszival, Zubrus, the Sedins, just to name a few, wouldn't mind signing a faux-2 year deal to get their money, drive their team's cap down, and then scoot off to Russia or Switzerland or Sweden to cap off their careers as Euro stars. Half these guys end up signing European deals after retiring in the NHL anyways!
 

Frk It

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it is not unusual for trades to be made before the draft but after teams are out of the playoffs.

My bad, guess I never noticed any trades coming in of importance between the deadline and draft.

Just assumed you couldn't.
 
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