Confirmed with Link: Canucks re-sign Sbisa (3 yrs, $3.6M AAV), Dorsett (4 yrs, $2.65M AAV) [Mod Post #186]

[canucksfan100]

Matthias, Richardson and Weber are gone. Stanton, Kenins, Baertschi will be resigned, biggest question mark is Vey...

 

[GPNuck]

The cap is going up, news to me. Source? CDN dollar is still down.

That was my thoughts exactly.. I haven't heard about it going up or down but was assuming it will go down based on the Canadian dollar and how much money Toronto + Vancouver bring into the league

 

[WetcoastOrca]

What a ridiculous reaction from this fanbase,

Dorsett is 28 years old, chips in 25 points, 170 PIM, stands up for his teammates, and is defensively capable to play more minutes so the top six can rest. Those intangibles are huge for any team, he is one of the most courageous players that doesn't allow anyone to bring him down.

The salary cap is going up and Canucks will have an ample amount of room as the entry level contracts are being used on the roster.

Well said. Wish we would have had Dorsett during the Boston series.
He may not scare anyone but at least he stands up for his teammates.

 

[canucksfan]

I miss Capgeek.

 

[vanarchy]

That's what's even more sickening.

I just want to know what compromising piece of information Sbisa had on Benning. What happened, Jim?

 

[Toxic0n]

We're not going to be cap strapped, we only need to get 2 #6-7 defensemen and replace or resign Matthias and/or Richardson.

Yeah, we are not going to be cap strapped because we will be forced to let more useful players walk because we overpaid for Dorsett.

Just like Boston will have to do this summer

 

[Pip]

Yeah, because it wasn't Tanev and his agents playing hardball or anything.

There are two sides to the negotiation.

I'm sure thar if they offered Tanev way more than he's worth than the negotiations would have been pretty easy.

 

[RandV]

The cap is going up, news to me. Source? CDN dollar is still down.

Yes the cap had been rising every year since it's inception but it's finally starting to stabilize. The vast majority of the increase was coming from Canada at a time when the Canadian dollar was strong and on par with US, now it's not and we're seeing things leveling out.

 

[Rotting Corpse*]

I think this is the part that is the most indefensible for me. The Dorsett contract I can live with, and I could have even lived with giving Sbisa his qualifying offer in the summer, but giving him a $700K raise? Yikes, terrible.

I expected we'd be keeping Sbisa based on comments from the brass, and gotten myself to the point where I was ready to except:

1) Sbisa being qualified.

OR

2) Sbisa being signed to an extension below his QO (like 3/7 or something.)

I was not remotely prepared for this. I am just astonished.

I miss Capgeek.

That is probably one thing we can all agree on.

 

[Stonz]

Matthias, Richardson and Weber are gone. Stanton, Kenins, Baertschi will be resigned, biggest question mark is Vey...

Given how well Benning acquired players are making out today, that Vey question mark is a scary one.

 

[arsmaster*]

Matthias, Richardson and Weber are gone. Stanton, Kenins, Baertschi will be resigned, biggest question mark is Vey...

Vey?

Vey is a guaranteed roster player next year in the top 12, no doubts. We will not be able to afford a proper replacement with our cap dollars invested where they are.

The cap number I've read bandied about was $71m.

 

[canucksfan]

I have no clue how anyone could legit defend these signings. They are bad especially Sbisa.

 

[absolute garbage]

When we got him He was compared to Willie Mitchell in the defensive zone or even Dan Hamhuis but he was not even close to their level on the defensive side of things. I was thrilled when Linden + Benning forced him out.. I'm not thrilled with these contracts though

Everyone has their opinion and all but you are just wrong. Garrison was very good with the Canucks, a solid top 4 defenceman easily worth his contract and they got terrible, terrible value in the trade.

Now they sign a significantly worse player to a deal at 3.6 million. It's laughable.

 

[GetFocht]

The cap is going up, news to me. Source? CDN dollar is still down.

When's the last time it hasn't increased since the CBA was formed. (never)

 

[thepuckmonster]

Got this from the main board. He is terrible and gets a huge increase.

Can you stop posting Hero charts with zero context?

This is absolutely the most frustrating thing on HFBoards: people think they know about advanced stats because they Googled Corsi and found some charts. It's like figuring out how to use the Sine function on a calculator and then proclaiming that you're a mathematical mastermind.

1) Hero charts take 3 years of data into consideration. Hence why someone like Shea Weber has seriously bad Corsi compared to Patrick Weircoch.
2) Corsi only evaluates shot differentials, not quality of scoring chances. A shot from the corner is considered the same value as the slot.
3) Corsi is legitmately one of the most rudimentary advanced stats. The stats that NHL teams use make Corsi look like basic long division while they're using advanced calculus.

Jesus.

 

[vanarchy]

Vey 4x4. Make it happen, Jim.

 

[Virtanen2Horvat]

The Dorsett contract is alright.

The Sbisa contract I am not really happy with, but people go way to hard on the guy. Sbisa can play a gritty game and he can play just fine as long as he isn't giving up many pucks. He has improved a lot since the beginning of the season.

 

[Jay Cee]

Matthias, Richardson and Weber are gone. Stanton, Kenins, Baertschi will be resigned, biggest question mark is Vey...

Weber is an RFA non?

He is likely trade bait. I didn't think we would resign Matthias or Richardson at the beginning of this.

 

[canucksfan]

Can you stop posting Hero charts with zero context?

This is absolutely the most frustrating thing on HFBoards: people think they know about advanced stats because they Googled Corsi and found some charts. It's like figuring out how to use the Sine function on a calculator and then proclaiming that you're a mathematical mastermind.

1) Hero charts take 3 years of data into consideration. Hence why someone like Shea Weber has seriously bad Corsi compared to Patrick Weircoch.
2) Corsi only evaluates shot differentials, not quality of scoring chances. A shot from the corner is considered the same value as the slot.
3) Corsi is legitmately one of the most rudimentary advanced stats. The stats that NHL teams use make Corsi look like basic long division while they're using advanced calculus.

Jesus.

Take some deep breaths. Calm down.

Sbisa is horrible by any test. Bottom line.

 

[Addison Rae]

I'm in a really good place with this team so I'm trying to imagine this didn't happen. Dorsett signing by itself isn't that bad, but Sbisa is a trainwreck I simply cannot understand that one at all.

 

[Virtanen2Horvat]

Well said. Wish we would have had Dorsett during the Boston series.
He may not scare anyone but at least he stands up for his teammates.

Something Oreskovich failed to do. Torres was hurt I think idk.

 

[NuxFan09]

I have no clue how anyone could legit defend these signings. They are bad especially Sbisa.

I don't think anyone is really defending them, per se. It's the sky is falling crap that some people have a problem with, the notion that these contracts are going to absolutely cripple the team.

News flash guys: this team is NOT a contender. Hey, maybe we do something special in the playoffs. We'll deal with the cap mess then. For now, this is a team in transition who will continue to make changes, changes that will accommodate these admittedly bad contracts.

I'm sure if and when some of the veterans are off the books, and our youth who are making a pittance step in and fill some key roles, you guys will all feel a lot better about our situation.

 

[Rotting Corpse*]

3) Corsi is legitmately one of the most rudimentary advanced stats. The stats that NHL teams use make Corsi look like basic long division while they're using advanced calculus.

Your points [1] and [2] cancel each other out.

As for [3], this is probably true in general, but I don't know of any evidence that the Canucks are one of those teams. The anecdotal evidence (all that I am aware of) would suggest to me that they are not using anything more advanced than long division.

If someone wants to make a case for Sbisa being better than those numbers indicate, I would be willing to listen. I haven't seen it.

 

[ARSix]

2) Corsi only evaluates shot differentials, not quality of scoring chances. A shot from the corner is considered the same value as the slot.

http://nhlnumbers.com/2012/6/26/sho...ation-between-scoring-chances-and-shot-totals

This argument has been put to bed so many times it's really annoying when people bring it up again.

Luca Sbisa is a terrible defenseman. Terrible. He is now going to be paid like a dependable yet unspectacular middle pairing guy. That is bad.

Derek Dorsett is a fourth line winger. You do not pay fourth line wingers over 2.5 million. You also do not sign them for FOUR ******* YEARS.

This is Maple Leafs level managerial incompetence. This is atrocious. These are the worst contracts I can recall the team signing in quite a long time.

 

[Pip]

Can you stop posting Hero charts with zero context?

This is absolutely the most frustrating thing on HFBoards: people think they know about advanced stats because they Googled Corsi and found some charts. It's like figuring out how to use the Sine function on a calculator and then proclaiming that you're a mathematical mastermind.

1) Hero charts take 3 years of data into consideration. Hence why someone like Shea Weber has seriously bad Corsi compared to Patrick Weircoch.
2) Corsi only evaluates shot differentials, not quality of scoring chances. A shot from the corner is considered the same value as the slot.
3) Corsi is legitmately one of the most rudimentary advanced stats. The stats that NHL teams use make Corsi look like basic long division while they're using advanced calculus.

Jesus.

So post something that shows that Sbisa is worth this kind of money