Confirmed with Link: Canucks Re-Signs F Zack Kassian to a 2-Year, $3.5M Deal ($1.75AAV)

[Rex Banner]

By "reality", do you mean empirical evidence, or irrational zeal?

What do you think Torts did to improve him?

From my perspective he parked him on the third line and told him to learn how to play hockey. He didn't help him in practice since he did everything possible to avoid practices. He didn't give him a chance to move up to the top 6 or PP when he was clearly one of the best forwards on the team.

Kassian made a lot of progress last year, but I don't see how Torts fits into it.

 

[Scurr]

What do you think Torts did to improve him?

From my perspective he parked him on the third line and told him to learn how to play hockey. He didn't help him in practice since he did everything possible to avoid practices. He didn't give him a chance to move up to the top 6 or PP when he was clearly one of the best forwards on the team.

Kassian made a lot of progress last year, but I don't see how Torts fits into it.

The focus early in the season on Kassian being a player was important. Torts wasn't worried about him playing physical or scoring, just play your position and be responsible with the puck like everyone else. Torts also stuck with Kass through some pretty poor turnovers at our blueline. Kassian kept trying to make plays there and eventually started to make really good decisions with the puck. It was good to see him still making plays instead of resorting to throwing it high off the glass ever time... I think Torts deserves some credit for not resorting to that. There was a time when HF posters were calling for it.

After that though... he probably held him back. There was a point where it was very clear that Kassian was one of the better players we were throwing over the boards. Him and his teammates knew the team needed more out of him. It didn't make sense to anyone but Torts to have the kid playing so well and not give him some more ice-time.

 

[biturbo19]

Torts didn't do anything for Kass that other competent coaches wouldn't have. Yes, he played hardball with Kassian and his lack of attention to detail away from the puck, his careless puck management tendencies, his inconsistent effort/intensity...he stapled him to the bottom-6 and at times benched him for egregious mistakes. That's pretty much standard fare for any NHL coach dealing with a young player on a team that is at least pretending to compete.

Beyond that, it doesn't sound like Tortorella didn't much of anything to help anyone.

 

[biturbo19]

Really liked what Torts did with Kassian. He used to float around looking lost, just waiting for passes. Was weak on the puck, weak on the cycle, didn't play physical. By 2014, things started to click. He was playing with guys like Booth and Richardson, worked well together, but Kass was the clear leader of the line. He was forced to run the show. He would get the puck himself, gain the zone and start plays. Was much better on the rush, and was quarterbacking things later on when he got some PP time. Should pay dividends, and think he'll hit the ground running this year.

The bolded is something that i think is going to have to be an emphasis moving forward with Kassian. When he started to look "good" late in the season, it was when he was starting to actually control play...things on that line really did go through him and he started to look the part more than he ever has before. That's something i want to see continuing.

Which is precisely why i think the suggestions of Kassian playing on the Sedin line are totally out to lunch. It's not a fit. The Sedins need a spadeworker on their line. A gopher who seeks out pucks, defers to the Twins playmaking, and gets themselves to soft spots ready for a quick tap in or a wide open one-timer opportunity. It's why Jensen seems like such a potentially nice fit there.

What we want Kassian doing, is controlling the puck, using his frame to own the boards down low and find his linemates with nice passes, taking pucks to the net, etc. If Kassian is going to live up to his "potential", we want the puck to go through him on whatever line he's on.

 

[kanucks25]

How do you guys know he didn't help Kassian off the ice?

It's rather disturbing how all this blame is being placed on Torts which essentially lets the players off the hook AGAIN after they were given a free pass with the AV firing.

We were doing pretty well until the injuries started to pile up, beginning with Santorelli going down who was like our engine. Torts didn't really look like an idiot then. People will blame him for every single little thing that went wrong but he gets no credit for anything that went right? Be rational...

 

[biturbo19]

How do you guys know he didn't help Kassian off the ice?

It's rather disturbing how all this blame is being placed on Torts which essentially lets the players off the hook AGAIN after they were given a free pass with the AV firing.

We were doing pretty well until the injuries started to pile up, beginning with Santorelli going down who was like our engine. Torts didn't really look like an idiot then. People will blame him for every single little thing that went wrong but he gets no credit for anything that went right? Be rational...

It's not about "letting players off the hook", it's about the coach last year being largely incompetent.

The players still have to answer for themselves this year, and if they cannot...criticism will be heaped upon them by the ton.

That goes for Kassian as much as anybody...if he cannot take that "next step" this year and continue to build off his late season success last year, we've got a problem.

 

[kanucks25]

It's not about "letting players off the hook", it's about the coach last year being largely incompetent.

The players still have to answer for themselves this year, and if they cannot...criticism will be heaped upon them by the ton.

That goes for Kassian as much as anybody...if he cannot take that "next step" this year and continue to build off his late season success last year, we've got a problem.

They fired the coach two years in a row and the core only changed (a little) because a new GM came in. If that's not letting the players off the hook, what is?

 

[ddawg1950]

They fired the coach two years in a row and the core only changed (a little) because a new GM came in. If that's not letting the players off the hook, what is?

It"s understanding that there may be complicating factors outside of "players are bad/stale time to blow it up."

 

[canuck4life16]

Kassian getting 20 goals and 40 points would be great

 

[BobbyJazzLegs]

Kassian getting 20 goals and 40 points would be great

Yet the much lauded Ryan O'Reilly racked up 28 and 36. It's these kind of predictions that worry me a little.

 

[Nona Di Giuseppe]

What do you think Torts did to improve him?

From my perspective he parked him on the third line and told him to learn how to play hockey. He didn't help him in practice since he did everything possible to avoid practices. He didn't give him a chance to move up to the top 6 or PP when he was clearly one of the best forwards on the team.

Kassian made a lot of progress last year, but I don't see how Torts fits into it.

Even though it's all speculative, I think the evidence suggests this rather than he benefited from Torts.

I think Kassian succeeded in spite of Torts. At best, he may have been unintentionally motivated. Don't see any treatment Torts gave him as directly causing his improvement.

 

[Nona Di Giuseppe]

Kassian is going to go beast mode this year. I'm guessing somewhere around 20 goals, but it'll seem like he got 40.

 

[Zombotron]

If his idol's career trajectory is any indication, Kassian will go around 25-25-50 this year and then explode into a 35-50-85 player. I believe he can do it.

Hopefully he doesn't lose a bunch of games to suspension this season (which probably impacted his statline last year, 14-15-29 with 8 games lost to suspension).

 

[Scurr]

If his idol's career trajectory is any indication, Kassian will go around 25-25-50 this year and then explode into a 35-50-85 player. I believe he can do it.

Hopefully he doesn't lose a bunch of games to suspension this season (which probably impacted his statline last year, 14-15-29 with 8 games lost to suspension).

Ironically enough... it was after taking a 10 game suspension to start the season that Bert broke out. Bert is not smart... but he had his teammates backs.

http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/bertuzzi-given-10-game-suspension-1.298642

Jovo was in a lot of trouble imo. Bert did him a big favor.

 

[Robongo01]

If his idol's career trajectory is any indication, Kassian will go around 25-25-50 this year and then explode into a 35-50-85 player. I believe he can do it.

Hopefully he doesn't lose a bunch of games to suspension this season (which probably impacted his statline last year, 14-15-29 with 8 games lost to suspension).

That would be fantastic, but I think his peak is somewhere in the 25g 30 a range. I'd be pretty happy with a 20-20 year this year.

 

[NoShowWilly]

If his idol's career trajectory is any indication, Kassian will go around 25-25-50 this year and then explode into a 35-50-85 player. I believe he can do it.

Hopefully he doesn't lose a bunch of games to suspension this season (which probably impacted his statline last year, 14-15-29 with 8 games lost to suspension).

then we can trade him at the deadline for picks.

 

[F A N]

Torts didn't do anything for Kass that other competent coaches wouldn't have. Yes, he played hardball with Kassian and his lack of attention to detail away from the puck, his careless puck management tendencies, his inconsistent effort/intensity...he stapled him to the bottom-6 and at times benched him for egregious mistakes. That's pretty much standard fare for any NHL coach dealing with a young player on a team that is at least pretending to compete.

Beyond that, it doesn't sound like Tortorella didn't much of anything to help anyone.

The best thing Torts did for Kassian was consistent linemates. Kassian almost always played with Richardson.

 

[Tobi Wan Kenobi]

That would be fantastic, but I think his peak is somewhere in the 25g 30 a range. I'd be pretty happy with a 20-20 year this year.

So you'd be happy if he doesn't hit his potential? His potential is 25g 40a

 

[tantalum]

That's pretty much standard fare for any NHL coach dealing with a young player on a team that is at least pretending to compete.

Beyond that, it doesn't sound like Tortorella didn't much of anything to help anyone.

It is standard fare and it isn't. For deep teams it is. For the weaker ones it isn't and you can see the issues with just throwing guys out time and again without making them learn (Taylor Hall is an example..never expected to be smart with the puck and he isn't). For the most part though I think you are correct that the majority of teams/coaches use this philosophy. AV certainly did (Hansen was in the "dog house" because 5-on-5 he was inconsistent with his defensive coverage. Hodgson wasn't trusted for a reason and still can't play defense).

In the end talent and offense get you to the show, but defense keeps you in it for the long haul (unless you are one of the exceptional few superstar/generational talents and even then defense better be a part of your game).

It sounds like Gulutzan was the one given credit for Kassian's growth as a player. He's also the only assistant still around precisely for that reason.

 

[BobbyJazzLegs]

So you'd be happy if he doesn't hit his potential? His potential is 25g 40a

Better than Milan Lucic? Big ask.

 

[Jyrki21]

I think Kassian succeeded in spite of Torts. At best, he may have been unintentionally motivated. Don't see any treatment Torts gave him as directly causing his improvement.

Reminds me of how Markus Näslund always politely credits Keenan and Messier for his breakout during their time with the club, but I always wondered how (at least for Keenan) that was really all that possible. Keenan hated players like Näslund, did little to put him in optimal situations, didn't practice the power play, etc. It seems to me that's another case of a guy's natural talent helping him to overcome his circumstances.

 

[Brain Sergeant]

It sounds like Gulutzan was the one given credit for Kassian's growth as a player. He's also the only assistant still around precisely for that reason.

Source?

 

[xtr3m]

Source?

Apparently Linden mentioned Gully as the only coach who put in extra time with the young guys. Warning: CDC link.

 

[Brain Sergeant]

Apparently Linden mentioned Gully as the only coach who put in extra time with the young guys. Warning: CDC link.

Interesting. Thanks!

 

[Nucker101]

I know he's still young, but I'm tempering expectations. I'd be pleased if he develops into a solid 2nd line forward.