Chychrun Megathread IV

[rt]

Interesting results

Proposal: - Chychrun to Anaheim

For Anaheim's Choice of Either of the Below: A. Comtois + Zellweger + 22nd Overall or B. Comtois + Perreault + 10th Overall Please feel free to flame me. And go ahead and vote while you're at it.

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[rt]

Provorov & stuff for JT Miller & stuff

Chychrun & stuff for JvR+5th overall & stuff

 

[lanky]

I'd be cool with Chychrun for JVR and Jiricek.

 

[Jakey53]

Provorov & stuff for JT Miller & stuff

Chychrun & stuff for JvR+5th overall & stuff

I'd be cool with Chychrun for JVR and Jiricek.

Now you guys are happy with two pieces, not four in a Chychrun trade? JVR has one year left on his contract then he's gone, so it's a unknown high draft pick for a proven young Dman. No thanks from me.

 

[jmelm]

Now you guys are happy with two pieces, not four in a Chychrun trade? JVR has one year left on his contract then he's gone, so it's a unknown high draft pick for a proven young Dman. No thanks from me.

It's about quality, not quantity. I wouldn't care if we got 1 great piece for Chycrun instead of 4 lesser pieces.

That being said, Jiricek is not the guy I would take at 5.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

It's about quality, not quantity. I wouldn't care if we got 1 great piece for Chycrun instead of 4 lesser pieces.

That being said, Jiricek is not the guy I would take at 5.

I would. Cooley/Slafkovsky and Jirecek is quite the haul for a draft. Who would you pick?

 

[Jakey53]

It's about quality, not quantity. I wouldn't care if we got 1 great piece for Chycrun instead of 4 lesser pieces.

That being said, Jiricek is not the guy I would take at 5.

There were quality trades talked about on these boards that had four quality pieces, and I'm pretty sure you had your say in most of them. Now all of a sudden everyone is lower their expectations.

 

[jmelm]

I would. Cooley/Slafkovsky and Jirecek is quite the haul for a draft. Who would you pick?

I'm really concerned about Jiricek's skating. So I would hope & pray that Nemec is there at #5, or perhaps even give SEA a 2nd rounder to see if we could swap picks (or to ensure they pass on Nemec at #4).

We would have a variety of options at #5 if our scouts weren't sold on Jiricek, including trading down one or more times. I've used the example in the past of Luke Schenn in 2008. NYI had the #5 pick and traded down 2 spots to TOR at #7 (and picked up some assets), and then moved down a second time to #9 (and picked up more assets) and then drafted Josh Bailey.

So if we weren't prepared to take one of Jiricek, Gauthier or one of those guys at #5 and thought the guy we really wanted would be there a few spots later, we could trade down anywhere from 1 to 5 spots to pick up a bunch of assets along the way. If we traded down, I would personally target one of Korchinski/Mintyukov but who knows who BA & Co. really like.

 

[jmelm]

There were quality trades talked about on these boards that had four quality pieces, and I'm pretty sure you had your say in most of them. Now all of a sudden everyone is lower their expectations.

No, I don't think any of us have ever wavered in the idea that we would be willing to trade JC straight up for someone like Lundell or McTavish or players of that caliber if offered (though they probably won't be).

That was always the case. However, as far as expectations go, the fact that Provorov may be available AND Chychrun's injury concerns (however valid or not) does diminish to some degree the JC return. Now, if Tortarella & Fletcher come out and say they're not trading Provorov or Sanheim, then it increases our leverage and likelihood to get an even better return for JC. So that's just normal market dynamics.

And sure: I'll have my say or respond to any proposal someone makes: 1, 2, 3 or 10 pieces for Chychrun. That doesn't mean that I ever had a firm number in mind, and I've always said it's about quality over quantity.

 

[rt]

No, I don't think any of us have ever wavered in the idea that we would be willing to trade JC straight up for someone like Lundell or McTavish or players of that caliber if offered (though they probably won't be).

That was always the case. However, as far as expectations go, the fact that Provorov may be available AND Chychrun's injury concerns (however valid or not) does diminish to some degree the JC return. Now, if Tortarella & Fletcher come out and say they're not trading Provorov or Sanheim, then it increases our leverage and likelihood to get an even better return for JC. So that's just normal market dynamics.

And sure: I'll have my say or respond to any proposal someone makes: 1, 2, 3 or 10 pieces for Chychrun. That doesn't mean that I ever had a firm number in mind, and I've always said it's about quality over quantity.

This is correct. I would trade Chychrun for one young player if they were in the right tier. And I’ve always said that. And most of us have always said that. Whether it be Lafreniere, Byfield, McTavish, or Lundell. We’ve had discussion here on all of those pieces as 1:1.

 

[jmelm]

Provorov & stuff for JT Miller & stuff

Chychrun & stuff for JvR+5th overall & stuff

I don't think a deal built around Provorov for Miller is realistic at all. VAN is looking for RD in particular and unless they're able to move OEL somehow (who has previously said he doesn't want to move again), there isn't space in their salary cap for another Dman making what Provorov makes.

It's more likely they would do something like Miller for 5th overall + JVR.

As for PHI, the only way I see a trade scenario with us if it's essentially a 3 way deal and it's Provorov going to Team X (ANA or LA) and then it's JC going to PHI, perhaps including #5 or perhaps not. It could instead be a package built largely around assets obtained in the Provorov trade ++

For example, here are 2 scenarios:

1) Provorov to ANA for #22, Calle Clang, Max Comtois. Then, Chychrun to PHI for pick #5, Calle Clang, PHI 2023 3rd rounder, JVR ($2M retained).

2) Provorov to LAK for #19, Grans, 2nd rounder 2023. Then, Chychrun to PHI for pick #5, Grans, LAK 2023 2nd, PHI 2023 3rd rounder, JVR (no retention).

 

[rt]

I'm really concerned about Jiricek's skating. So I would hope & pray that Nemec is there at #5, or perhaps even give SEA a 2nd rounder to see if we could swap picks (or to ensure they pass on Nemec at #4).

We would have a variety of options at #5 if our scouts weren't sold on Jiricek, including trading down one or more times. I've used the example in the past of Luke Schenn in 2008. NYI had the #5 pick and traded down 2 spots to TOR at #7 (and picked up some assets), and then moved down a second time to #9 (and picked up more assets) and then drafted Josh Bailey.

So if we weren't prepared to take one of Jiricek, Gauthier or one of those guys at #5 and thought the guy we really wanted would be there a few spots later, we could trade down anywhere from 1 to 5 spots to pick up a bunch of assets along the way. If we traded down, I would personally target one of Korchinski/Mintyukov but who knows who BA & Co. really like.

I think Jiricek had excellent mobility. Especially at his size. He can maneuver in small spaces very well. And he can close gaps very very quickly. He just looks ugly doing it. He generates a lot of power very quickly and he’s got a long frame. There are mechanical issues, as he’s pretty choppy. All the ingredients are there for a top skater, IMO. His skating doesn’t worry me at all.

I’d still take Nemec ahead of him. And I’d do it mostly because of Nemec’s skating (and puck skills).

I’d trade Chychrun for any of Nemec, Jiricek or Gauthier.

Id even better willing to take on a negative value contract like JvR to make it happen.

 

[rt]

I don't think a deal built around Provorov for Miller is realistic at all. VAN is looking for RD in particular and unless they're able to move OEL somehow (who has previously said he doesn't want to move again), there isn't space in their salary cap for another Dman making what Provorov makes.

It's more likely they would do something like Miller for 5th overall + JVR.

As for PHI, the only way I see a trade scenario with us if it's essentially a 3 way deal and it's Provorov going to Team X (ANA or LA) and then it's JC going to PHI, perhaps including #5 or perhaps not. It could instead be a package built largely around assets obtained in the Provorov trade ++

For example, here are 2 scenarios:

1) Provorov to ANA for #22, Calle Clang, Max Comtois. Then, Chychrun to PHI for pick #5, Calle Clang, PHI 2023 3rd rounder, JVR ($2M retained).

2) Provorov to LAK for #19, Grans, 2nd rounder 2023. Then, Chychrun to PHI for pick #5, Grans, LAK 2023 2nd, PHI 2023 3rd rounder, JVR (no retention).

Philly wouldn’t do that for Miller with just one year left on his deal.

I’d do either of those trades you proposed. And I’d do #1 without the retention. And without the 3rd. And I’d take Comtois over Clang. 5th overall and a Comtois is plenty for Chychrun.

Number two Id do without the 2nd and 3rd. Give the 3rd to LA maybe. 5th overall and Grans is plenty for Chychrun.

 

[Heldig]

Provorov & stuff for JT Miller & stuff

Chychrun & stuff for JvR+5th overall & stuff

Depends on the other stuff, of course. Tippet? Foerster?

 

[rt]

Depends on the other stuff, of course. Tippet? Foerster?

Chychrun for JvR and 5th overall is fine for me.

I wonder if LA would do Durzi and 19th for Provorov?

 

[rt]

To LAK: 31st and Provorov
To PHI: 19th and Chychrun
To ARI: 5th & Durzi & JvR?

For Philly, they save a ton of Cap. Like +8aav?

The Kings upgrade their D and rebalance R to L.

AZ moves way up in the draft and get a very nice younger PP replacement in Durzi that can be kept or flipped.

 

[jmelm]

I think Jiricek had excellent mobility. Especially at his size. He can maneuver in small spaces very well. And he can close gaps very very quickly. He just looks ugly doing it. He generates a lot of power very quickly and he’s got a long frame. There are mechanical issues, as he’s pretty choppy. All the ingredients are there for a top skater, IMO. His skating doesn’t worry me at all.

I’d still take Nemec ahead of him. And I’d do it mostly because of Nemec’s skating (and puck skills).

I’d trade Chychrun for any of Nemec, Jiricek or Gauthier.

Id even better willing to take on a negative value contract like JvR to make it happen.

I'm not saying he can't get there, but this is what the medical testing is for. Just like with Rutger McGroarty, the combine will allow the team docs/trainers + skating coaches to assess physical development and see how much room for improvement there is.

As it stands now, Jiricek would get absolutely killed by fast/shifty forwards in the NHL. It's not about how he looks skating, it's his pivots and quick adjustments that are really concerning. This could be something easily remedied, or it could be a persistent problem. There's no way at all to tell other than with the medical evaluation that occurred at the combine.

 

[jmelm]

Philly wouldn’t do that for Miller with just one year left on his deal.

I’d do either of those trades you proposed. And I’d do #1 without the retention. And without the 3rd. And I’d take Comtois over Clang. 5th overall and a Comtois is plenty for Chychrun.

Number two Id do without the 2nd and 3rd. Give the 3rd to LA maybe. 5th overall and Grans is plenty for Chychrun.

I agree about Miller, and I'll go further: I don't think ANY team in the NHL trades for Miller without having an extension in place. This is not a hot take as it occurrs commonly in these kind of situations, but it must be stated since not everyone takes it as implied when thinking of Miller trade proposals.

Re. the trades: that's just a framework and obviously BA & Co. would determine which pieces they value and how much they like them (such as Clang). I just wanted to build a couple of proposals around players/pieces who I think those teams would be willing to move. I think ANA would move Clang because they have Dostal. But in general, I would also do either one.

I wonder if LA would do Durzi and 19th for Provorov?

I seriously doubt it. I think they would do either/or + something else but not both. We know they want to make the playoffs again next year and add pieces for a deeper run, and because guys like Faber and Clarke are not likely to be on the team next year (for different reasons), I think LAK would probably rather keep Durzi. So it could come down to Durzi + prospect/picks or #19 + Spence, rather than both #19 + Durzi.

If I was PHI, and given they want to compete next year and their need for RD and Durzi's age & contract status (and with Ellis's future being up in the air), I don't see them wanting to move him for JC. I think in that scenario they keep Durzi and use other assets for JC if he's someone they want to add.

 

[kinghock]

Chychrun for JvR and 5th overall is fine for me.

I wonder if LA would do Durzi and 19th for Provorov?

LA would do Durzi and 19th for Provorov for sure

 

[jmelm]

LA would do Durzi and 19th for Provorov for sure

Would you rather have Provorov or Chychrun? And assuming it’s Chychrun (and especially if he came with 50% retention for the next 3 years) what else would you add to the package?

 

[Jamieh]

LA would do Durzi and 19th for Provorov for sure

My probably unpopular opinion, Durzi will be better than Provorov going forward in careers. Especially when cost is considered.

 

[rt]

My probably unpopular opinion, Durzi will be better than Provorov going forward in careers. Especially when cost is considered.

They need to balance out their R/L D and also, Provorov has had higher highs. Change of scenery could do wonders.

 

[JasonDemersWasOkay]

If we walked out of round 1 with both cooley and Jiricek I would cry

 

[Jamieh]

They need to balance out their R/L D and also, Provorov has had higher highs. Change of scenery could do wonders.

It certainly possible that Provorov could rebound but he's trending down at $6.7 a year while Durzi is just com into his own at probably half that Cap hit at most on a new deal. Not a risk I would take as GM.

 

[Jakey53]

This is correct. I would trade Chychrun for one young player if they were in the right tier. And I’ve always said that. And most of us have always said that. Whether it be Lafreniere, Byfield, McTavish, or Lundell. We’ve had discussion here on all of those pieces as 1:1.

Lundell was part of a package of 4.