The Players' Tribune: Dan Carcillo - I Can't Live Like That Anymore/Nick Boynton - Everything's Not OK

[Tundra]

Funny how for some folks, it always comes down to "well, they made millions, so they deserve what they got." That argument screams petty jealousy to me - losers who don't want anyone else to succeed because they didn't either. Maybe an over-generalization but that's how it reads to me.

Argument goes the opposite way for me. We dangle a huge carrot for these guys - give them an overwhelming incentive to destroy themselves. It's a honey trap and we, as a society and a fan base, set it. The moral failure is ours.

I think it's more about a cost-benefit analysis or lack thereof. These players had a conscious choice to walk away from the meat grinder.

 

[Sky04]

You're just being willfully ignorant. You can't possibly pretend to understand the full impact of concussions NOW in the very moment, let alone 10 years ago. And I'm assuming you're better educated than him, which perhaps isn't such a good assumption.

You truly are a disgusting person.

You're dismissing everything he's done under negligence? Completely ignorant and disgusting in it's own right.

And yes there was plenty of knowledge on the impact of concussions 10 years ago in 2008, this wasn't 1988 - get over yourself.

Yes I'm pretty sure I can confidently say I'm more educated than him and even moreso now - don't let that offend you snowflake.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

I think it's more about a cost-benefit analysis or lack thereof. These players had a conscious choice to walk away from the meat grinder.

When, and with what potential options and what education to make a reasonable determination?

Like I said before, the whole "they knew the risks" argument is disingenuous. Not to mention it is terribly callous for people to turn their noses up at those who suffer just because they earned a lot of money in exchange for a possible risk to their health.

 

[StreetHawk]

When, and with what potential options and what education to make a reasonable determination?

Like I said before, the whole "they knew the risks" argument is disingenuous. Not to mention it is terribly callous for people to turn their noses up at those who suffer just because they earned a lot of money in exchange for a possible risk to their health.

How many player ever walk away in their 20’s who have had multiple head injuries? Hardly any. Guys keep going until they end up on ltir like franzen. He made more than enough to walk away before his last head injury.

What are the medical professionals telling these guys? That they are now symptom free. That there’s no way of determining what their brain will be after another blow to the head? One thing to walk around with a limp due to multiple knee surgeries, but your brain.....

Fundamentally, nothing is invulnerable. Composite sticks can only take so many slashed before they ultimately break. Same with knees and the brain.

But it’s hard to walk away in the moment until you have first hand experience of what someone who is suffering badly is going through.

Maybe these former guys need to work with a documentary company to record their daily struggles to show nhl guys what they are going through. Maybe the only way to convince them that they need to walk away before it’s too late for them.

 

[CascadiaPuck]

Because it's more advantageous to project blame. Look at the infamous Liebeck v. McDonald's case. Women spills coffee due to her own clumsiness and is awarded 2.86 million dollars in damages.

I'm think personal responsibility is a huge factor (see my posts on the players absolutely bearing some responsibility for this situation in this thread). Going off-topic though: that McD's hot coffee case had a lot of interesting points in it. There was a documentary on it (HOT COFFEE, a documentary feature film). I don't think it's as straightforward as "projecting blame" when you have corporate malfeasance and legal shenanigans at play as well. Which is part of the concussion discussion in contact sports as well, for sure. It's an interesting situation.

 

[StreetHawk]

I'm think personal responsibility is a huge factor (see my posts on the players absolutely bearing some responsibility for this situation in this thread). Going off-topic though: that McD's hot coffee case had a lot of interesting points in it. There was a documentary on it (HOT COFFEE, a documentary feature film). I don't think it's as straightforward as "projecting blame" when you have corporate malfeasance and legal shenanigans at play as well. Which is part of the concussion discussion in contact sports as well, for sure. It's an interesting situation.

For me it comes down to whether the teams medical staff conveyed all of the available medical information to the player. Every year more is known about concussions impact. Can only provide what you know at that point in time. Plus, are nhl teams and the league overall on top of the latest medical information to treat their players.

Boynton was drafted in 1997 and redrafted in 1999. Kariya suffered that cross check from suter in 1998. That’s probably about the time people started to understand more about the seriousness of concussions.

No player today should be saying I didn’t know the dangers. Plenty of information out there to know that you risk long term dam age the more of them to have.

Different for guys who played pre lockout. Didn’t know as much as today.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

When, and with what potential options and what education to make a reasonable determination?

Like I said before, the whole "they knew the risks" argument is disingenuous. Not to mention it is terribly callous for people to turn their noses up at those who suffer just because they earned a lot of money in exchange for a possible risk to their health.

Agreed.

What I always find surprising in threads like this is how much bitterness some fans have towards how much money players make. As if their salary justifies a total lack of compassion towards them as human beings. If someone's that resentful about their salary, why watch the sport at all?

 

[kaner13]

Agreed.

What I always find surprising in threads like this is how much bitterness some fans have towards how much money players make. As if their salary justifies a total lack of compassion towards them as human beings. If someone's that resentful about their salary, why watch the sport at all?

Because they still love hockey. People think actors are overpaid, they still watch movies.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

Because they still love hockey. People think actors are overpaid, they still watch movies.

I know. It just seems stupid to whine about how much people are getting paid as you're actively supporting them.

 

[kaner13]

I know. It just seems stupid to whine about how much people are getting paid as you're actively supporting them.

Ah, you said you found it surprising...it just seemed kind of obvious to be surprising. Rightly or wrongly, that is.

 

[kaner13]

Exactly.

I can handle almost any physical pain I face on a day to day basis. Physical pain is easy, you feel it for a bit, it sucks, but unless it's permanent, it goes away. Hell, I'd rather walk in to the dentist and have them poke around for an hour folliwed by removing teeth than have to face going to work on a day when I can barely get out of bed from feeling like ****.

Mental pain is completely debilitating. Anyone who tries to tell you that they don't have mental health issues is a liar. Those of us who suffer from depression/anxiety IMO are at least 10x tougher than "tough guys" of the world, who flinch at the thought of anything that they don't agree with.

It's not a competition of who is tougher. Like it's not mentally ill people vs non-mentally ill.
I suffer from these things. So do many others. That doesn't make us tougher than anyone. Continue to do good work on improving your mental health, but again it's not a competition and I don't think either physical or mental pain is fun to deal with.

 

[CanadienShark]

That's not necessary or helping anything.

Necessary, no. Warranted? Yes.

That particular poster gave a pretty disgusting opinion.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

Agreed.

What I always find surprising in threads like this is how much bitterness some fans have towards how much money players make. As if their salary justifies a total lack of compassion towards them as human beings. If someone's that resentful about their salary, why watch the sport at all?

its not the money...its the fact that Carcillo made his career by having zero compassion for his fellow players as human beings.

 

[kaner13]

Necessary, no. Warranted? Yes.

That particular poster gave a pretty disgusting opinion.

It wasn't a good look on either of you.
Calling them a "truly disgusting person" as you did and the way you did it was absolutely was not warranted.

 

[Oddbob]

Ahhh, poor Carcillo! Seriously, the guy ran around out there like a moron with many stupid and cheap hits, probably caused many concussions to undeserving players, and we are supposed to feel sorry for him? The thing I hate about all this concussion lawsuit stuff, is that if you enter a contact sport on ice (high speed), with 200+ pound grown men, and get into fights on purpose, as well as hits, bull crap that you don't know concussions and other big injuries are not a MAJOR RISK, UTTER NONSENSE!

 

[Oddbob]

You’re forgetting most of these former players barely have a GED

You don't need much education at all, if any, to know injuries both during and after your career are a major risk if you play professional sports in a contact league.

 

[CanadienShark]

It wasn't a good look on either of you.
Calling them a "truly disgusting person" as you did and the way you did it was absolutely was not warranted.

Hardly.

 

[kaner13]

Alright.

 

[McTonyBrar]

yeah, no sympathy for Carcillo. For someone who scrambled as many brains as he did as a player, its called karma.

Additionally, lets stop the nonsense that they didnt know cracking someone in the head is bad for that person's health.

Wow Tough guy here saying he has no sympathy for a man who has brain problems. Good on you. No one cares what you think

 

[McTonyBrar]

I have a problem with players like a Carcillo coming out after they’ve made all the money they could and looking for people to feel sorry for them once their career is over. He’s learning what exactly now that his career is over?

You mean after he realized what it actually causes because of how his brain is affecting him and after what happened to Steve Montador. How can you say something so awful and feel all right with what you said? That is appalling

 

[McTonyBrar]

Pretty ridiculous takes in this thread, but shouldn't be surprised. It is the main board after all.

It's pretty evident that players will do whatever it takes to stay on the ice if they feel fine in the short term. Even take a look in Boynton's case in his article, when he finally worked up the courage to tell his management team the problems he was having, they traded him not long after. He then felt it was necessary to clam up and hide everything to prevent that from occurring again.

You know why these guys are going and pushing for help after they've retired? Because their careers and lives after playing the sport are affected. They're unable to control their emotions on a daily basis to their loved ones because of the trauma their brain has experienced. Their friends are ****ing dying. There are better methods of treatment for these injuries that the league is clearly not acknowledging or willing to accept in fear it will turn people away from the sport.

This isn't simply the case of guys trying to win a lawsuit against the league, they want to help their fellow players and prevent any further deaths from the aftermath of head injuries.

Why even post this here friend? I think we all know by now what kind of geniuses are on this forum

 

[Sempiternal]

They decided to play the sport they love at the risk of their health.

 

[ek93]

Reading/watching these really make me wonder what it's like for guys that I grew up watching slug it out in the AHL, like Jeremy Yablonski, Jon Mirasty or Dennis Bonvie. None of them made huge money or won Stanley Cups, and they all fought probably twice as much, if not more. Wonder how their lives are nowadays.

 

[Silky mitts]

His twitter handle is CarBombBoom13
Opponent doesn't raise arms gets suckerpunched

Hits ref in face with butt of stick

Tries to break Perreault's arm

Tries to break Tom Gilbert's neck
Dan Carcillo destroys Tom Gilbert and himself | 01/02/2012 [HD]
Blows up teammate then headbutts opponent
Nice hit, Dan Carcillo

 

[Pilky01]

His twitter handle is CarBombBoom13
Opponent doesn't raise arms gets suckerpunched

Hits ref in face with butt of stick

Tries to break Perreault's arm

Tries to break Tom Gilbert's neck
Dan Carcillo destroys Tom Gilbert and himself | 01/02/2012 [HD]
Blows up teammate then headbutts opponent
Nice hit, Dan Carcillo

Its like the Carcillo fans in here seem to think this guy played in the mid 90's and wasn't trying to murder multiple players in the 2012 season.