Management Claude Julien - Part Deux

[bp13]

Chia brought in Connolly.

True. That just furthers my point. One fewer guy supposedly part of a front office "roster change".

 

[Therick67]

Chia brought in Connolly.

Too bad he didn't take him with him..

 

[SPLBRUIN]

Firing Claude and having him go to Montreal would be my nightmare scenario. Firing the Bruin's winningest coach who has pulled a rabbit out of his hat the past two seasons in which he was working with a lot of rabbit turds would be the dumbest thing management could do. This roster is a result of the past two GMs, and is filled with non-factor players, washed up players no other team wants, and has had a lot more subtraction of quality than addition over the past couple seasons. Complete lack of depth and poo for defense has reared its ugly head down the stretch both seasons, as the talent is not there and the players are worn down due to no depth in certain areas. But, yeah, Claude cannot adjust as evidenced by this mediocre team being in the top 5 in goals scored, and competing for a playoff spot despite having a roster that has AHLers and bottom 6 players being plugged into the top 6 all season, and having pure trash to work with defensively. Sure, fire him and let him go help the Habs overachieve and watch as the Bs take a step backwards coaching-wise.

Claude Julien is basically Michel Therrien with a friendlier face, both are strong system coaches, nothing more, nothing less. The Habs will only go as far as Price takes them, so if Hab fans expect to see a stronger product on the ice they are dreaming. The Habs problems this year were lack of scoring and shaky goaltending, many nights they would outplay their opponents soundly, but they just couldn't score, then their backup goalies would let in a softy or two, game over. Therrien has dominated the great Julien, in fact, make him look clueless most nights, but ya go ahead and convince yourself that Julien is this great coach and that the Habs will soar with him, I doubt that very much.

 

[Mr. Make-Believe]

...

It has nothing to do for me with a disjoint between management and coaching staff.

Very little to do shootout choices or which defenceman played where.

To me it comes down to what was said last night.

Before the game, Bergeron was asked what the key to winning would be. His answer was "sticking to our system". The Bruins did that... and they could only muster one lucky goal against a team with no stake in winning or losing that is by most accounts - not as good as the Bruins.

What that tells ME, is that the "system" is no longer effective. It was said that there would be adjustments made in how the team played before the season started. That was either a lie or a miscalculation. Either way, it's something that needs to be addressed.

 

[HockeyMomx2]

Pittsburgh just did it and they're better for it. Took 2 tries, but a risk is better than the norm at this point.

Pittsburgh has enough talent on its roster from top to bottom to be able to play well under anyone who can keep them motivated. This team does not have the level or depth of talent that Pittsburgh does.

 

[HockeyMomx2]

This team is has been doing what that Devils team was doing before Clode got fired. Go read articles from when it happened. Its identical to our situation. I've been saying it for about 3 years now. He has to go. Thanks for the cup and the good you've done but its time.

Get me Dineen.

You must have missed the more recent articles interviewing Amorello (sp?) and him admitting that firing Claude was his biggest regret and that had he known or realized some of the situation that he didn't at the time he would never have let him go. Using NJ doing it as they did is not a good example when the powers that make those decisions admit it was a wrong move.

 

[HockeyMomx2]

Claude Julien is basically Michel Therrien with a friendlier face, both are strong system coaches, nothing more, nothing less. The Habs will only go as far as Price takes them, so if Hab fans expect to see a stronger product on the ice they are dreaming. The Habs problems this year were lack of scoring and shaky goaltending, many nights they would outplay their opponents soundly, but they just couldn't score, then their backup goalies would let in a softy or two, game over. Therrien has dominated the great Julien, in fact, make him look clueless most nights, but ya go ahead and convince yourself that Julien is this great coach and that the Habs will soar with him, I doubt that very much.

Pretty sure in the games that mattered, as in playoffs, it was Julien who was smiling/laughing when all was said and done.

 

[HiyaGeorgii]

I feel for Claude. I think of the Boychuk trade right before last year, and how Chiarelli kept saying he got "chips" for later on and he turned them into 4th liner Brett Connolly. Chiarelli is the real culprit here IMO. Just not enough from his drafts. They may have done better UDFA wise then draft wise and that's bad.

 

[Danton Heineken]

I feel for Claude. I think of the Boychuk trade right before last year, and how Chiarelli kept saying he got "chips" for later on and he turned them into 4th liner Brett Connolly. Chiarelli is the real culprit here IMO. Just not enough from his drafts. They may have done better UDFA wise then draft wise and that's bad.

Yeah, I'm really glad they drafted you Jeremy.

 

[TwineTickler]

Looks like CJ is doing some juggling. Spoons with Loui and Krejci.... Talbot centering 3rd line??

 

[bp13]

...

It has nothing to do for me with a disjoint between management and coaching staff.

Very little to do shootout choices or which defenceman played where.

To me it comes down to what was said last night.

Before the game, Bergeron was asked what the key to winning would be. His answer was "sticking to our system". The Bruins did that... and they could only muster one lucky goal against a team with no stake in winning or losing that is by most accounts - not as good as the Bruins.

What that tells ME, is that the "system" is no longer effective. It was said that there would be adjustments made in how the team played before the season started. That was either a lie or a miscalculation. Either way, it's something that needs to be addressed.

Can't argue with that. It's the system that has them right where they are today...91 points through 80 games. It comes down to the judgment of whether this roster should have more than 91 points at this point.

I think it's near a top 10 team in terms of the forward roster. Not top 5, but probably near top 10. I think the defense is easily bottom 10, maybe bottom 5. So, I think 91 points is probably at or slightly more than I expected. But that's just me.

 

[bp13]

Looks like CJ is doing some juggling. Spoons with Loui and Krejci.... Talbot centering 3rd line??

Krejci sucks right now and Loui really seemed to be going last night. I guess throwing a guy on that line with more offensive ability than Beleskey probably helps.

 

[SPLBRUIN]

Pretty sure in the games that mattered, as in playoffs, it was Julien who was smiling/laughing when all was said and done.

Keep living in the past, that's what the Julien supporters are doing. While I will be forever grateful for the SC he brought us, one cannot survive on past glories forever. If they miss the playoffs again, that is a massive failure considering where we were in the standings, not to mention last year's debacle.

 

[Spanky185]

Claude is still under contract for 2 years, right? so even if the Bruins dismiss him they can deny MTL to talk to him. Or they could just pay him to stay home. Probably not the best PR to do that, and that's kind of a d move, but the Bruins brass can control who he coaches for, if any where until the extension he signed expires.

 

[SPLBRUIN]

Looks like CJ is doing some juggling. Spoons with Loui and Krejci.... Talbot centering 3rd line??

If Talbot is centering our 3rd line, well that is just plain sad and pretty well sums up Julien's hockey philosophy.

 

[TwineTickler]

If Talbot is centering our 3rd line, well that is just plain sad and pretty well sums up Julien's hockey philosophy.

Practice combos based on jersey color:
Spooner-Krejci-Loui
Marchy-Bergy-Stemp
Talbot-Beleskey-Kelly-Pasta
Ferraro-Acciari-Vatrano-Connolly
12 retweets 65 likes


That's the practice update. We shall see what shakes out tomorrow night

 

[Mr. Make-Believe]

Can't argue with that. It's the system that has them right where they are today...91 points through 80 games. It comes down to the judgment of whether this roster should have more than 91 points at this point.

I think it's near a top 10 team in terms of the forward roster. Not top 5, but probably near top 10. I think the defense is easily bottom 10, maybe bottom 5. So, I think 91 points is probably at or slightly more than I expected. But that's just me.

Where they're at right now is CERTAINLY better than where I thought they'd be at the beginning ofnthe year. Not two ways about it. Won't deny it.

However, at what point do one's expectations change? With more information, shouldn't an educated guess (with more education) be adjusted?

It did for me (in the games following the deadline) and it has again (in the games following those).

It leaves me flummoxed. I don't know what the right move is.

 

[Jean_Jacket41]

...

It has nothing to do for me with a disjoint between management and coaching staff.

Very little to do shootout choices or which defenceman played where.

To me it comes down to what was said last night.

Before the game, Bergeron was asked what the key to winning would be. His answer was "sticking to our system". The Bruins did that... and they could only muster one lucky goal against a team with no stake in winning or losing that is by most accounts - not as good as the Bruins.

What that tells ME, is that the "system" is no longer effective. It was said that there would be adjustments made in how the team played before the season started. That was either a lie or a miscalculation. Either way, it's something that needs to be addressed.

Is the system hinder the team to score goals on the PP? Cause ultimately, again yesterday, that's what killed Bruins momentum.

Two hug PP early in the first. But just like they did 8 times the past 11 games, they end up the game with 0 PP goal. Record in those 8 games? 0-7-1. When they have scored? 3-0-0.

The NHL is a league where first goals means a lot for success. Only one team in the league wins less than 50% when scoring 1st (Canucks at 0.485) while only 4 teams win 40% or better in games they are trailing.

Bruins are middle of the pack in both stats at 0.689 scoring 1st and 0.286 trailing first.

They have allowed the first goal 8 times the past 11 games.

Abysmal PP and trailing 1st. These are a big reason for yesterday loss and the record the past 11 games. Much more than the system. And often, these two are tied together.

 

[bp13]

Where they're at right now is CERTAINLY better than where I thought they'd be at the beginning ofnthe year. Not two ways about it. Won't deny it.

However, at what point do one's expectations change? With more information, shouldn't an educated guess (with more education) be adjusted?

It did for me (in the games following the deadline) and it has again (in the games following those).

It leaves me flummoxed. I don't know what the right move is.

If they miss, I think the move they WILL make is firing CJ. I have no idea of whether it will be the "right" move, but I won't fight it like I would have last season. I don't think it will matter much and I think he'll likely go on to beat us with another team (Montreal), but somebody probably needs to pay for another late-season collapse. He's the logical guy.

Ultimately I'm extremely confident that the issue is a lack of talent on defense. If they don't fix that the coach is irrelevant. They can't compete for a Cup with a defense anywhere near as bad as this one, and no coach could. Like you say, this is probably a better position than you could expect given this team's talent level.

 

[BruinDust]

Practice combos based on jersey color:
Spooner-Krejci-Loui
Marchy-Bergy-Stemp
Talbot-Beleskey-Kelly-Pasta
Ferraro-Acciari-Vatrano-Connolly
12 retweets 65 likes


That's the practice update. We shall see what shakes out tomorrow night

I swear Claude will try every combo possible before he let's Pasta and Spooner play on the same line again.

Those lines overall are gross.

 

[Therick67]

So Claude is giving 'goalie tendencies' as to his reason for his shootout lineup?

 

[BruinDust]

So Claude is giving 'goalie tendencies' as to his reason for his shootout lineup?

He's giving goalie tendencies as his reason cause he knows he %$#$% up.

 

[njbruin*]

This is complete nonsense. What roster changes did they make to "change the mindset"? What was the old mindset and what's the new one exactly? Further, what new guys didn't get plenty of chances?

Let's see...

- Re-signed McQuaid (where's the mindset change?)
- Signed Irwin (disaster)
- Traded Hamilton
- Traded Lucic
- Brought in Kemp (sucks and given ample chances to succeed)
- Brought in Connolly (probably sucks and given ample chances to succeed)
- Brought in Hayes (sucks and given ample chances to succeed)
- Brought in Rinaldo (sucks, given ample chances to succeed, cut)
- Acquired Colin Miller (given chances to succeed, work-in-progress)

This offseason charade that somehow this team was going to move to up-tempo was a joke. The GM did nothing to facilitate that and did nothing during the year either. I'm not judging whether he should have or not, but any suggestion that the front office is trying to do something that the coach is resisting is ludicrous. If they are trying to do something, it's pretty minor. And every guy they've given the coach he's used, and almost all of them suck.

The mindset is the SYSTEM, the third man high, dump/chase, play responsible defense , slow teams down in the neutral zone.
Its why they struggle with lower scoring inferior teams, they stick to the system trying to win those 1-0 , 2-1 games. When they face teams that actually can score on them and they get behind they are forced to open things up and play more aggressively in the offensive zone usually resulting in more goals scored.

Claude's system is antiquated and not a good match for today's NHL. Also to a large degree the NHL has evolved its emphasis on skill/speed and has made the trapping/clutching/grabbing systems of just the past 5-10 years much harder to play. Basically the system is being legislated out of hockey.

The Bruins roster composition for most of Claude's tenure was suited to that style, when players didn't mesh with the system they were usually shipped out or left voluntarily.

Fast forward to the change in Leadership/Management, Donnie and Cam openly stated they wanted a faster, skilled attacking approach. Julien admitted he needed to embrace the change and was on board, at least that's what he said.

So on to the roster composition. Is it 100% designed to play the new style - no , but most thought or percieved that this was going to be a transition year where things got rolling to set the migration for the future, and was a major reason I wanted Claude gone in the past off season. I think keeping him has set the team back some in their migration process,but I also think managment was somewhat duped into thinking Claude could embrace change.

Looch - was sent out due to mismanagement of the cap buy the supposed former cap guru.

Dougie - Obviously wanted out , not a whole lot the team could have done, Dougie held the leverage.

Connollly - was brought in as part of a deal that wiped Savard's salary from the books, plus he was a former 1st rd pick relegated to 4th line duty due to TB's stacked lineup, certainly not a bad risk. In addition I feel Connolly still has potential.

Hayes - this one is still a head scratcher for me , they traded a soft goal scorer for a soft pylon. Smith's salary probably also played a factor there.

Kemp - I'm convinced this signing was a Claude must have especially seeing how much play and rope he was given. I don't think any GM/coach tandem work in a vacuum and I truly believe Claude fought for this one .

Rinaldo - was fine for the 4th line role, acquiring Ferraro and promoting Acciari has made him expendable. Wish the pick was a 4th or a 5th

Irwin - looked like he had potential in SJ, cheap pickup didn't workout.


Bottom line the team has/could have enough talent to play uptempo. ( Pasta/Marchy/Bergy/Vatrano/Acciari/Griffith Cmiller/Krug/Morrow/Trotman) are all with or have spent time on this roster. The draft picks, prospects and college signings hold promise of a stocked cupboard and a infusion of speed, skill and offensive instincts.

 

[Number8]

...

It has nothing to do for me with a disjoint between management and coaching staff.

Very little to do shootout choices or which defenceman played where.

To me it comes down to what was said last night.

Before the game, Bergeron was asked what the key to winning would be. His answer was "sticking to our system". The Bruins did that... and they could only muster one lucky goal against a team with no stake in winning or losing that is by most accounts - not as good as the Bruins.

What that tells ME, is that the "system" is no longer effective. It was said that there would be adjustments made in how the team played before the season started. That was either a lie or a miscalculation. Either way, it's something that needs to be addressed.

That system -- the same one that has them currently 5th in League for Goals scored -- is not what failed them last night or just about every night for the past 10 games. If we'd scored on an even modest level over those games we'd be 3rd in scoring behind only Dallas and Washington and watching the standings to determine who we play in PO's -- not whether we get in.

The players have a system which allows them to cover for glaring personnel issues on the blue line while still scoring a lot (despite getting very few PP opportunities relative to the rest of the League).

IMO blaming the Coach or the System is a lazy excuse. The reason is in the mirror when 20+ players have to realize they are on the verge of a late season collapse for second year in a row.

 

[BMC]

If a team wants to play a certain style of hockey they need to give the coach players capable of playing that certain style.

So far the Bruins haven't done that, they still have too many slow/tough players compared to the number of fast/skill players. The team is schizophrenic that way.

They're trying to change personnel a little at a time in order to preserve playoff viability. It isn't working.