Couturier vs Marner
- Thread starter Deadly Dogma
- Start date
82Ninety42011
Registered User
This is a very interesting poll in two very different players. So I'll take the names away and compare the stud playmaking winger against the stud 2-way centre. Both are elite at what they do in different ways however one makes way more than the other in the cap. If the cap was the same this would be either or possibly but with the cap included this is the centre. I'm taking Couts.
CatchyTune
JOHN TAVARES IS A MAPLE LEAF
Marner is 23 and has a 94 point season (at 21), and a 93 point pace season (at 22) under his belt, and is on pace for 98 this year in 82 games, at 23.
When Couturier was 23 he put up 37 points in 82 games, with a career high of 39. His career high in points is 76 and has never had a PPG season. The offensive gap is large
When Couturier was 23 he put up 37 points in 82 games, with a career high of 39. His career high in points is 76 and has never had a PPG season. The offensive gap is large
CatchyTune
JOHN TAVARES IS A MAPLE LEAF
Hey man. Imagine a Rantanen or Couturier poll under these same guidelines. Do you think we would hear the same things? People would be in here telling us how much better and younger Rantanen is. Doubt cap, defence gap etc is even mentioned.LOL. Of course it's just bias. That's right.
Marner has almost double the points that Couturier has this year, and has easily outproduced him every year he's been in the league.......so he IS "miles ahead offensively". Marner is a PPG player over his career so far. Couturier is not close to that. Not an opinion. FACT.
And yes, Couturier is better defensively. No argument here. But Marner is the Leaf's BEST defensive player and eats a tonne of minutes on the PK and looks damn good doing it. So he's not too far off him there. FACT.
What's wrong? Don't like facts?
Sidney the Kidney
One last time
- Jun 29, 2009
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I also doubt Colorado fans would be calling Rantanen "miles better offensively" than Couturier while at the same time saying "almost as good defensively" as Couturier.
It's not the ranking of certain players higher, it's the over the top use of hyperbole to do so that ruins discussions.
CatchyTune
JOHN TAVARES IS A MAPLE LEAF
did someone actually say Marner was better defensively? he isnt. but that doesnt mean he is bad in that regard. im seeing the same thing with Barkov and Matthews. Barkov/Couturier are probably both top 5 defensive forwards. so compare 99.9% of the league to them, and they look inferior. Marner is still very good in that regard.
Sidney the Kidney
One last time
- Jun 29, 2009
- 55,815
- 46,982
No, but the person I quoted and the person you quoted said Marner was "almost as good defensively" while talking about them being MILES apart offensively. It's hyperbole. If a 90+ point winger is "miles ahead" offensively of a 75+ point center, then a Selke winner isn't just slightly better defensively than someone who isn't Selke caliber defensively.
Like I said, I don't even care if people prefer Marner. I personally *do* prefer Marner and have gone to bat for him numerous times. I just think the over the top theatrics of certain posters brings actual discussion in these threads down.
Who cares what Couturier did at the same age? Couturier is over PPG this year (since you're using pace for Marner) and has paced for 76 points per 82 over the past 4 years. At 5v5 the last 3 years, Marner isn't that far ahead offensively 5v5 and given Couturier's defense, there's certainly an argument for him being the better 5v5 player. Marner's PP ability might give him the edge overall, but the point pace gap oversells the difference between them as players. There's a reason the Bergeron, O'Reilly, Couturier types are valued so highly.
Holymakinaw
Registered User
Meh. Who cares if you don't like how I deliver my opinion on this often very anti-Leaf board?
I happen to be right.
So.........yay!
You'd never get those polls because it's obviously Rantanen. Most of HF couldn't bring themselves to say Marner, so we get this circus show.
Imagine actually voting that you'd take Pettersson over the league's best goalscorer (or very close to) over the last 5 or so seasons. If Matthews wasn't a Leaf there would be absolute ridicule of the notion to put him up against Eichel, Pettersson, Barzal, Aho, Laine, Couturier, Konecny, Staal (Eric), Komorov, John Scott and Nick Kypreos.
I'm absolutely shocked we've not had a "Matthews vs Verheaghe, Who do you take going forward?"
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LOL. Of course it's just bias. That's right.
Marner has almost double the points that Couturier has this year, and has easily outproduced him every year he's been in the league.......so he IS "miles ahead offensively". Marner is a PPG player over his career so far. Couturier is not close to that. Not an opinion. FACT.
And yes, Couturier is better defensively. No argument here. But Marner is the Leaf's BEST defensive player and eats a tonne of minutes on the PK and looks damn good doing it. So he's not too far off him there. FACT.
What's wrong? Don't like facts?
Physical points sure. PPG pace, only 7 points ahead. 2nd point....do some research, isn't true. Couts is a better goal scorer.
Of course he's better defensively. If you consider Marner miles ahead better offensively, then Couts is miles better defensively. I mean he's a top 5 defensive forward in the NHL, Marner.....maybe in top 20.
Cap hit...obviously Couturier. Now and in the future. Makes 6.5 million less than Marner currently. Will probably make around 8-9 on his next contract.
