Confirmed with Link: Canucks promote Todd Harvey to Director of Amateur Scouting

[Mr. Canucklehead]

Discuss.

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[Mr. Canucklehead]

The departure of Bates - relegated to a footnote here - sucks pretty hard.

 

[AppleHoneySauce]

The departure of Bates - relegated to a footnote here - sucks pretty hard.

Would he have been the guy who found Troy from richmond?

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

Would he have been the guy who found Troy from richmond?

A lot of our college free agent acquisitions, Stecher included. Some others would be Tanev and Volpatti.

 

[rypper]

They made the changes to their website yesterday and only made the official announcement today. What's interesting is yesterday they switched both Wyatt Smith and Phil Goulding's titles to head scout, but have since switched it back.

 

[timw33]

Bleh.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

A lot of our college free agent acquisitions, Stecher included. Some others would be Tanev and Volpatti.

What college did Tanev go to?..
edit..I stand corrected..he did find him

 

[theguardianII]

About that house party back in the late 90's?

 

[chaputonyou]

A lot of our college free agent acquisitions, Stecher included. Some others would be Tanev and Volpatti.

I thought Brackett found a lot of the NCAA guys...not including Tanev and Stecher.

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

I thought Brackett found a lot of the NCAA guys...not including Tanev and Stecher.

If I’m not mistaken - Brackett was involved more on the drafting prep and execution side, while Bates was involved more in scouting undrafted players to sign as free agents. I’m sure their jobs had a bit of cross pollination, though.

 

[David Bruce Banner]

Well, can we be happy that we didn't promote an ex-Canuck? Because that always seems to be a sore spot around here.

 

[Hit the post]

Well, can we be happy that we didn't promote an ex-Canuck? Because that always seems to be a sore spot around here.

 

[F A N]

Tanev was a Dave Gagner recommendation and signing. Let’s not try to change history and give some other scout the credit here. IIRC, Volpatti was very much Stan Smyl’s work. Bates was Smyl’s right hand man though but he has been here a long time and it could just be time for a change.

With NCAA UFAs, the work isn’t identifying them. Every year there are lists of top college UFAs and anybody who ends up being somebody is on at least one of those lists (the top guys tend to be there multiple years) Most of the work is actually identifying which of those guys are close to being NHL players and getting them to sign.

College UFAs are a hit and miss each year I think. Some years the top guys all seem to make it, others there’s 1 or none.

 

[RobertKron]

Tanev was a Dave Gagner recommendation and signing. Let’s not try to change history and give some other scout the credit here. IIRC, Volpatti was very much Stan Smyl’s work. Bates was Smyl’s right hand man though but he has been here a long time and it could just be time for a change.

With NCAA UFAs, the work isn’t identifying them. Every year there are lists of top college UFAs and anybody who ends up being somebody is on at least one of those lists (the top guys tend to be there multiple years) Most of the work is actually identifying which of those guys are close to being NHL players and getting them to sign.

College UFAs are a hit and miss each year I think. Some years the top guys all seem to make it, others there’s 1 or none.

If I recall correctly, Gagner recommended that the scouting staff go look at Tanev when he saw his name on the RIT roster for the frozen four tournament, as he remembered him from Sam's minor hockey days. The scouts still went to watch him and made the recommendation to sign him.

edit:

When I saw that Chris was playing for RIT in the NCAA tournament, I was like ‘oh my gosh,” said Gagner.
As per Gagner’s recommendation, Canucks director of collegiate scouting Stan Smyl, along with amateur scout Jonathan Bates, professional scout Lucien Debois, and other members of the Canucks organization kept a close eye on Tanev at the recent NCAA Frozen Four tournament, in which his Tigers fell to Wisconsin in the semifinals.

Tanev a late grower, not a late bloomer

FWIW, I do agree that signing college UFAs isn't some process of a scout discovering some player out of nowhere, and is likely more weighted towards establishing a relationship with the player in order to convince them that your organization represents a good career opportunity.

 

[VanJack]

Like a lot of members of the Canucks scouting staff, I've never heard of Jonathan Bates. But the team has signed a lot of NCAA UFA's over the years....Tanev and Stecher might have been the best of the lot.

Some of the others like Keilly, Rafferty, Teves and Michaelis have been serviceable players in the organization, but probably top out as AHL players. Realistically a guy who's 24-25 and undrafted coming out of four years of college has probably hit his ceiling.

But I guess the Canucks will probably keep rolling the dice.

 

[RobertKron]

Like a lot of members of the Canucks scouting staff, I've never heard of Jonathan Bates. But the team has signed a lot of NCAA UFA's over the years....Tanev and Stecher might have been the best of the lot.

Some of the others like Keilly, Rafferty, Teves and Michaelis have been serviceable players in the organization, but probably top out as AHL players. Realistically a guy who's 24-25 and undrafted coming out of four years of college has probably hit his ceiling.

But I guess the Canucks will probably keep rolling the dice.

Any potential asset that a team can add for free will always be a significant target. Worst case, you're using a contact spot to pay a guy like 70k to play in the minors for one year in your 24-25 example.

 

[AppleHoneySauce]

Any potential asset that a team can add for free will always be a significant target. Worst case, you're using a contact spot to pay a guy like 70k to play in the minors for one year in your 24-25 example.

This and in the rare best case you grab a Nate Schmidt or Zach Whitecloud.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

i will always love todd harvey for toothlessly captaining the greatest wjc team canada of time

 

[604]

This and in the rare best case you grab a Nate Schmidt or Zach Whitecloud.

I'd take Tanev over either of those guys but agreed, there are gems to be found...I'd say we've done better than most from Colledge FAs.

 

[David Bruce Banner]

 

[AppleHoneySauce]

I'd take Tanev over either of those guys but agreed, there are gems to be found...I'd say we've done better than most from Colledge FAs.

Those were just the first ones coming to mind. I would definitely agree though.

 

[Hit the post]

 

[Grub]

If I’m not mistaken - Brackett was involved more on the drafting prep and execution side, while Bates was involved more in scouting undrafted players to sign as free agents. I’m sure their jobs had a bit of cross pollination, though.

Speaking of cross pollination. Both our bees are gone, no bees no pollination, no pollination means death to all plants. We are screwed.

 

[FOurteenS inCisOr]

I’m as big a Tanev fan as anyone, and wish he was retained, but let’s not let this past season kid anyone into thinking he’s a better player than Schmidt.

There should have been room for both on Van’s roster.

 

[MarkMM]

I’m as big a Tanev fan as anyone, and wish he was retained, but let’s not let this past season kid anyone into thinking he’s a better player than Schmidt.

There should have been room for both on Van’s roster.

Too bad the "cap space doesn't matter to rebuilding teams" line of thinking pervaded management.

Has anyone heard of where Bates is going? It would take a long time to bear fruit but it would be an interesting practice if teams made their scouts rank prospects, make projections and provide justification, and then as 1, 3, 5, 10 years go by, there's a regular review to see who has a knack for it and/or what are the common traits that are more predictive than others for success, ie, what constellation of size, athleticism, IQ, character/work ethic, skating, skill, grit, etc lead to players getting overrated or underrated. Think of it as data analytics for the eye test.