Proposal: DAL-MTL Blockbuster trade Weber/Drouin for Klingberg/Benn

[majormajor]

might be possible with some retain if they get the better contract in Weber. But Benn will still produce over 60p this season and his physical

I think this is where you are going off track. Benn didn't score 60 pts last year and isn't looking great to start this year.

Weber can still be a top 4 D for the next 3 or 4 years, I don't know if Benn will be a top six guy, or if he'll be even top 9. And he's owed a fortune for the next 6 years, with a lot more actual money left on the deal, which makes it likely impossible to dish off the cap hit to Ottawa or some other budget club.

 

[HabsQC]

we played boston 2 years in a row and outside of St Louis gave them the hardest time.

Still no series win

 

[Boxscore]

Kotkaneimi is indeed a blue chip centre prospect, it would take either an absurd amount of mental gymnastics or denialism (or perhaps both) to deny that

I'd agree with this. Kotkaniemi will never be a huge point-getter IMO, but he will be one of those excellent, well-rounded centers who can chip in decent points and play in all situations. I can see him maxing out at 70 points during his best offensive season, but he will do so many things well that he will be far more valuable than a one-dimensional, offensive centerman.

That said, in order for the Canadiens to be a legit Cup contender, they will either have to have Kotkaniemi overachieve by A LOT and pull an Aleksander Barkov (turning into an 85-95 point player), which I truly don't think he has in him, or they will need to acquire a more offensive center for the top line, and have Kotkaniemi be one of the better 2nd line centers in the league, during his prime years.

If you look in the East, there are some high-level centers to compete with... Crosby, Malkin, Bergeron, Matthews, Tavares, Backstrom, Kuznetsov, Point, Stamkos, Eichel, Couturier, Barkov... and the list goes on and on. In order for the Habs to take the next step, they absolutely need a 1-2 punch up the middle that can compete with the heavies in the East, let alone the McDavids, MacKinnons, Petterssons, Scheifeles and Monahans of the West.

 

[Just Linda]

The guy Montreal went off the board to reach for with that pick?

Yeah, he's a regular Elias Pettersson

Your entire post here is confusing. Neither EP not Kotkaneimi were 'off the board' picks. EP was the second highest ranked European prospect on NHLs list and Bob McKenzie had him at number 7. Going two spots sooner isn't an off the board pick. Same with Kotkaneimi, he was regularly ranked as a top 5 prospect so he may have been considered a reach at the time but barely.

I can throw out random comparables too but I don't.

Also, kid is barely 19 and already has 34 NHL points before his 19th birthday. That's far more than anyone on your roster had before their 19th. Not sure what you expect of the kids.

 

[Just Linda]

So when I said Montreal doesn't have a 1C I was right?

Move the goal posts back and worth

So instead of bragging about winning playoff rounds or even being top 2 in your Division you are choosing to brag about your team having better centre depth then the Habs?

Your team is the 3rd best in your own division, come back and boast when they've done something of note in the past 30 years

 

[Habs10025]

And Dallas is certainly not trading Klingberg.

Good for them .

 

[Scintillating10]

Some fans were talking about that trade, While Drouin is doing really well at the moment and he seems to have finally understood how to play with his brain and heart more. The only problem for MTL, they need an offensive D who can

Klingberg is having a rough start and Benn is in the same water as Weber while carrying a larger contract.

Here is a great resume by @TooLegitToQuit :

Makes me think about it for sure. How do the Stars feel about it?

Drouin: Age 24 and signed for 4 more years at $5.5M. * UFA at 28
Klingberg: Age 27 and signed for 3 more years at $4.25M. * UFA at 30
Benn: Age 30 and signed for 6 more years at $9.5M.
Weber: Age 34 and signed for 7 more years at $7.86M. * Contract designed for him to retire after 3 or 4 more years. Leverage over the Preds on the $24M of recapture penalty may or may not be an asset.

* Average age from each side is 29
* Cap hits moving from each side is $13-$14M range
* 11 years of term going to Dallas and 9 going to the Habs. When you factor in Weber likely retires after his age 37 season, It's 8 vs 9.

What do both fan base say ? who add, who retain, yes, no ?

Lindell is also an other option over Klingberg



- Drouin
- Weber



- Benn
- Klingberg

Quite the drop in value of Benn isn't it? A month ago Habs couldn't give Drouin away, according to this board. Weber's play has fallen off and is way overpaid. Now, they are willing to give Benn and Klingberg for both?? Sounds fishy

 

[Benstheman]

So two 2nd liners and a bunch of guys that haven't done anything in the league yet? Your division alone has Stamkos, Point, Bergeron, Barkov, Matthews, Tavares, Eichel and you think Danualt or Domi matches up well against them?? Lmao thanks or the laugh.

To be fair, those are elite centers and not every team have that.

That being said, Habs lack high end players at almost every position, even though they have a great prospect pool and good young players coming in the system.

 

[Benstheman]

nah they underachieved. The Leafs at their best should be top 3 team after Tampa and Boston.

Fixed it for you. But we didn't see much of that, have we??

 

[pigpen65]

Had no idea Benn was making that much money or that he was signed for that long. Thats completely over the top insane. What maniac offered that contract?

 

[sansabri]

Had no idea Benn was making that much money or that he was signed for that long. Thats completely over the top insane. What maniac offered that contract?

Did you forget that year he won the Art Ross? That's why.

 

[ole ole]

Yeah the division is on their knees in fear of Montreal rolling out a bunch of wingers shoe horned into C and Koko.

How can JT/Matthews, Bergeron/Krejici, Barkov, Eichel/Mittelstad, Stamkos/Point juggle lines against the match up nightmare of Montreal's hybrid center depth.

I love honest good faith discourse only offered online.

This coming from a fan of a team that hasn't seen a cup since before the color TV was invented.
Hell when was that last playoff rd win.

 

[M88K]

This coming from a fan of a team that hasn't seen a cup since before the color TV was invented.
Hell when was that last playoff rd win.

that's cold. I approve

 

[ahmedou]

- Drouin
- Weber



- Benn
- Klingberg

Dallas:
-Klingberg

Montreal:
-Weber

 

[RationalExpectations]

I think this proposal achieves nothing for either team, but MTL gets the shorter end due to the awful Seguin contract. I like both Drouin and Klingberg, the later holding more value at the moment, but not that much more to justify the loss of value from the Seguin Weber swap ! Just one man s opinion though.
To answer some earlier comments I believe that to increase KKs value you need a top scorer, with a great shot (Caulfield maybe in a few years or Laine right now), from my POV KK has high Hockey IQ, but he is no McDavid in the sense that he does not have this skating ability to make the difference but pinpoint accuracy, I believe that if Weber or Drouin or Domi are traded this will be to get this king of scorer.

 

[ZeHockeyFan]

LOL..the near absence of any participation of Stars fans and bickering primarily amongst Habs fans (and the odd Leafs troll jumping in to stir the pot) is indicative enough of how woefully inane this proposal is that the other side doesn't even bother participating much

Do Habs fans ever think about what other teams may or may not want/need? I still have memories from having to explain why Stars didn't need Tom Gilbert in 2016. Nothing has changed.

 

[FerrisRox]

do you have no comprehension whatsover? They finished at the top of the standings and still had to play a top team in the 1st round. If they pounded on a crap team like Pittsburgh or the Islanders and lost to the Bruins in the 2nd or 3rd round does that appease you? Its the same situation.

No, it's not the same situation. In situation #2, they actually won a playoff round.

As for "finishing at the top of the standings and still having to play a top team" care to explain how the Leafs finished four points ahead of Montreal... who didn't even make the playoffs yet somehow you deem them a "top team?" How can they be a "top team" and be four points shy of missing the playoffs at the same time?

While were at it, how are the Leafs, with a 100 points finishing "on top of the standings" and the Islanders, with 103 points and Pittsburgh, with 100 points are "crap teams?"

You sound ridiculous.

 

[justanotherleafsfan]

Well no, I responded to you saying "off the board reach" not "reach". You shifted semantics just now. Off the board would be doing what Boston did when they had their 3 straight first rounders and they passed up Barzal and Connor to pick two players that weren't even ranked by most as first round picks (one was a bit of a reach being ranked 19th, Debrusk was ranked as an early second rounder and Senyshyn usually fell as a late 2nd rounder/ early 3rd rounder in most draft rankings).

Picking a player 2 spots early is a slight reach.

But again, only 4 players from last year's draft became NHL regulars last season and despite being the youngest Kotkaneimi showed he fit right along side 3 of them. I don't know why you insist on completing so much mental gymnastics to try to discredit an 18 year old (last season) because of your irrational dislike of a team. Not seeing Kotkaneimi as a stud prospect with a good chance of being a 1C says more about you then it does anything else.

I didn't shift anything, Bergevin was basically a punch line going into that draft because we knew, I knew, you knew, my dog knew, that he was so desperate for a center that'd he reach with the pick and take whomever the best C available was in the draft. This is uncontroversial but we're online a bit over a year later so history is rewritten to fit, not even a narrative, a fan fantasy. My original comment was that Montreal is soft at center, that is literally a narrative in Habs media but on HF is basically 'hate speech'.

My favorite team hasn't even won a cup in a while so I'm just jealous of a cup Montreal won when I was three and didn't even know what hockey was.

****ing fine, I'll bend the knee to these tiny egos, Montreal has sooooo many ELITE 1Cz from Koko, to Domi, to Drouin, I mean 2/3rds of those talents are also the bestest wingers so Montreal has the best wingers and centers since like the 1970s Montreal Candadans, we're in peak dynasty, Weber is clearly the best young defenseman in the league, the God Emperor is sporting mad fashion.

I'm dumb, you're genius, reality is silly putty you can fashion into anything.

And Boston sucks, they can't draft, so they didn't even make the playoffs last year or win a round because we're in imagination land.

You're comparison of Montreal drafting in the top five and Boston in the mid teens of the first round is so apt, there no difference from drating 3rd overall or 13th overall they are the same pick and have the same trade value.

I'm learning a lot here, thank you this site is just full of high IQ content.

Kock is the best center in league. I know that know and Domi is wasn't even a failure the Yotes moved on from.

I'm just talking semantics though, Montreal is deep and at center the Boston sucks at drafting because I am the one who wants to argue semantics.... holy Christ test your tap water for lead.

But I'm jealous, Montreal won a cup when I was three, when I didn't even know what hockey was, Kirk Muller was such a 1C though.

 

[Just Linda]

I didn't shift anything, Bergevin was basically a punch line going into that draft because we knew, I knew, you knew, my dog knew, that he was so desperate for a center that'd he reach with the pick and take whomever the best C available was in the draft. This is uncontroversial but we're online a bit over a year later so history is rewritten to fit, not even a narrative, a fan fantasy. My original comment was that Montreal is soft at center, that is literally a narrative in Habs media but on HF is basically 'hate speech'.

My favorite team hasn't even won a cup in a while so I'm just jealous of a cup Montreal won when I was three and didn't even know what hockey was.

****ing fine, I'll bend the knee to these tiny egos, Montreal has sooooo many ELITE 1Cz from Koko, to Domi, to Drouin, I mean 2/3rds of those talents are also the bestest wingers so Montreal has the best wingers and centers since like the 1970s Montreal Candadans, we're in peak dynasty, Weber is clearly the best young defenseman in the league, the God Emperor is sporting mad fashion.

I'm dumb, you're genius, reality is silly putty you can fashion into anything.

And Boston sucks, they can't draft, so they didn't even make the playoffs last year or win a round because we're in imagination land.

You're comparison of Montreal drafting in the top five and Boston in the mid teens of the first round is so apt, there no difference from drating 3rd overall or 13th overall they are the same pick and have the same trade value.

I'm learning a lot here, thank you this site is just full of high IQ content.

Kock is the best center in league. I know that know and Domi is wasn't even a failure the Yotes moved on from.

I'm just talking semantics though, Montreal is deep and at center the Boston sucks at drafting because I am the one who wants to argue semantics.... holy Christ test your tap water for lead.

But I'm jealous, Montreal won a cup when I was three, when I didn't even know what hockey was, Kirk Muller was such a 1C though.

You keep shifting goal posts.

1) Nobody is saying that Montreal has elite 1Cs, just that we are content with seeing what we got. We are saying we have a future 1c in our system and we are fine with gambling on it. As Toronto showed last year, having one your willing to bank on doesn't mean you say no to getting another but like Toronto, we won't go out and break the bank getting one.
2) Nobody is saying Weber is still an elite 1D. That's pulled from your butt. He's not even the Habs top pairing D.
3) Nobody made a judgement on Boston's drafting. They were just used as an example of off the board drafting. Nobody said it was good or bad in this thread.
4) Nobody is saying Montreal is deep at centre, just content with having our centre prospects will develop.
5) Nobody is saying Kotkaneimi is elite or that we are even relying on Domi.

Everything you said there was a straight ass pull

 

[Deficient Mode]

Klingberg is clearly the best player and most valuable contract in this deal. This isn't the roster shakeup I'd go for if I were running Dallas. Only advantage for Dallas is that Weber will be much more tradeable in a couple years than Benn due to how frontloaded his contract was and how little actual salary he's owed the last 4 years of his contract. Surely Dallas could get a better deal for Benn than this though if they really want to dump him and he were willing to waive his NMC.

 

[justanotherleafsfan]

You keep shifting goal posts.

1) Nobody is saying that Montreal has elite 1Cs, just that we are content with seeing what we got. We are saying we have a future 1c in our system and we are fine with gambling on it. As Toronto showed last year, having one your willing to bank on doesn't mean you say no to getting another but like Toronto, we won't go out and break the bank getting one.
2) Nobody is saying Weber is still an elite 1D. That's pulled from your butt. He's not even the Habs top pairing D.
3) Nobody made a judgement on Boston's drafting. They were just used as an example of off the board drafting. Nobody said it was good or bad in this thread.
4) Nobody is saying Montreal is deep at centre, just content with having our centre prospects will develop.
5) Nobody is saying Kotkaneimi is elite or that we are even relying on Domi.

Everything you said there was a straight ass pull

I'm been mililitant in my consistency in this thread, so let's play...

1) I made a soft comment about the Habs being so soft at C that they'd turn Benn into a C because they routinely shoe horn in hybrid/wingers into their 1C position, 800 posts later, I'm still paying for this sin.

2) Yes, I exaggerated with gross hyperbole calling Weber an elite young D, must sarcasm be explained to you?

3) Yes they did, I torn apart the difference in draft value between a 3rd OA pick an mid teen 1st round picks, I literally responded to the literal point.

4) Multiple posts about how good Montreal is at center, that is the argument. This a digusting shifting of the goal posts, if you agree that Montreal blows at C then why am I responding in this thread?
5) LOL, SO I AM RIGHT????? THEY AREN'T 1Cs WHY ARE YOU RESPONDING TO ME FFS..... sigh, cute, I love the internet, 'I'm wrong but your wrong and then I'll agree with you but you're still wrong and I was right the whole time'


My Hyundai is better than you're Toyota but I've said all along Toyotas are better than Hyundais. You just don't get that a 2018 is better than a 2016... cool

lalalalala Montreal is awesome and other teams suck I get it.

 

[Just Linda]

I'm been mililitant in my consistency in this thread, so let's play...

1) I made a soft comment about the Habs being so soft at C that they'd turn Benn into a C because they routinely shoe horn in hybrid/wingers into their 1C position, 800 posts later, I'm still paying for this sin.

2) Yes, I exaggerated with gross hyperbole calling Weber an elite young D, must sarcasm be explained to you?

3) Yes they did, I torn apart the difference in draft value between a 3rd OA pick an mid teen 1st round picks, I literally responded to the literal point.

4) Multiple posts about how good Montreal is at center, that is the argument. This a digusting shifting of the goal posts, if you agree that Montreal blows at C then why am I responding in this thread?
5) LOL, SO I AM RIGHT????? THEY AREN'T 1Cs WHY ARE YOU RESPONDING TO ME FFS..... sigh, cute, I love the internet, 'I'm wrong but your wrong and then I'll agree with you but you're still wrong and I was right the whole time'


lalalalala Montreal is awesome and other teams suck I get it.

Nobody bashed other teams or said they suck. Nobody is even homering Montreal's greatness.

You come into a thread to bash a team and act shocked that their fans disagree with you?

 

[FerrisRox]

the Leafs underachieved it’s obvious. You don’t understand hockey

So they weren't really a 100 point team, they were more like a 120 point team, so that's why Pittsburgh and the Islanders were "crap" compared to them.

Got it.

Thankfully you are here to explain hockey to rest of us.

 

[Just Linda]

I'm quitting the plant, leaving my union to get a superviser position at a Best Buy you've reframed how I interpret reality.

Montreal has no issue at center, I've learned a lot. No issues means winning team no?

1) No issues means we feel that we can win with what we got once they develop. 19 year old, 2 20 year olds. Denault who's filling in well in the interim and Domi who is gunning close to PPG in an offensive role.
2) We would love a better centre but realize they are pretty much exclusively first overall picks (like Toronto's 2 are). We don't want to bottom out for a few years in an attempt to have a chance of drafting 1oa.
3) We aren't even close to our win-now window.
4) As Toronto shows, there's more to winning then centre depth. Toronto finished one head-to-head win ahead of Montreal last year and has opened the season worse than Montreal so far. Toronto hasn't made it out of the first round despite having a top 3 (or better) centre depth. We are happy with what we got down the middle because we are a bubble playoff team before our centres have even developed.
4) If winning means no issues then that means Toronto has almost as many issues as Montreal.

 

[justanotherleafsfan]

1) No issues means we feel that we can win with what we got once they develop. 19 year old, 2 20 year olds. Denault who's filling in well in the interim and Domi who is gunning close to PPG in an offensive role.
2) We would love a better centre but realize they are pretty much exclusively first overall picks (like Toronto's 2 are). We don't want to bottom out for a few years in an attempt to have a chance of drafting 1oa.
3) We aren't even close to our win-now window.
4) As Toronto shows, there's more to winning then centre depth. Toronto finished one head-to-head win ahead of Montreal last year and has opened the season worse than Montreal so far. Toronto hasn't made it out of the first round despite having a top 3 (or better) centre depth. We are happy with what we got down the middle because we are a bubble playoff team before our centres have even developed.
4) If winning means no issues then that means Toronto has almost as many issues as Montreal.

As Toront shows? Oh I get it, Toronto doesn't get to be young and develop, Habs have no expectations because they miss the playoffs so they just get to develop and the Leafs suck because they rountinely put an Eastern conference best Boston who is in their prime to 7 games.

Our window is just opening and we're ahead of most of the league, good luck with yours.