Post-Game Talk: Cole's Plus/Minus: Pens vs. Flyers - HOCKEY IS BACK!

[Whale Mingo]

It took time for Hossa and Crosby to gel...

Did they ever get that chance? If memory serves (and there is no guarantee it does), wasn't Crosby hurt when Hossa got here and then Hossa got hurt in his first or second game here? I though they played less than 5 games together before the playoffs.

 

[#66]

Really? I think Hossa is the only guy Crosby ever truly did have chemistry with. People talk about a guy like Kunitz, but chemistry doesn't equal "playing with each other for years." When Hossa was here it was the only time Crosby had someone to give and go with, i.e. it was the only time Crosby played with someone that could use his finesse game to the its fullest extent. I don't think that just because Crosby has a "gritty star" look to his game doesn't mean those same players are who he's best with. Of course, it's all about creating space. If he played with Perry or Hossa I don't think you'd see a world of difference.

I never thought they clicked either. It was more about two great players playing together rather than some kind of chemistry.

I think Palffy showed good chemistry with Sid and thats about it as far as skilled players go.

Most skilled players want the puck a lot, including Sid. So when they're put together they clash sometimes. I think a player like AO or Kovy would just turn Sid into an outlet pass. IMO a good winger for Sid would be one that can hold the puck, work give and goes and do more than just leave the defensive zone and shoot. Players like Elias or JPom fit the bill.

 

[Tender Rip]

Did you see the game yesterday? Adams was awesome and a big reason for the W. I've got no problem with him finishing up his contract here as the 12th forward with minimal 5 on 5 play and a lot of pk work.

He had an awesome save off the line and was part of a successful PK. That is all. It is also everything you can expect from Adams, and by his standards clearly this was a good game. But it doesn't make him awesome nor does it invalidate opinions that he should be one of the first guys - if not the first - to be taken off the team if we get a forward addition at some point. More so as Vitale is better alround right now.

Nothing against Craig Adams; he is a straight up warrior and you gotta respect what he does for a team.... which is always 110% of what he has to offer.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Did they ever get that chance? If memory serves (and there is no guarantee it does), wasn't Crosby hurt when Hossa got here and then Hossa got hurt in his first or second game here? I though they played less than 5 games together before the playoffs.

Yep. But it took them until late second round or so before they showed any real chemistry, then they were pretty sick.

 

[NeedleInTheHay]

He had an awesome save off the line and was part of a successful PK. That is all. It is also everything you can expect from Adams, and by his standards clearly this was a good game. But it doesn't make him awesome nor does it invalidate opinions that he should be one of the first guys - if not the first - to be taken off the team if we get a forward addition at some point. More so as Vitale is better alround right now.

Nothing against Craig Adams; he is a straight up warrior and you gotta respect what he does for a team.... which is always 110% of what he has to offer.

I agree hence why i said minimal 5 on 5 play which allows crosby and malkin to be double shifted on the 4th line.

Also if they trade for a forward, there's a decent chance they would send a tangradi or jeffery back in the trade so you would still need a 12th forward to do the dirty work.

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

I never thought they clicked either. It was more about two great players playing together rather than some kind of chemistry.

Sorry, but what the hell is the difference? Yeah they're both great, hence why they were good together. Call it whatever you want. I'm just not sure how to great players can play well together, yet they don't click. I'm honestly not trying to make a huge deal about it, but I'm not seeing the logic here.

Agree on Palffy though. Funny because offensively I think he was pretty much Hossa but not as good of a skater.

 

[M0NTY26]

Sorry, but what the hell is the difference? Yeah they're both great, hence why they were good together. Call it whatever you want. I'm just not sure how to great players can play well together, yet they don't click. I'm honestly not trying to make a huge deal about it, but I'm not seeing the logic here.

Agree on Palffy though. Funny because offensively I think he was pretty much Hossa but not as good of a skater.

I understand what they're saying. Two good players will undoubtably do good together and produce, but there is a difference between built chemistry and natural chemistry.

Built is obviously two good players playing with each other enough to learn the others play style, then adapt to it. Sid and Hossa were just starting to get here. For the most part, they just let their skills take over games.

Natural is like Neal and Geno. Instantly, their play styles just fit and complimented each other. They know what the other is doing before they do it. They don't need to communicate verbally on the ice, because they just feel where to go.

At least, that's my interpretation.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Really? I think Hossa is the only guy Crosby ever truly did have chemistry with. People talk about a guy like Kunitz, but chemistry doesn't equal "playing with each other for years." When Hossa was here it was the only time Crosby had someone to give and go with, i.e. it was the only time Crosby played with someone that could use his finesse game to the its fullest extent. I don't think that just because Crosby has a "gritty star" look to his game doesn't mean those same players are who he's best with. Of course, it's all about creating space. If he played with Perry or Hossa I don't think you'd see a world of difference.

I think Tangradi has completed more give and goes with Sid in 2 or 3 shifts than Dupuis or Kunitz have in 2 or 3 years. He has that ability and the physical attributes imo. He needs to figure out how to get his brain working at an NHL level though. I really think that's his biggest hurdle. He looks like he's over-thinking every single play.

 

[Pancakes]

Really? I think Hossa is the only guy Crosby ever truly did have chemistry with. People talk about a guy like Kunitz, but chemistry doesn't equal "playing with each other for years." When Hossa was here it was the only time Crosby had someone to give and go with, i.e. it was the only time Crosby played with someone that could use his finesse game to the its fullest extent. I don't think that just because Crosby has a "gritty star" look to his game doesn't mean those same players are who he's best with. Of course, it's all about creating space. If he played with Perry or Hossa I don't think you'd see a world of difference.

I dunno I thought Kunitz had absolutely perfect chemistry with Crosby when Sid was on that 25 game point streak. I know that's not a particularly large sample size but I thought Kunitz had a respectable amount to do with how well Crosby was playing at that time. He was getting into open areas for Sid and he was also passing the puck to Sid better than I've ever seen him.

I think in general Kunitz and Sid click pretty well. Kunitz just doesn't have high end skill so it's never going to look particularly pretty between him and Sid. But they do read off each other pretty well.

 

[Ogrezilla]

I dunno I thought Kunitz had absolutely perfect chemistry with Crosby when Sid was on that 25 game point streak. I know that's not a particularly large sample size but I thought Kunitz had a respectable amount to do with how well Crosby was playing at that time. He was getting into open areas for Sid and he was also passing the puck to Sid better than I've ever seen him.

I think in general Kunitz and Sid click pretty well. Kunitz just doesn't have high end skill so it's never going to look particularly pretty between him and Sid. But they do read off each other pretty well.

Kunitz is an acceptable number 2 guy on a line. He was a great 3rd wheel with Geno and Neal. He would be a great 3rd wheel for Sid as well. The problem with him is that he doesn't create enough on his own to really draw much attention away from Sid. Teams will focus entirely on Sid and let Kunitz or Dupuis try to beat them.

 

[Pancakes]

Kunitz is an acceptable number 2 guy on a line. He was a great 3rd wheel with Geno and Neal. He would be a great 3rd wheel for Sid as well. The problem with him is that he doesn't create enough on his own to really draw much attention away from Sid. Teams will focus entirely on Sid and let Kunitz or Dupuis try to beat them.

I'd agree, but I think despite being a third wheel type Kunitz is still a legit top six winger. He's not Pascal Dupuis. He belongs in the top six and would be in the top six on plenty of teams.

I don't think Sid particularly needs a sniper to go with him and Kunitz. I think he'd work just as well with a playmaker. Sid can adjust his game depending on who he is playing with. I think Sid would work just as well with something like Tanguay who is more of a playmaker as he would with a bonifide sniper like a Thomas Vanek. All Sid needs is someone else on that line with some kind of top six talent whether that be with playmaking or scoring and the rest will fall into place.

Malkin is different imo. Malkin needs a sniper like Neal, because Malkin's whole game is opening up space for his linemates. Sid's game is more versatile I think.

 

[Whale Mingo]

Yep. But it took them until late second round or so before they showed any real chemistry, then they were pretty sick.

OK. Hossa was our leading scorer in the payoffs that year as well.

Rally wish he'd have stayed.

 

[Ogrezilla]

I'd agree, but I think despite being a third wheel type Kunitz is still a legit top six winger. He's not Pascal Dupuis. He belongs in the top six and would be in the top six on plenty of teams.

I don't think Sid particularly needs a sniper to go with him and Kunitz. I think he'd work just as well with a playmaker. Sid can adjust his game depending on who he is playing with. I think Sid would work just as well with something like Tanguay who is more of a playmaker as he would with a bonifide sniper like a Thomas Vanek. All Sid needs is someone else on that line with some kind of top six talent whether that be with playmaking or scoring and the rest will fall into place.

Malkin is different imo. Malkin needs a sniper like Neal, because Malkin's whole game is opening up space for his linemates. Sid's game is more versatile I think.

absolutely. He'd be a perfect 3rd wheel guy on a top 6 line.