Canucks Managerial Thread III

[KeninsFan]

OK, but who's dying?

The team had 100 points last season, and are leading the division this season. (It's early, I know.)

They're bigger, faster, stronger and younger. We have dressed three 19 year-old 1st round picks in 2 seasons, and still have prospects coming in the system.

The future looks pretty good to me, and the present isn't all that bad, either.

I wasn't happy with last season nor some of the moves made in it, if you were that's cool.

This season is too early to judge but from my perspective it doesn't even look like management planned for McCann or Hutton to make this roster.

 

[y2kcanucks]

OK, but who's dying?

The team had 100 points last season, and are leading the division this season. (It's early, I know.)

They're bigger, faster, stronger and younger. We have dressed three 19 year-old 1st round picks in 2 seasons, and still have prospects coming in the system.

The future looks pretty good to me, and the present isn't all that bad, either.

The results from last season were enough to get AV fired in 2013. Or are we all supposed to have a short-term memory and not remember anything before 2014?

 

[PM]

The results from last season were enough to get AV fired in 2013. Or are we all supposed to have a short-term memory and not remember anything before 2014?

Some people have set the bar so low that anything above another Torts year is a success. The same people that laud Sbisa for completing a basic pass or not directly shooting the puck into his own net.

 

[F A N]

The idea of applying a supply and demand model to NHL trades is horribly flawed and nonsensical. The model falls apart more and more the further you get from pure/perfect competition.

I think you're missing the point of the supply and demand model. Supply and demand has always been about the value that you can get for a particular asset at one particular point in time. Lack was worth a 2015 3rd round pick at the time of the trade. Maybe he's worth a 2016 2nd. Who knows. Keeping a player just so you can squeeze out more trade value out of him can be nonsensical as well.

 

[Alan Jackson]

The results from last season were enough to get AV fired in 2013. Or are we all supposed to have a short-term memory and not remember anything before 2014?

This is a different team at a different stage than the one that continually failed in the playoffs. The focus is integrating younger players into the line-up, and changing over the core group to a new core group over the next few seasons.

Basically, we're rebuilding, without having to suck in the meantime. If we make the playoffs again and maybe even win a round, great, but the key is establishing the next core group of this team.

Also, if this team looks as poor in the playoffs as they did last season, it's entirely possible Willie would be fired.

 

[sting101]

I wasn't happy with last season nor some of the moves made in it, if you were that's cool.

This season is too early to judge but from my perspective it doesn't even look like management planned for McCann or Hutton to make this roster.

Yes but they did make moves to accommodate the youth that showed enough progression to play at the NHL level. Which was a complaint being used around here....not necessarily by you.

 

[F A N]

The results from last season were enough to get AV fired in 2013. Or are we all supposed to have a short-term memory and not remember anything before 2014?

Well if the Canucks get swept 4-0 in the first round of the playoffs I'm not sure if Willie can keep his job.

 

[sting101]

Some people have set the bar so low that anything above another Torts year is a success. The same people that laud Sbisa for completing a basic pass or not directly shooting the puck into his own net.

What is this even suppose to mean?

You can't uproot an entire aging roster and replace it with the Black Hawks in 2 off seasons.

What was your prediction for this season?

 

[y2kcanucks]

This is a different team at a different stage than the one that continually failed in the playoffs. The focus is integrating younger players into the line-up, and changing over the core group to a new core group over the next few seasons.

Basically, we're rebuilding, without having to suck in the meantime. If we make the playoffs again and maybe even win a round, great, but the key is establishing the next core group of this team.

Yet we saw the same playoff results last year that we've seen over and over again.

How are we integrating younger players into the line-up when we're giving them 9-10 minutes per game, and rotating them in and out of the lineup? We aren't integrating youth like other teams do. For some reason we think playing our youth with bad players like Dorsett will help them.

 

[y2kcanucks]

What is this even suppose to mean?

You can't uproot an entire aging roster and replace it with the Black Hawks in 2 off seasons.

What was your prediction for this season?

We'll never become the Blackhawks without top 5 picks.

 

[Cupless44]

This is a different team at a different stage than the one that continually failed in the playoffs. The focus is integrating younger players into the line-up, and changing over the core group to a new core group over the next few seasons.

Basically, we're rebuilding, without having to suck in the meantime. If we make the playoffs again and maybe even win a round, great, but the key is establishing the next core group of this team.

Also, if this team looks as poor in the playoffs as they did last season, it's entirely possible Willie would be fired.

Thanks for posting a realistic view.

I wonder what some of the posters here today actually expect from this team. Why bring up that got AV fired in 2013. The team that got bounced in the first round every year but 2011 is older and in decline. It is CLEARLY time to rebuild.

With Lack, without Sbisa, whatever...do these guys expect this team led by the slowing 35 year old Sedins to contend?

So much hate on the small stuff here and lack of vision in the big picture.

Personally I have no interest in making the playoffs with the same old veterans to get bounced in the first round. I am happy to see the team get younger, integrate prospects into the team and more interesting to watch, be competitive but I hope they miss the playoffs, move some more veterans and get some good picks in a draft I love.

 

[y2kcanucks]

Thanks for posting a realistic view.

I wonder what some of the posters here today actually expect from this team. Why bring up that got AV fired in 2013. The team that got bounced in the first round every year but 2011 is older and in decline. It is CLEARLY time to rebuild.

With Lack, without Sbisa, whatever...do these guys expect this team led by the slowing 35 year old Sedins to contend?

So much hate on the small stuff here and lack of vision in the big picture.

Personally I have no interest in making the playoffs with the same old veterans to get bounced in the first round. I am happy to see the team get younger, integrate prospects into the team and more interesting to watch, be competitive but I hope they miss the playoffs, move some more veterans and get some good picks in a draft I love.

Nope, I don't expect this team to contend. But with Lack instead of Miller, and without Sbisa we have $6.85M of extra cap space going into next season. Mismanaging the cap now will kill this team down the road.

 

[The Drop]

Nope, I don't expect this team to contend. But with Lack instead of Miller, and without Sbisa we have $6.85M of extra cap space going into next season. Mismanaging the cap now will kill this team down the road.

Don't forget that Sutter contract.

 

[sting101]

^^ well I think you guys are gonna be angry for a LONG time.

The NHL has a crazy amount of parity right now and the young guys that are cracking our lineup are special players. I think the McCann pick and Hutton are prime examples of staying competitive signing a quality UFA or 2 and suddenly your back in the game.

Blowing it up is for teams without any as-semblance of a now core that can compete and a future core that can compete. That is not this organization IMO.

 

[mathonwy]

So much hate on the small stuff here and lack of vision in the big picture.

I'm really glad you brought this up as I don't think a lot of people realize that you can't separate the two.

In construction, if you're going to build a house, there's a lot of small stuff that you need to do to ensure the house you build doesn't collapse.

In sports, salary cap management, contract management, asset management are all equally as important as talent scouting, drafting and coaching.

Having a good on-ice product with a crappy salary cap structure is exactly the same as having a really nice looking house built with plywood.

Success can only achieved if you get the details right. Yeah, you can get lucky and Boeser could turn out to be the next Gretzky but luck is not a sustainable way to achieve success.

 

[Hit the post]

I am happy to see the team get younger, integrate prospects into the team and more interesting to watch, be competitive but I hope they miss the playoffs, move some more veterans and get some good picks in a draft I love.

heh, by signing a 34 year old goalie in free agency to big bucks.

 

[sting101]

I'm really glad you brought this up as I don't think a lot of people realize that you can't separate the two.

In construction, if you're going to build a house, there's a lot of small stuff that you need to do to ensure the house you build doesn't collapse.

In sports, salary cap management, contract management, asset management are all equally as important as talent scouting, drafting and coaching.

Having a good on-ice product with a crappy salary cap structure is exactly the same as having a really nice looking house built with plywood.

Success can only achieved if you get the details right. Yeah, you can get lucky and Boeser could turn out to be the next Gretzky but luck is not a sustainable way to achieve success.

Yes and plywood doesn't crash their trucks at 5 AM wasted.

Your comparing materials with human beings?

I'm curious as to what people feel our bad contract management has taken from us?

In the next 3 off seasons:
Vrbata-Hamhuis-Prust=12.1
Miller-Burrows-Higgins=13
Sedin-Sedin-Hansen-Sbisa=20.1

 

[Zaddy91]

The results from last season were enough to get AV fired in 2013. Or are we all supposed to have a short-term memory and not remember anything before 2014?

The bar is lowered when u havnt made the 2nd round in 5 years

 

[Zaddy91]

Yes and plywood doesn't crash their trucks at 5 AM wasted.

Your comparing materials with human beings?

I'm curious as to what people feel our bad contract management has taken from us?

In the next 3 off seasons:
Vrbata-Hamhuis-Prust=12.1
Miller-Burrows-Higgins=13
Sedin-Sedin-Hansen-Sbisa=20.1

Were talking this season. If we have bad cap management it only matters this season.

That 45 million coming off the books is ignored by one side. Because you only judge a team on the current year results.

And the current year says miller and sbisa indicate we wont have 45 million coming off the books in the future. As one side has a crystal ball.

 

[sting101]

heh, by signing a 34 year old goalie in free agency to big bucks.

Or we could do nothing and suck.

FFS Benning is crushing you nay-sayers.

Miller outplaying Lack

Sutter > Bonino
Baertschi > Matthias
Virtanen > Richardson
Hutton (Corrado) > Bieksa
Bartkowski > Stanton
Prust > Kassian

Even replacing Kenins Vey with McCann and Cracknell has been a success.

Statistically we could have:
6g-6a-12p -13 for 13 million or
15-31-46 +23 for 11 million and a goalie that is playing like a starter.

Were in 1st place lol

 

[Cupless44]

heh, by signing a 34 year old goalie in free agency to big bucks.

For the record I was against the Miller signing and I was against keeping him over Lack.

The difference? I got over it and don't complain about it forever.

I don't like every move Benning has made but that holds true to a degree with any GM. But I also don't see the catastrophe that some like to play up here. I like this years team better than last years team actually.

The only thing that matters to me is that this organization finally drafts and develops good young players so we have a legitimate chance to grow into a contender again. It is the only way championships are built. I feel Benning has a pretty good handle on this critical aspect so I am willing to pass on the hate mongering and character assassination so in fashion on here and actually give the guy 3-5 years that any GM should be given to build something. I don't have to like every move along the way.

The Sedin era is winding down. I have all the respect in the word for them and they are still leading this team but look very much forward a fresh era. Burrows, Higgins etc can all can all go. Couldn't be more tired of watching same old to be honest. I know the results.

 

[Upoil]

I think you're missing the point of the supply and demand model. Supply and demand has always been about the value that you can get for a particular asset at one particular point in time. Lack was worth a 2015 3rd round pick at the time of the trade. Maybe he's worth a 2016 2nd. Who knows. Keeping a player just so you can squeeze out more trade value out of him can be nonsensical as well.

Nope. You have missed the point. The NHL in no way represents a market where supply and demand would be relevant. Trying to apply the tenants of supply and demand to a market with so many caveats is an exercise in futility. The entire idea of conceptualizing both supply and demand curves presupposes perfect competition.

 

[Intangibos]

For the record I was against the Miller signing and I was against keeping him over Lack.

The difference? I got over it and don't complain about it forever.

I don't like every move Benning has made but that holds true to a degree with any GM. But I also don't see the catastrophe that some like to play up here. I like this years team better than last years team actually.

The only thing that matters to me is that this organization finally drafts and develops good young players so we have a legitimate chance to grow into a contender again. It is the only way championships are built. I feel Benning has a pretty good handle on this critical aspect so I am willing to pass on the hate mongering and character assassination so in fashion on here and actually give the guy 3-5 years that any GM should be given to build something. I don't have to like every move along the way.

The Sedin era is winding down. I have all the respect in the word for them and they are still leading this team but look very much forward a fresh era. Burrows, Higgins etc can all can all go. Couldn't be more tired of watching same old to be honest. I know the results.

We complain about it endlessly because people defend it endlessly. This is a discussion board. We're discussing.

 

[sting101]

For the record I was against the Miller signing and I was against keeping him over Lack.

The difference? I got over it and don't complain about it forever.

I don't like every move Benning has made but that holds true to a degree with any GM. But I also don't see the catastrophe that some like to play up here. I like this years team better than last years team actually.

The only thing that matters to me is that this organization finally drafts and develops good young players so we have a legitimate chance to grow into a contender again. It is the only way championships are built. I feel Benning has a pretty good handle on this critical aspect so I am willing to pass on the hate mongering and character assassination so in fashion on here and actually give the guy 3-5 years that any GM should be given to build something. I don't have to like every move along the way.

The Sedin era is winding down. I have all the respect in the word for them and they are still leading this team but look very much forward a fresh era. Burrows, Higgins etc can all can all go. Couldn't be more tired of watching same old to be honest. I know the results.

I hear ya.

Was choked to lose Lack. But just like a lot of the players we moved on from. He's being outplayed by the ones they chose.

I'm not tired of watching the vets. What grew tiresome for me was knowing that there was no chance to get past a certain level.....the kids have renewed the excitement of "what if" for me. The great part is 5-6 more aren't even playing for us yet.

 

[coldsteel79]

We complain about it endlessly because people defend it endlessly. This is a discussion board. We're discussing.

Let's be honest very few defended this summer and the ones that did weren't even defending they were waiting to see what the team looked like when the puck dropped, and the complaining was nonstop