Prospect Info: CBJ Prospect Thread X

[VT]

I just noticed on CapFriendly that Yegor Chinakhov's ELC with the Columbus Blue Jackets does contain a European Assignment Clause. To me that suggests that if Yegor doesn't make the big league squad from the get-go that he could be loaned back to Avansgard Omsk or another KHL team.

Avangard wouldn't probably agree with loaning. They said the return only after finish his contract. Of course if Yegor would decide to return. All problems because of his agent Shumi Babayev. What isn't any surprise Babayev is known it.

 

[LetsGOJackets!!]

Avangard wouldn't probably agree with loaning. They said the return only after finish his contract. Of course if Yegor would decide to return. All problems because of his agent Shumi Babayev. What isn't any surprise Babayev is known it.

It is terrific having you on this board.. your knowledge is very much appreciated. Thank you

 

[majormajor]

Yeah, but it was said his goal was to play in North America...sounded like he was willing to go to AHL

I personally don't think it matters much now that he's signed.

He's either

1) good enough to play in the NHL next Fall.

Or

2) he develops in the AHL or KHL and comes back to Jackets camp the following year.

It would be different if Yegor wasn't coming to camp.

 

[KJ Dangler]

Looks like we may have found another gem .. this was his scouting video , and from all accounts he has improved tremendously in the areas of concern ...

 

[EspenK]

^^^^^^^^^ Or another bust...nothing to get real excited about here...maybe his recent world's were better

 

[Viqsi]

^^^^^^^^^ Or another bust...nothing to get real excited about here...maybe his recent world's were better

I confess I'm beginning to wonder what your standards for things to "get excited about" are, because they're seeming to me to be really rather high.

 

[Fro]

TIL...mid-round draft picks can be busts

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

^^^^^^^^^ Or another bust...nothing to get real excited about here...maybe his recent world's were better

Remember when I admitted I was feeling grumpy?

 

[EspenK]

I confess I'm beginning to wonder what your standards for things to "get excited about" are, because they're seeming to me to be really rather high.

I just want one of the great draft picks to pan out. This guy doesn't feel like he's a slam dunk but already the Jacket fans are all excited based on a couple of games in the Worlds. 20 years of disappointment can wear a fella down. If I look at results its easy to not get excited.

Hopefully I'll be excited with our draft pick - unless Jarmo goes off the board again. And when we trade Jones for a decent return.

 

[majormajor]

20 years of disappointment can wear a fella down. If I look at results its easy to not get excited.

Jackets have been hitting above average from the third round onward for a decade plus now. I must presume you're looking at something other than draft results.

Edit: An hour after I posted this Keegan Kolesar scores. Guess who drafted him in the third round? Hint - same GM who took Bjorkstrand and Elvis in the third round.

 

[EspenK]

Jackets have been hitting above average from the third round onward for a decade plus now. I must presume you're looking at something other than draft results.

Edit: An hour after I posted this Keegan Kolesar scores. Guess who drafted him in the third round? Hint - same GM who took Bjorkstrand and Elvis in the third round.

And Bemstrom had a hat trick, Elvis is a future Vezina winner and Kolesar, is, you're kidding right.
I'll give you OB who is a good player but not great. For a team that hits above average in the draft over the last 10 years I would think they would be better.

As to the bolded I was looking at the knee jerk, hyperbolic reaction by many here who see greatness in every draft choice from Filatov to Knazko.

 

[EspenK]

It is terrific having you on this board.. your knowledge is very much appreciated. Thank you

Thanks, I'm glad someone sees my brilliance.

 

[Xoggz22]

And Bemstrom had a hat trick, Elvis is a future Vezina winner and Kolesar, is, you're kidding right.
I'll give you OB who is a good player but not great. For a team that hits above average in the draft over the last 10 years I would think they would be better.

As to the bolded I was looking at the knee jerk, hyperbolic reaction by many here who see greatness in every draft choice from Filatov to Knazko.

I think it's all relative... 1st round picks are typically expected to be big time players, make the NHL, contribute at a high level. 2nd round picks may be middle 6 type but should have some tenure in the NHL but get to the 3rd round and they are situational players, more bust than boom but the chance of even making the NHL is dramatically lowered.

So I think based on draft area you can make the argument that players like Bjork and Elvis would be great picks. Gavrikov, phenomenal pick. No one expects a 6th or 7th rounder to play let alone contribute so when you see players like actually outperforming a draft area it's pretty amazing. When you see 18 year olds playing in the AHL and 19 year olds in the worlds, is about optimism to me. I like to look at the potential good not bust but also recognize they are still longshots to be more than an injury replacement. Much better than drafting Picard and seeing very quickly he's not even AHL quality

 

[koteka]

Since guys like Kolesar and Gav are mentioned, I went back and looked at the 2015 draft. We did pretty well.

The 3rd round was pretty bad that year. Here are the 3 best picks in the 3rd round:

Cirelli 218 games 116 points
Hill 49 games 19 wins .909 save percentage
Kolesar 45 games 13 points

Nobody else has played more than 25 games.

Later rounds were actually better:
4th round - 6 guys have played more than 50 games, 3 more than 100
5th round - 8 guys have played more than 50 games, 5 more than 100
6th round - 5 guys have played more than 50 games, 4 more than 100
7th round - 3 guys have played more than 50 games, 2 more than 100

The CBJ drafted (by round):

1 Werenski
1 Carlsson
2 Bittner
2 Stenlund
3 Kolesar
5 Vaino
5 Rupp
6 Gavrikov
7 Nutivaara

Zach was a solid pick

Carlsson is disappointing but not a compete bust (he is 1 of 7 1st rounders who have played fewer than 50 NHL games)

Bittner is 1 of 8 2nd rounders never to play an NHL game

Stenlund is an ok 2nd round pick

Kolesar is one of the best 3rd round picks

We missed on our 5th rounders, but 18 5th rounders haven’t played an NHL game

Gavrikov is one of the best 6th round picks

Nuti is one of the two best 7th round picks (along with Matt Roy)

2015 NHL Entry Draft Picks at hockeydb.com

 

[VT]

And Bemstrom had a hat trick, Elvis is a future Vezina winner and Kolesar, is, you're kidding right.
I'll give you OB who is a good player but not great. For a team that hits above average in the draft over the last 10 years I would think they would be better.

As to the bolded I was looking at the knee jerk, hyperbolic reaction by many here who see greatness in every draft choice from Filatov to Knazko.

I know Knazko (Kňažko). He works on himself, progress really great. One played in U20 SM-sarja and in spite of it he was minimum one of the best our d-man if not the best in WC. Nobody expected it.
Filatov could be a great player but .... . He destroyed his career himself.

 

[majormajor]

And Bemstrom had a hat trick, Elvis is a future Vezina winner and Kolesar, is, you're kidding right.
I'll give you OB who is a good player but not great. For a team that hits above average in the draft over the last 10 years I would think they would be better.

So it turns out you just have no idea what the average is. Your typical third rounder doesn't make the NHL. I just mentioned the third rounders from Jarmo's first three drafts. Bjorkstrand, Elvis, and Kolesar, all are beating that average.

And Bjorkstrand is a great player. I haven't checked but I don't think there are more than a few better players from the whole last decade of third rounders, across hundreds of picks.

 

[CBJx614]

I'm really excited to see what Jarmo can do with 3 1sts(although I'm expecting at least 1 traded away).

Just remember in 2013, that Jarmo was still using Howsons scouts and cleaned house after the draft.

He's had pretty good success rate drafting inside the top 10. So I'm not too worried about the first pick, I think he might however reach with the 2nd or 3rd pick.

 

[Doggy]

So it turns out you just have no idea what the average is. Your typical third rounder doesn't make the NHL. I just mentioned the third rounders from Jarmo's first three drafts. Bjorkstrand, Elvis, and Kolesar, all are beating that average.

And Bjorkstrand is a great player. I haven't checked but I don't think there are more than a few better players from the whole last decade of third rounders, across hundreds of picks.

Not to nitpick your comment but I don't give him as much credit for Elvis because goalies don't fall into the same category as positional players in terms of draft position and success. Goalies come from everywhere...from first rounders (Price) to undrafted (Bobs). Two of the best goalies of the past two decades Lundqvist (7th rounder) and Rinne (8th rounder). Some of the top goalies of the last three years: Hellebuycyk (5th) and Kuemper (8th).

 

[EspenK]

I am not talking relative results based on draft position. Yeah, if looked at it that way Jackets did ok. What I am waiting to get excited about is any of the picks really exceeding expectations. Obviously OB & Elvis are doing well. The rest blah.

What I was really commenting on was how every freakin' pick is viewed as the coming of the next Gretzky by the fans. Okay, maybe a bit hyperbolic but until Jarmo pulls out a Pasternak at 25th or an Alex Debrincat at 39th I'll reserve my excitement until the prospects live up to the expectations of the fans.

Still grumpy.

 

[majormajor]

I am not talking relative results based on draft position. Yeah, if looked at it that way Jackets did ok. What I am waiting to get excited about is any of the picks really exceeding expectations. Obviously OB & Elvis are doing well. The rest blah.

What I was really commenting on was how every freakin' pick is viewed as the coming of the next Gretzky by the fans. Okay, maybe a bit hyperbolic but until Jarmo pulls out a Pasternak at 25th or an Alex Debrincat at 39th I'll reserve my excitement until the prospects live up to the expectations of the fans.

Still grumpy.

Ok I understand you now.

I'm personally excited for the player, and you might see that and think I'm drinking the prospect koolaid, but I also don't think he'll ever be a top pair guy down the line. There's room to be excited about a prospect while keeping expectations reasonable. I'm not seeing irrational exuberance with Knazko, at least not yet. Maybe somewhere some fans think he'll be elite but I haven't seen that.

 

[barriers]

 

[LeProspector]

I need more information about Tyler Angle, thought this as as good a place as any to get it.

What went right for him in Lake Erie this year? I watched him almost every game he played in Windsor and never expected more than a replacement level player out of him in all honesty. His stats and play in the AHL have baffled me, I need some insight here.

 

[majormajor]

I need more information about Tyler Angle, thought this as as good a place as any to get it.

What went right for him in Lake Erie this year? I watched him almost every game he played in Windsor and never expected more than a replacement level player out of him in all honesty. His stats and play in the AHL have baffled me, I need some insight here.

Honestly we were hoping you would tell us!

We don't have anyone who has watched him in both Windsor and Cleveland who can speak to how he has developed.

 

[LeProspector]

Honestly we were hoping you would tell us!

We don't have anyone who has watched him in both Windsor and Cleveland who can speak to how he has developed.

Above is his PNHLe (a value that projects a prospect's point potential at the NHL level.) Seeing his curve here is impressive.

For comparison's sake; here's Liam Foudy:

In Windsor he was one of the hardest working guys on the ice, would seldom give up on any play and was a hound on the puck, alot of heart in his game. He was difficult to knock off the puck when he had it on his stick, very impressive for a guy his size. His skating has always been awkward but watching a few games of him this year, I don't think this is a problem anymore, he looks great out there. He has good hockey IQ and is more often than not in the right spot to help generate offense for his team. He wasn't very good in his own zone in junior but it seems he's made huge strides in that regard in Cleveland seeing how the coaching staff trust him as a staple on the PK.

He's always been small and an awkward skater which has hindered him, this was probably a big reason as to why he wasn't drafted until pick 212, but he's a guy that plays bigger than his size indicates. Jean Gabriel Pageau is what I project as a realistic NHL comparison for Angle.

 

[majormajor]

He's always been small and an awkward skater which has hindered him, this was probably a big reason as to why he wasn't drafted until pick 212, but he's a guy that plays bigger than his size indicates. Jean Gabriel Pageau is what I project as a realistic NHL comparison for Angle.

That's a really wonderful thing for Jackets fans to hear.

Pageau is what I have been hoping for from him. That's not my median expectation yet, but it's certainly not an unrealistic hope.