The Kingslayer
Registered User
Scoring wise for sure. I have a hard time saying Ovi is generational. I don't consider Mike Bossy or Brett Hull generational players. Generational shots yes haha.
Could this core ever resemble the glory Avs?
- Thread starter Northern Avs Fan
- Start date
- Jan 18, 2016
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Yeah I don’t disagree. As a goal scorer he is obviously but as a player I would say he isn’t.
Tike Myson
Registered User
Funny, I was going to say the same thing. Unless Sakic ends up being a f***ing genius, this is probably the case.
Regarding this generational talk, I wrote this one and a half year ago:
"This is NOT going to be a popular opinion but I think Ovechkin is generational and Crosby is not. In my opinion Ovechkin has a legit chance to be the greatest goal scorer of all time which makes him generational in my opinion.
Of course this all comes down to the question: what do you think generational means? I think it's a label that is used way too loosely.
Crosby is currently the better player, no question about it. But Ovechkins career is more.. history shaking. People talk about him being possibly the greatest goal scorer of all time and adjusted numbers back up this claim. Crosby is elite level player, Crosby is franchise talent, and Crosby has been the best player for multiple years during the last ~10 years, but Crosby doesn't change the history pages by being best in anything if we consider the whole history of the NHL. He is "just" a complete package of being excellent in pretty much every aspect of the game. I feel bad writing this as I think I will be misunderstood. I don't want to downplay Crosby, that's not my intention at all."
"This is NOT going to be a popular opinion but I think Ovechkin is generational and Crosby is not. In my opinion Ovechkin has a legit chance to be the greatest goal scorer of all time which makes him generational in my opinion.
Of course this all comes down to the question: what do you think generational means? I think it's a label that is used way too loosely.
Crosby is currently the better player, no question about it. But Ovechkins career is more.. history shaking. People talk about him being possibly the greatest goal scorer of all time and adjusted numbers back up this claim. Crosby is elite level player, Crosby is franchise talent, and Crosby has been the best player for multiple years during the last ~10 years, but Crosby doesn't change the history pages by being best in anything if we consider the whole history of the NHL. He is "just" a complete package of being excellent in pretty much every aspect of the game. I feel bad writing this as I think I will be misunderstood. I don't want to downplay Crosby, that's not my intention at all."
Wholeheartedly agree that the term "generational" is overused. I also think "elite" gets thrown around way, way too much. My favorite Av of all time is Milan Hejduk, but even I don't think he was an "elite" player. Very, very good and remarkably consistent, yes, but not quite to that level.
I still don't think Ovechkin is generational, even though he most assuredly will go down as one of the greatest of all time. Crosby and McDavid IMO are though. Still torn as to whether Erik Karlsson is.
I still don't think Ovechkin is generational, even though he most assuredly will go down as one of the greatest of all time. Crosby and McDavid IMO are though. Still torn as to whether Erik Karlsson is.
- Feb 24, 2012
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I don't see how Ovi isn't generational. 3 Harts, 3 Pearsons (Lindsey now), 8 Richards (he's won 40% of them all time... 57% of the ones he has been eligible for), a Smythe, and a Ross. He's already 13th in all time goals, with the odds of top 5 very likely. Hell, he could end up 2nd and nobody would be shocked. I'd personally make the argument that he is the greatest goal scorer of all time.
- Jan 18, 2016
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I don’t entirely disagree with this premise. I do think a “generational” talent has to be THAT much better than his peers or bring an element to the game that hasn’t been seen before at an elite level(Karlsson). I think overall as a player Ovi probably is close to generational, but as a goal scorer there’s no question he is. He’s the GOAT goal scorer and that’s obviously a generational part of his game.
Ceremony
blahem
- Jun 8, 2012
- 113,290
- 15,656
Number retirements for people whose careers weren't ended prematurely is a uniquely North American thing and is really quite sad when you think about it
The Avalanche retiring #77 is one of the most cringeworthy things I've ever seen, as is a team not even a quarter of a century old having six numbers out of circulation
Again, I think the current reigning "Best Pure Goal Scorer of All Time" was Brett Hull. Was he generational? I don't think he was. So I'm not quite ready to put Ovechkin there. But I'll admit I'm also not gonna make this a hill to die on or something. It's a good discussion, I'm just personally very, very picky when it comes to labeling players elite or generational.
Anyone who doesn't think #23 belongs up there is a moron.
shadow1
Registered User
- Nov 29, 2008
- 16,595
- 5,244
It’s tough because of the salary cap era. And it’s also tough because a lot of those Avs years took place in a 26 team NHL.
But not impossible. I would argue the 2009-2010 Blackhawks were damn near close to the ‘96 Avs club, aside from the goaltending.
Obviously, they had to retool after losing many let pieces in UFA.
But not impossible. I would argue the 2009-2010 Blackhawks were damn near close to the ‘96 Avs club, aside from the goaltending.
Obviously, they had to retool after losing many let pieces in UFA.
- Feb 24, 2012
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I wouldn’t consider Hull that, and it really isn’t all that close between the two. Hull, had they existed, would have only had 3 Richards, a Hart, and a Pearson... the resumes are night and day different.
- Apr 25, 2006
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The problem with "generational" is we have more than one player labeled as "generational" per generation which kind of defeats the point. That said, Ovi is that and then some. He's more exceptional than Crosby IMO and could be challenging Gretzky's goal record (something that everyone assumed was set in stone for eternity) while playing in an era where it's much more difficult to score goals. His consistency at doing it is what makes him generational.
Tralfamadore
Don't Panic.
- Sep 25, 2011
- 8,713
- 7,390
I mean the glory Avs "only" won 2 cups and had no other finals appearances in their what like 10 year window? We've seen two teams in the past decade win 3 and another with also 2.
I think it's entirely possible this team can win 2 cups.
I think it's entirely possible this team can win 2 cups.
flyfysher
Registered User
- Mar 21, 2012
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Anyone who doesn't think #23 belongs up there is someone I strongly disagree with.
FTFY!
(FWIW, I wouldn't argue against your point)
Anyone who doesn't think #23 belongs up there is someone I strongly disagree with.
FTFY!
I'll strongly disagree with people who think Adam Foote doesn't belong up there. Anyone who thinks 23 doesn't belong up there gets milkshake'd.
