Composition of the defense...

[BruinDust]

But Trotman up you know he is our 1st pairing D, and I apologize I got mixed up, I see lot of JB name here and I can't see why

I also thought that this is NHL right? And it sounds kind of funny when you think about that we have to keep a guy who is not that special and push him into the 1st pairing because if we waived him we would lose him, is that the right way to build a playoff team
Build a weak D group so you won't lose your 7th D to waivers, man that sounds funny.

Morrow-McQuaid is the 3rd pairing I was picturing us during the last year and now we won't see him up, we are going to see a guy who is slow and a regular healthy scratch, but he will play because he is tough to play against

Sadly one-way contracts dictate a lot of who makes the team coming out of camp in salary cap era. If most of the spots are taken by guys on one-way deals, then a guy on a two-way has to REALLY impress (see Pastrnak) to bump a guy on a one-way deal to the AHL.

It's not really about losing the 7th D on waivers, it's more about him clearing waivers and having to pay him his NHL salary to play in the AHL, which most teams balk at unless it's absolutely a necessity like LA did with Richards last year.

 

[wintersej]

Trotman will be 25 next month. Hoe much upside is there? He's only played in 29 NHL games and didn't show much.

Boychuk had 5 games at the same age.

 

[BB88]

Sadly one-way contracts dictate a lot of who makes the team coming out of camp in salary cap era. If most of the spots are taken by guys on one-way deals, then a guy on a two-way has to REALLY impress (see Pastrnak) to bump a guy on a one-way deal to the AHL.

It's not really about losing the 7th D on waivers, it's more about him clearing waivers and having to pay him his NHL salary to play in the AHL, which most teams balk at unless it's absolutely a necessity like LA did with Richards last year.

I doubt Trotman would have a high cap hit in the AHL and someone would take him? C.Miller has a .600M cap hit, that creates room.

I'd understand if we were talking a bit bigger salary.

I'm going with the man himself Haggs and say

Chara-Rangers steal
Krug-Seidenberg
Irwin sadly- McQuaid
Trotman

 

[reillysmith38]

But Trotman up you know he is our 1st pairing D, and I apologize I got mixed up, I see lot of JB name here and I can't see why

I also thought that this is NHL right? And it sounds kind of funny when you think about that we have to keep a guy who is not that special and push him into the 1st pairing because if we waived him we would lose him, is that the right way to build a playoff team
Build a weak D group so you won't lose your 7th D to waivers, man that sounds funny.

Morrow-McQuaid is the 3rd pairing I was picturing us during the last year and now we won't see him up, we are going to see a guy who is slow and a regular healthy scratch, but he will play because he is tough to play against

And also Seids out after next season for cap reasons and too many prospects pushing into lineup, use the money for top players.

I have a secret hope that Trotman can be effective.

Chara - Seidenberg, hopefully both of them are over injuries and can rekindle their shut down magic for this year.

Krug - Trotman, buddy Trotman, please come up big we need you. Krug too, don't be a liability on defense.

Morrow - McQuaid, whatever really. Morrow can help QB the powerplay. Irwin is slotted in that role right now with his big shot.

Our defense is hinging on Krug and RD (via trade/FA/Trotman/Prospects) being acceptable top 4 defenseman. This is the toughest to swallow. Krug will at least be playing for a contract.

If Chara and Seidenberg suck, we are doomed anyway.

 

[wintersej]

Our offense died when he came up, we'd have only Krug who can hit 25+ points next season, that's top 10 pick level D.

Does anyone see him in our longterm plans because I can't see it and I'd rather give someone the chance to step up who is in our longterm plans and let him find his game next year so he can be an impact player hopefully 2016-.

Chara-Zboril
Carlo-Krug
Linus-O'Gara
Grzelnyk- Lauzon
McQuaid-C.Miller

are ahead of him and in our future plans, that's without trades/signings.

1) The 2011 team that won the Cup had only two D men who scored more than 16 points. 16!

2) Saying the offense dried up when Trotman came up is intellectually dishonest. Lucic/Spooner/Pastrnak stopped scoring too, and they didn't often play with Chara/Hamilton. Causation != correlation.

 

[BruinDust]

I doubt Trotman would have a high cap hit in the AHL and someone would take him? C.Miller has a .600M cap hit, that creates room.

I'd understand if we were talking a bit bigger salary.

I'm going with the man himself Haggs and say

Chara-Rangers steal
Krug-Seidenberg
Irwin sadly- McQuaid
Trotman

I'm not sure your understanding what I was saying. Not trying to be rude or anything.

It's got nothing to do with Trotman's cap hit, or Irwin's, or who-ever's.

What I am saying is teams generally don't want to pay guys an NHL salary to play in the AHL.

If they put a guy on a one-way deal on waivers they are pretty much hoping another team claims them and takes that salary commitment off the books.

Say Trotman doesn't make the team coming out of camp and is put on waivers to be assigned to Providence. His one-way deal means he's getting his 600k no matter what happens.

Most teams (Toronto being the biggest exception) don't want to pay anyone 600k(league minimum) or more to play in the AHL. Got nothing to do with the cap. Any player on a one-way deal who clears waivers and is assigned to the AHL up to 925k I believe comes off the cap anyways. Anything above that stays on the cap, so teams can't bury huge salaries like the Rangers did with Wade Redden. This wouldn't impact Trotman or Irwin as they both earn less than 925k and their whole hit comes off if cleared and re-assigned. But doubtful Jacobs wants to pay anyone 600k+ to play for Providence.

Not an absolute, but a one-way deal is almost a guarantee a player makes the big club coming out of camp. Bruins management anticipated Trotman being ready for 2015-16, hench why the 2nd year of his deal was a one-way deal.

 

[BB88]

1) The 2011 team that won the Cup had only two D men who scored more than 16 points. 16!

2) Saying the offense dried up when Trotman came up is intellectually dishonest. Lucic/Spooner/Pastrnak stopped scoring too, and they didn't often play with Chara/Hamilton. Causation != correlation.

Like I earlier said we don't have an elite D, elite shutdown D that we had before, we have one of the weakest D groups in the league and we have one of the weakest wing groups when it comes to scoring. So it's not going to be pretty.

And also how much did Hamilton's injury effect on Kids line?, they didn't have a puck mover who can push offense and clear D-zone by flying.

So again if we'd have an elite D it would be a different coversation, but our D right now is one of the weakest in the both ends of the ice.

I'm not sure your understanding what I was saying. Not trying to be rude or anything.

It's got nothing to do with Trotman's cap hit, or Irwin's, or who-ever's.

What I am saying is teams generally don't want to pay guys an NHL salary to play in the AHL.

If they put a guy on a one-way deal on waivers they are pretty much hoping another team claims them and takes that salary commitment off the books.

Say Trotman doesn't make the team coming out of camp and is put on waivers to be assigned to Providence. His one-way deal means he's getting his 600k no matter what happens.

Most teams (Toronto being the biggest exception) don't want to pay anyone 600k(league minimum) or more to play in the AHL. Got nothing to do with the cap. Any player on a one-way deal who clears waivers and is assigned to the AHL up to 925k I believe comes off the cap anyways. Anything above that stays on the cap, so teams can't bury huge salaries like the Rangers did with Wade Redden. This wouldn't impact Trotman or Irwin as they both earn less than 925k and their whole hit comes off if cleared and re-assigned. But doubtful Jacobs wants to pay anyone 600k+ to play for Providence.

Not an absolute, but a one-way deal is almost a guarantee a player makes the big club coming out of camp. Bruins management anticipated Trotman being ready for 2015-16, hench why the 2nd year of his deal was a one-way deal.

But wouldn't he get picked if he was put on waivers, I bet team like Arizone/Toronto would grab him and Boston has money and to me it just loks silly if you don't want to possible pay .700M more to ice the best team possible, but I may be alone on this one.

To me our team can't afford gifts like this to other teams, if a player deserves a spot he should play.
But thanks for clearing, I must have mixed up cap hit vs salary.

 

[Fire Sweeney]

Like I earlier said we don't have an elite D, elite shutdown D that we had before, we have one of the weakest D groups in the league and we have one of the weakest wing groups when it comes to scoring. So it's not going to be pretty.

And also how much did Hamilton's injury effect on Kids line?, they didn't have a puck mover who can push offense and clear D-zone by flying.

So again if we'd have an elite D it would be a different coversation, but our D right now is one of the weakest in the both ends of the ice.



But wouldn't he get picked if he was put on waivers, I bet team like Arizone/Toronto would grab him and Boston has money and to me it just loks silly if you don't want to possible pay .700M more to ice the best team possible, but I may be alone on this one.

But thanks for clearing, I must have mixed up cap hit vs salary.

Why ? Every team has at least one Trotman type, usually younger and on a 2-way contract.

 

[finchster]

Boychuk had 5 games at the same age.

Boychuk won defensemen of the year in the AHL and was an offensive top pairing guy in the AHL. Trotman? Not so much. Bruins have too many 7/6/5 defencemen, I don't care about Trotman at all on this team

 

[BB88]

Why ? Every team has at least one Trotman type, usually younger and on a 2-way contract.

Arizona helped us before, let them help again.

But my point is that I think this thinking is funny, that we have to put a player into our 1st pairing because otherwise we would have to waive him.
That's one way to get a top10 pick.

 

[Estlin]

I agree 100%

I wanted Morrow to stay up last season when he played well during his brief stint.

My best guess on how Julien will go barring any other changes.

Chara - Seidenberg
Krug - McQuaid
Irwin - Miller/Trotman

Woof

[...]

I would insert Morrow AND C.Miller. Keep them away from the other puck-mover in Krug and run these pairs.

Chara - C.Miller
Krug - McQuaid
Morrow - Seidenberg

If 33/44/54 are locks, then this is the D line-up with the biggest upside and puck-moving ability. Keep Trotman and K.Miller for depth. Irwin can be sent to Providence for all I care about him. He's Bartkowski 2.0.

I'd carry 8 D on the roster but the Bruins never carry a full 23 man group.

Late in games with one goal leads they can reunite Chara-Seidenberg and limit Morrow and C.Millers ice if need be.

Will never happen though.

I agree with what you project as the team's six defensemen next season. God, that's a weak set of players. But, Claude will be Claude.

I also agree with your preferred line-up on defense. Who cares if there a couple of rookies there? This team will not be very competitive next season, so let them learn the ropes in the NHL and not in the AHL. I like the idea of C. Miller, Krug and Morrow on each pairing. My only change would be to drop Krug and promote Morrow. I am still not convinced that Krug is anything more than a bottom-pairing defenseman.

 

[wintersej]

Like I earlier said we don't have an elite D, elite shutdown D that we had before, we have one of the weakest D groups in the league and we have one of the weakest wing groups when it comes to scoring. So it's not going to be pretty.

And also how much did Hamilton's injury effect on Kids line?, they didn't have a puck mover who can push offense and clear D-zone by flying.

This is where some of the more advanced stats really come in handy. Spooner only played 15% of his even strength time with Dougie. In that time the team had a 4.5 GAA. Now, that was only 40 odd minutes, because the Spooner line and the Chara/Hamilton pairing had very different deployments. Also a small sample size of 30 minutes,, but Spooner + Trotman had a GAA of 0.00.

Lucic/Spooner/Pasta stopping scoring in their own.

 

[BB88]

This is where some of the more advanced stats really come in handy. Spooner only played 15% of his even strength time with Dougie. In that time the team had a 4.5 GAA. Now, that was only 40 odd minutes, because the Spooner line and the Chara/Hamilton pairing had very different deployments. Also a small sample size of 30 minutes,, but Spooner + Trotman had a GAA of 0.00.

Lucic/Spooner/Pasta stopping scoring in their own.

How much did they play with Krug and how did it change due to Hamilton injury? How much will they play with Krug if he is the only puck mover on the team and how much would it change to last year? Having 1 puck movers nstead of 2 limits the offensive help quote badly.

And like I said we'd be having a different conversation if we had an elite D which can shutdown anyone and keep the scoring low, but we have very weak D on both ends, low scoring support and not elite shutdown D level in the own end, we are a bottom10 team with that boring D which can't shutdown people on elite level.
Also how much does this team remind of the 2011 team when Chara-Seids/(Jb) were in their prime? To me this looks like a different team with the Kids line going with elite speed.

 

[chizzler]

People around here keep praising a puck moving defenseman, but the problem is the system. They don't skate the puck out. It's a defensive system that cycles and cycles. What's a puck moved going to do when he has to throw the puck along the boards? When was the last successful puck moved? Bourque?

 

[bb_fan]

Boychuk had 5 games at the same age.

so what?

theres tons of 25 year old kids in the AHL.... are we supposed to think that just because Boychuck was once too, that they are all future top pairing defensemen of forwards.

I just find that that statement gets tossed around here a lot as if it actually meant something.

it doesn't.

 

[bb_fan]

This is where some of the more advanced stats really come in handy. Spooner only played 15% of his even strength time with Dougie. In that time the team had a 4.5 GAA. Now, that was only 40 odd minutes, because the Spooner line and the Chara/Hamilton pairing had very different deployments. Also a small sample size of 30 minutes,, but Spooner + Trotman had a GAA of 0.00.

Lucic/Spooner/Pasta stopping scoring in their own.

I'm beginning to think I could use 'advanced' stats to convince my ex that I actually look like brad pitt.....

 

[Stone Clode]

so what?

theres tons of 25 year old kids in the AHL.... are we supposed to think that just because Boychuck was once too, that they are all future top pairing defensemen of forwards.

I just find that that statement gets tossed around here a lot as if it actually meant something.

it doesn't.

At the same time, neither does the fact that Boychuk won the Eddie Shore award that year either. Big deal, other Shore award winners include: Andy Delmore, Danny Groulx, Marc-Andre Gragnani, Mark Barberio, TJ Brennan, and Andrew Hutchinson. It doesn't necessarily mean success in the NHL. Just like not winning the award doesn't mean not having success. It can be either or.

They are just comparing their potential career arcs, that's it. Both started to peak and develop into their own later in their careers. Zach Trotman has taken huge strides since he was drafted and right now. Hell, the guy was an overager when he was drafted. He's constantly gotten better, though, year by year.

 

[Healthy Wrap]

Assuming no other moves are made this offseason:

Chara-Trotman
Krug-Seidenberg
Morrow-McQuaid
Irwin/K. Miller

If Chara and Seidenberg can bounce back, and that's a huge if, this defense isn't terrible. Each pair has someone who can get the puck up the ice (Trotman, Krug, Morrow). I know Trotman isn't a speedster by any means, but I thought he did a decent job in the transition game last year. Still don't know why McQuaid was resigned for the kind of money/term that he got, when K. Miller could perform the same role for a fraction of the price.

 

[RedeyeRocketeer]

 

[Caper Bruins fan]

Assuming no other moves are made this offseason:

Chara-Trotman
Krug-Seidenberg
Morrow-McQuaid
Irwin/K. Miller

If Chara and Seidenberg can bounce back, and that's a huge if, this defense isn't terrible. Each pair has someone who can get the puck up the ice (Trotman, Krug, Morrow). I know Trotman isn't a speedster by any means, but I thought he did a decent job in the transition game last year. Still don't know why McQuaid was resigned for the kind of money/term that he got, when K. Miller could perform the same role for a fraction of the price.

In his prime Chara could play with just about anybody and be effective. I hope he can play with someone better than Trotman. That second pairing scares me big time . Putting Krug on the 2nd pair and having him face better opposing forwards doesn't play to his strengths, it just might expose his weaknesses . Seidenberg HAS to better than he was last year or he shouldn't be on the ice let alone the 2nd pair.

 

[BB88]

Just watched the CSNNEn Sports tonight and they weren't happy at all with our D "Major issues on the defensive end" and seeing the list of:

Chara
Seidenberg
Krug
McQuaid
K.Miller
Irwin
Trotman

C.Miller, Morrow expected to start for providence.
Makes you depressed and screams top 5-10 pick, it's painfull to see that like that.

I want to see them shutting down Tampa's/Pen's offense and somehow surviving their checking or going into offense with any kind of speed.

If Columbus wins the Franson race then they are going to be top teams in the East, one team that passed us flying. Now that Rangers are probably able to sign Stepan and fit him under the cap I doubt they are moving any D-man, they risk losing Yandle for nothing and go for it for the 1 last time but I just can't see it, not going to see them in the Eastern finals next year.

Hawks have to sell cap to fit under the cap but with Oduya going to Dallas they will move forwards.

Tampa is one team that has D depth and cap issues, could that be Sweeney's plan/focus now?

 

[BadBruins]

Trotman has a lot of things going for him, but I'm skeptical of a 25 year old with 3 years college and 3 years pro suddenly getting penciled onto the top pairing. Him looking good in Providence and not looking out of place during his short 2nd stint in the NHL isn't exactly a glowing endorsement. I'm sure Sharks fans were pretty high on Irwin when he was 24 in the NHL and playing 19 minutes/game in their middle pairing down the stretch. At that age, with that experience, it's very likely he is what he is. He's a #6-9 guy until he proves otherwise IMO.

I'm fine going young and inexperienced. Just pick a direction. Will be a tough season to watch as a fan if we have to witness a bottom third team dressing Irwin/K.Miller over Morrow/C.Miller.

 

[wintersej]

I'm beginning to think I could use 'advanced' stats to convince my ex that I actually look like brad pitt.....

I don't see how those stats don't show that losing Hamilton had nothing to do with the Spooner line stopping scoring since they didn't play together that often.

 

[BB88]

Trotman has a lot of things going for him, but I'm skeptical of a 25 year old with 3 years college and 3 years pro suddenly getting penciled onto the top pairing. Him looking good in Providence and not looking out of place during his short 2nd stint in the NHL isn't exactly a glowing endorsement. I'm sure Sharks fans were pretty high on Irwin when he was 24 in the NHL and playing 19 minutes/game in their middle pairing down the stretch. At that age, with that experience, it's very likely he is what he is. He's a #6-9 guy until he proves otherwise IMO.

I'm fine going young and inexperienced. Just pick a direction. Will be a tough season to watch as a fan if we have to witness a bottom third team dressing Irwin/K.Miller over Morrow/C.Miller.

I agree, if you are going to ice a team that can't fight then play kids who are in your future plans and pay the price, let them develop, find their game so they can hopefully be strong players for us in 2016-.
The season would almost seem pointless if we play vets who will leave after the season and do this in 2016-17 and watch them struggle then when you want to win and your team is good enough to fight.

I don't see how those stats don't show that losing Hamilton had nothing to do with the Spooner line stopping scoring since they didn't play together that often.

But when you have only 1 strong puck mover instead of 2 it changes things.
Krug can't play behind everyline every shift.

We need balance, we don't have that, it's slow, not that skilled D group with troubles on both ends, not strong offensively, not strong defensively.
I can't see that many great passers or skaters, who is going to make that great pass or skate the puck out, who's going to win a puck race. I'm afraid how bad they would look against Tampa and their offensive pressure, how will they shutdown Pens offense. It's depressing to see Toronto having a better D group and they want the 1st overall and we want to be in the playoffs.

 

[captain stone]

Trotman will be 25 next month. Hoe much upside is there? He's only played in 29 NHL games and didn't show much.

Thank you.

Claiming that Trotman actually has upside is laughable. He would be so lucky to have a career that Matt Irwin has had already.