Dark Horse Candidates To Make The Team

[LegionOfDoom91]

Laughton's going to be on the opening night roster. You don't protect him in the expansion draft if otherwise. Veechione being waiver exempt is going to be pretty tough to crack the opening night roster with all the guys who have to put be on waivers to do so.

 

[Striiker]

Here's hoping Vecchione pushes him right into the moon door.

Vecchione has an even smaller chance of ever sticking on the roster than Laughton does.

Probably about the same as your chances of being on the roster.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

I do think Hagg will be in the NHL in 2017-2018.

Im just not sure of how that effects Sanheim, if at all.

it may affect Morin. Short term at least.
All the prospects will have to come to camp and earn it.
Just have to prepare ourselves for the bumps in the road these kids will have. if we want to go full youth on the backend there is going to be some bumps. some nights craters.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

I have Hagg over Morin in the prospect ranking thread. The only one to do so.

I've only seen 2 games of Hogberg, but if what I saw was his norm, I'd very easily rank Hogberg over both.

I don't think the coaches did Morin justice this year by pairing him so often with Sanheim. Morin deferred to Sanheim constantly. Morin wasn't challenged to work on his breakouts, puck skills, and other deficiencies until he was paired late in the season with Alt.

That last paragraph is something I would focus on right now. We all know the kind of prospect Morin is and what his ceiling is. But if he wasnt really driving the pairing when paired up with Sanheim is it safe to say that his game may not be there right now? Was he with Alt enough where he showed improvement over earlier in the season?

 

[Alex K]

The more I read debates about the young dmen, the more I understand that noone is a lock for the next year's lineup. It will totally depend on training camp performance, so Sanheim, Morin, Hagg and even Myers have equal chances to make the NHL linup this year.

Also, about Provorov's offence, he started last season as a defensive DMan, but during the season his confidence and offensive game were consistently improving, so I have no doubts that he can become a dominant force at both ends of the rink.

 

[BritainStix]

Nope. I take something that someone says and point out how stupid it is. Like, for example, caring about how many years in pro leagues a player has played when comparing prospects and their readiness. It's not a strawman to point out that this logic makes no sense by using the same logic on other players (Lindblom/Leier). It's just exposing the lack of common sense, which is why you get upset about it.

The point is that it shouldn't be considered at all. You should ONLY look at ability, not at number of pro seasons. That's not something "of note", it's a completely irrelevant number when comparing prospects. Just like you wouldn't use any AHL players number of pro seasons as a reason why they should make the team over Patrick. It just doesn't make any sense.

I never said he was bad this year or that he shouldn't make the team, in fact I specifically said that he should make the team. The only thing I was arguing was that Sanheim was better and should be given priority if there's limited spots available. I already clarified all of this previously, as you can see below...

1st paragraph, just not cool. Debate the opinion. It's perfectly acceptable for others to have a different opinion without being belittled and insulted. Which you have done continuously throughout your replies. It appears the only individual getting upset is yourself.

You seem to be ignoring my comment, and have done everytime I brought it up because it doesn't fit your narrative. So what you are saying is that the entire flyers team should be made up of players with the best ability, regardless of readiness. So why wasn't Sanheim and Morin on the roster last year? Why was Laughton in the AHL instead of VV or Bellemare. Same for Leier.

You keep referring to "pro" seasons too. It's not about "pro" seasons, it's about development time. Regardless I'm done, it's clear that you don't take anything from another opinion. I will be amazed if the flyers have three rookies on opening night. I'll be delighted, but amazed. It's just not a Flyers/Hextall thing to do.

 

[Striiker]

1st paragraph, just not cool. Debate the opinion. It's perfectly acceptable for others to have a different opinion without being belittled and insulted. Which you have done continuously throughout your replies. It appears the only individual getting upset is yourself.

You seem to be ignoring my comment, and have done everytime I brought it up because it doesn't fit your narrative. So what you are saying is that the entire flyers team should be made up of players with the best ability, regardless of readiness. So why wasn't Sanheim and Morin on the roster last year? Why was Laughton in the AHL instead of VV or Bellemare. Same for Leier.

You keep referring to "pro" seasons too. It's not about "pro" seasons, it's about development time. Regardless I'm done, it's clear that you don't take anything from another opinion. I will be amazed if the flyers have three rookies on opening night. I'll be delighted, but amazed. It's just not a Flyers/Hextall thing to do.

Now THIS is a strawman.

That's not at all what I said. You accuse me of ignoring a comment but apparently you've either been ignoring my entire point for pages now or you're intentionally misrepresenting my point. Either way...

I've repeated this over and over and over and over. Sanheim is ready, and more ready that Hagg. So this "regardless of readiness" nonsense is being pulled straight out of your ass. Sanheim and Morin weren't on the roster last because they weren't ready, they both needed to improve before being ready for NHL action.

And its fine if you're done, but at least be honest and admit it's because you're wrong and have nothing left to say. What you've been arguing is nonsense and not even something you can defend by saying it's an opinion. You don't use years pro when deciding which of two prospects make the team. Simple as that.

I'm also 99% sure that after all this time you still don't understand what my entire point was from the beginning, so that's pretty sad too.

 

[Curufinwe]

The more I read debates about the young dmen, the more I understand that noone is a lock for the next year's lineup. It will totally depend on training camp performance, so Sanheim, Morin, Hagg and even Myers have equal chances to make the NHL linup this year.

Your understanding is incorrect. The three AHL veterans are much more likely than Myers to make the Flyers.

That last paragraph is something I would focus on right now. We all know the kind of prospect Morin is and what his ceiling is. But if he wasnt really driving the pairing when paired up with Sanheim is it safe to say that his game may not be there right now? Was he with Alt enough where he showed improvement over earlier in the season?

I have to say this complaint is kind of hilarious because a year ago everyone was mad that Morin had to play with Alt in 15-16 and were desperate for him to be paired with Sanheim. Deferring to the better puck mover is something Hagg also did on his pairings with Brennan, Sanheim and O'Neill. I wish he had done that a bit more often, rather than fire off another one of his unnecessary icings.

 

[Curufinwe]

Vecchione has an even smaller chance of ever sticking on the roster than Laughton does.

I don't know how anyone can be sure Vecchione will be a better NHLer than Laughton and force him off the team. Beating up on ECAC kids as a 24 year old is cool and all, but we don't know how that will translate to the pros.

Maybe they will end up together on the Flyers 4th line by the end of the season.

 

[Striiker]

I don't know how anyone can be sure Vecchione will be a better NHLer than Laughton and force him off the team. Beating up on ECAC kids as a 24 year old is cool and all, but we don't know how that will translate to the pros.

Maybe they will end up together on the Flyers 4th line by the end of the season.

Yeah, I don't get it either.

I know I have a higher opinion on Laughton than most, but I could absolutely understand if someone said they can't wait for Laughton to be thrown out to make room for Rubtsov/Vorobyev/Frost/Patrick or any other prospect who is more talented/skilled/valuable than Laughton and actually has a solid chance of being on the roster one day. But Vecchione...? I get that it's nice to get prospect for free, but he's really underwhelming in the big picture and I think people are overrating his potential, even by merely acting like he's already better than Laughton.

 

[Curufinwe]

And Hextall can waive or trade a veteran if he wants Vecchione on the Flyers opening night roster.

 

[Striiker]

It's not like Vecchione is NHL or bust either... there's no rush.

Let him play a year in the AHL and see if he can float there before penciling him into a lineup over other guys.

 

[FLYguy3911]

Also important to mention Vecchione is actually older than Laughton.

 

[Striiker]

Forgot about that, but yeah that's true too. If you don't think Laughton can still improve then that same logic must apply to Vecchione.

 

[healthyscratch]

Vecchione has an even smaller chance of ever sticking on the roster than Laughton does.

Probably about the same as your chances of being on the roster.

I know all this, why are you ruining my dream?

 

[healthyscratch]

Wow you guys ran with Vecchione. I don't care who it is, so long as it isn't Laughton.

 

[Striiker]

Wow you guys ran with Vecchione. I don't care who it is, so long as it isn't Laughton.

It wasn't directed at you really, I've seen many other people talk about Vecchione a certain way that I don't think is too realistic.

 

[Curufinwe]

Wow you guys ran with Vecchione. I don't care who it is, so long as it isn't Laughton.

That makes even less sense given the crap we've seen play on the 4th line the past few years.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

I have to say this complaint is kind of hilarious because a year ago everyone was mad that Morin had to play with Alt in 15-16 and were desperate for him to be paired with Sanheim. Deferring to the better puck mover is something Hagg also did on his pairings with Brennan, Sanheim and O'Neill. I wish he had done that a bit more often, rather than fire off another one of his unnecessary icings.

well I wasnt trying to come off as complaining about Morin's play in LV. I was just making a comment based on what I read here. I didnt see one second of Morin in LV. Since we dont have AHL hockey anymore up here I dont get any 1 game looks at the kids.
Hell maybe Morin shows he is the more ready of anyone this fall. The young kids are going to drive each other to be better hockey players. Should be a fun camp.

 

[David St Hubbins]

Morin is basically a much bigger, much stronger, much meaner version of Hagg. They both have their weaknesses but I will take Morin any day. Hagg type defensemen arent hard to find. Mobile behemoths are like unicorns.

Really big, tough unicorns.

 

[sa cyred]

Wow you guys ran with Vecchione. I don't care who it is, so long as it isn't Laughton.

Can't remember who, but this all started in the prospect voting thread when someone was trying to make a case for him being top 10-15 (which is obviously crazy). Ever since then Vecchione hasn't been well liked even more then before. It's mostly Laughton sided people, but that being said I don't care who is waiver exempt, who was protected in the draft, older, etc. As long as the better player makes it. If that's Laughton, great. If its Vecchione, great also. I wouldn't be upset if Laughton was waived and taken. He is a 4th line player, and realistically will be one the rest of his career (if he can make the NHL fulltime)

 

[daa5250]

5 pro seasons to 1 definitely is something of note. That much experience and he has yet to play a meaningful game in the NHL says a little something.

Not really considering he's only 22 and just happened to start in the pros at age 18 which very few do. A defense prospect taking until age 22 to become an NHL regular is not a knock on his ability or talent. He was just a rare case that started at such a young age.

 

[daa5250]

1st paragraph, just not cool. Debate the opinion. It's perfectly acceptable for others to have a different opinion without being belittled and insulted. Which you have done continuously throughout your replies. It appears the only individual getting upset is yourself.

You seem to be ignoring my comment, and have done everytime I brought it up because it doesn't fit your narrative. So what you are saying is that the entire flyers team should be made up of players with the best ability, regardless of readiness. So why wasn't Sanheim and Morin on the roster last year? Why was Laughton in the AHL instead of VV or Bellemare. Same for Leier.

You keep referring to "pro" seasons too. It's not about "pro" seasons, it's about development time. Regardless I'm done, it's clear that you don't take anything from another opinion. I will be amazed if the flyers have three rookies on opening night. I'll be delighted, but amazed. It's just not a Flyers/Hextall thing to do.

I kid you not the 1st time i interacted with him he was mocking people who thought Giroux's 2017 season struggles had to do with him not being the same physically. Then Giroux came out in interviews saying that his struggles were in fact a result of his body not doing what it used to be able do but Striiker refused to admit he was wrong and clung to any little strawman to claim he wasnt.

That's a pretty great indicator how close minded the guy is. Literally gets proven wrong by the player himself and refused to concede his point ...

 

[Striiker]

I kid you not the 1st time i interacted with him he was mocking people who thought Giroux's 2017 season struggles had to do with him not being the same physically. Then Giroux came out in interviews saying that his struggles were in fact a result of his body not doing what it used to be able do but Striiker refused to admit he was wrong and clung to any little strawman to claim he wasnt.

That's a pretty great indicator how close minded the guy is. Literally gets proven wrong by the player himself and refused to concede his point ...

Incorrect, as usual.

I said that injury wasn't the real cause of his lower scoring last year because you can clearly see that his scoring was fine until New Years, which you keep ignoring. If the injury was the reason for his scoring being down then why did it only effect him for the last 45 or so games of last season? Where was it in the first months of the season? You've yet to answer this question, because you can't.
He said he felt pain and that it effected him mentally, but he never explicitely blamed his scoring on that, like you're trying to claim.

"I think when you don't think about that kind of stuff, you go out and play the game, but when it is in the back of your mind and you are really not thinking about the game and mostly thinking about your hip or whatever, I think it is important to kind of focus on the right things," he said.

So the common sense answer is that the injury wasn't the main cause of his lower scoring. Did it mentally hurt him by causing him to lose confidence and lose focus? Sure. Did he feel pain at times last year? Yep. But the more likely reason for his scoring was his poorer conditioning last year, due to lost offseason training time. That's why he was able to perform to start the year but then started to falter and struggled to get things back on track. If you think a little pain causes hockey players to have years like this then you must not be too famialr with hockey in general. Most players are playing through pain and dont see a drop in scoring like this one.

Like I keep saying, you can't blame the injury, as if it's the sole reason, if you look at how he started the year. It simply doesn't make sense. Unless you believe he was hurt in the offseason, miraculously got better from October to December, and then suddenly because an issue again after that.

But unfortunately you seem to enjoy being wrong, so by all means, continue.

 

[Rebels57]

Incorrect, as usual.

I said that injury wasn't the real cause of his lower scoring last year because you can clearly see that his scoring was fine until New Years, which you keep ignoring. If the injury was the reason for his scoring being down then why did it only effect him for the last 45 or so games of last season? Where was it in the first months of the season? You've yet to answer this question, because you can't.
He said he felt pain and that it effected him mentally, but he never explicitely blamed his scoring on that, like you're trying to claim.



So the common sense answer is that the injury wasn't the main cause of his lower scoring. Did it mentally hurt him by causing him to lose confidence and lose focus? Sure. Did he feel pain at times last year? Yep. But the more likely reason for his scoring was his poorer conditioning last year, due to lost offseason training time. That's why he was able to perform to start the year but then started to falter and struggled to get things back on track. If you think a little pain causes hockey players to have years like this then you must not be too famialr with hockey in general. Most players are playing through pain and dont see a drop in scoring like this one.

Like I keep saying, you can't blame the injury, as if it's the sole reason, if you look at how he started the year. It simply doesn't make sense. Unless you believe he was hurt in the offseason, miraculously got better from October to December, and then suddenly because an issue again after that.

But unfortunately you seem to enjoy being wrong, so by all means, continue.

Im over here like, "It was Hakstols fault."