Post-Game Talk: Canucks @ Flames - Canucks win 3-1

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me2

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Jun 28, 2002
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I like Horvat a lot, but he looks like he's terrified of making mistakes out there and getting sent down — and seems to be taking very few risks offensively. Gets rid of the puck quickly and efficiently and rarely tries anything creative.

That's not the worst thing in the world, but I wouldn't mind seeing him try to be a little more daring. He looked so much better and confident at the end of the San Jose game after scoring a goal and loosening up a bit.

I was thinking the same thing. He needs to break out of his defensive mind set if he's going to make the next step. If he does get sent down it needs to be with the instructions to try to score 120 points because he'll have to be more offensive and a more selfish.
 

me2

Go ahead foot
Jun 28, 2002
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Make my day.
Yeah, he was pretty invisible and he really needs to show something to avoid being the odd man out. I'm not really sure what his role is, and that's not a good thing.



Yeah, any talk of trading Burrows is rubbish. The guy would clear waivers on that contract and we're stuck with him.

Not close to the player he used to be, but if he could score 30 points as an overpaid 3rd liner/PK ace, I'd be reasonably satisfied. Would be shocked if he scores 20+ goals without the Sedins and think his top-6 days are probably over.



Fair enough on Shinkaruk. Absolutely it's a good sign that points follow him around even when he doesn't play well. But I don't see these sorts of games being sustainable when the real season hits. Gotta generate shots - I want to see him have a game like Jensen did tonight where he gets 5-6 pucks on net and consistently backs off opposing defenders with his speed before I look at keeping him on the roster.

Stanton and Sbisa might have been similarly effective tonight, but the game Stanton played inspired confidence in me and Sbisa did not. He didn't crack ... but you could just feel the dumbness.

Feels like an upgrade, a better skating Alberts. But it is early and hopefully he gets better.
 

denkiteki

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Jun 29, 2010
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Got totally owned early on with only great goal keeping it goalless. But by the third were the stronger team. Canucks seem to be doing something in the room to improve going into the third. Been their best period this pre-season.

The Good

Shinkaruk - put away his goal with scorer's touch (little Eberle like). However, the thing to like best was the speed he showed on several of his rushes. This combination of speed and touch gives you hope. Could be an excellent player

Higgins - Canucks need to find where this player fits best. Has offensive talent and the Canucks might want to get him into situations where he can utilize it more. Looked a cut above others in this game.

Lack - If Lack keeps this form might wonder if Miller's money might have been better spent elsewhere. Gave Flames nothing to shoot at.

Stanton - Got around the ice very well. Maybe it was the pace of the game but he looked very mobile tonight. Give Gillis credit for an outstanding waiver wire pick up. Hopefully we get someone this year as well.

Richardson - has NHL skating and compete level. Played strong both ways in this game

Not Bad

Tommernes - started the game poorly as did most of the defense. Could see these combinations had never played together and they ended running around chasing the play and bumping into one another. But once he settled in, Tommernes started making some good passes from his own zone and creating passes for defensive partners. Thought he had strong third period. Turn around in this game happened when the defense began to play better. This, I thought, was lead by Stanton, Sbisa and Tommernes

Corrado - lack of flow in the preseason has hurt Corrado's game. Best when he can stretch the game with his movement and passes. Not as good (but improving) when
he gets caught up in endless board battles.

Sbisa - nothing to get too excited about but he looked serviceable. Showed enough strength to remove people from the play and good overall range. Have to see him when he gets under a bit more pressure which maybe where he shows some negatives.

Horvat - Needs more consistency shift to shift. Decent at times but too tentative at other points. Not always going or involved at 100%. Probably a result of his Junior experience when he was getting tons of ice time and learned to take short cuts and on-ice breathers to save energy. Lot to like about Horvat but the type of grinding game he plays takes time to develop at the NHL level.

Jensen - looked dynamic at times in this game. Has very high top end if he can get other parts of his game together. I think his overall game is developing but still a liability in his own end. Cheats toward the offense and let's checks roll off him and go to the goal. Also, not strong enough along the boards in his own zone. However, he does show great top end speed and an ability to cut thru gaps in the defense to open himself up for chances. Two games, two goals so you have to be happy about that.

The Bad

Sestito - brutal in handling the puck and prone to terrible turnovers. Looked slow with the puck and lazy at times. Will need to play better than this to be any help to the team. Getting a bruiser that can play is often not easy.

Kassian - looked like the Kassian at the beginning of last season. Lots of brain farts and individual play. Looked out of position and guessing in this game.

Hansen - if he was a player just trying out probably be cut after this game. Tailed off last season and didn't look much better tonight.

Negrin - could well have trouble making it in Utica. Simply couldn't keep up with the play. Probably the last go around for Negrin. Don't really understand why they are using up game time on this player

Huskins - showed why he is no longer in the NHL.

Calgary has every right to be excited about Bennett. He looks like a player.

Pretty much agree with everything. Shinkaruk seems to always look good int he pre-season. He was great last year too and more or less "made" the team but never played. Higgins, imo, seems to be winning a 2nd line spot at the moment. Out of all the "vet" wingers, he has been the best thus far. Burrows has played well but can't seem to finish anything and this has been going on for a while so it might not go away.

Lack was perfect again and made some great saves. Like i said when we signed Miller, i didn't like that move. Given our situation, the #1 job should have been Lack's to lose... not be given to someone else (who might not even be an upgrade over Lack!). Lack is ready as he'll ever be and for the most part, was great last year. He got wore out at the end of the year but that's expected considering he pretty much played every game after the break...

Stanton looked solid as he was pretty much all year last year. Richardson's speed really stood out. Its too bad he doesn't have better hands because he generated a few chances that would have been scoring chances if he had a better shot or was a better play maker. Of course given his role/salary, he is what he is and he's great at it.

Also i thought Corrado should be the "good" instead of not bad. He was much better today than vs SJ. Felt like he was in better defensive position and better lane management. Of course it could be because the Sharks have better forwards than the Flames. Either way, Corrado looked better.

Tommernes, i really didn't notice him much except making a few passes. All passes were on target so that's much better than say Albert who can't even make a short pass... For the most part, no complaints about his play.

Sbisa - didn't notice him and given his role, i guess that's a good thing.

Horvat - Personally i think he's borderline "good" instead of not bad. He was solid in the circle (not as good as last game but still solid). Noticed him at both end of the rink. Didn't do anything really special but just played an all-around decent game. Don't think its enough to make the team but he also didn't look out of place (which for a 19 year old is a good thing).

Jensen had an up and down game and that seems to be his game. He will show flashes of playing great and then do something dumb (like the penalty that resulted in the Flames only goal... that was a bad penalty... no excuse about it and its something that could cost the team points). Of course he also had a goal and beside that, had a few other good shifts.

As far as the bads, i completely agree with all except Hansen. Hansen didn't look great but i didn't see him looking too bad either. For him, its really another one of those meaningless games just to get his legs ready for the season. More or less like Sedins/Vrbata/etc. Of course Hansen has a bit more to play for because he could be anywhere between the 2nd line and the 4th line. Given how others competing for those spots also haven't really done much (except Higgins), i guess its "normal". If nothing else, Hansen did play better than ZK who at this point is probably losing the top 6 spot that was his to lose...

ZK looked horrible today trying to do way too much. He needs to play the game simple. He isn't going to dangle pass many NHL defenders but at the sametime he's probably stronger than most defenders. He needs to start using power moves and try to drive pass defenders instead of dangle pass them.

Huskins - I wonder why he's playing and we sent Subban back to Jr... WTF management? He has no reason to be here and no way he'll earn a contract! Better off giving the pre-season ice time to a prospect!

Side note, i don't think you listed Bonino. I think he had a good game just based on production. He didn't play great but when you get points, it makes everything look better. Don't think he deserved to be the 3rd star but regardless, he was one of the better forwards (HS probably should have been the 3rd star).

Eriksson also played solid... solid enough that if the return was enough, i have no issue at all trading Lack since our plan B for backup goalie (after Markstrom) doesn't look all that bad either. The goal against was a bad bounce and beside that he played perfect.
 

denkiteki

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Jun 29, 2010
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How's Sam Bennett the first star???

He played great, had a point, and stars were picked by Flames announcers. Most announcers will pick hometown stars over road team. Even if the announcers weren't bias, you probably could argue Bennett was the best player and if he had a few bounces, could have had a monster game. Personally i think he was the best skater today while Lack was by far the best player/game changer but since he didn't play the entire game, i guess you could argue that against him.
 

biturbo19

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Jul 13, 2010
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Higgins played right wing in Montreal on occasion. He wasn't that bad, actually. I think Higgins with either Vey or Shinkaruk would be interesting. I definitely think Burrows needs to start in the bottom six and work his way back up. Too much rust on him right now. I also think he'd pair better with Horvat than Bonino.

I recall him even playing a small bit of RW here under AV at one point. But i also recall mentions that he wasn't as comfortable there.

I was thinking the same thing. He needs to break out of his defensive mind set if he's going to make the next step. If he does get sent down it needs to be with the instructions to try to score 120 points because he'll have to be more offensive and a more selfish.

The question with Horvat for me is...even if you send him back with those instructions, and even if he succeeds and just blitzes that league racking up huge point totals...

He comes into NHL camp next year...does he default back to that hyper-cautious mode anyway? It just seems like some players are wired for that sort of mentality and only start to branch out when they're really comfortable.

Basically, i just find it hard to imagine a guy like Bo Horvat coming in to camp as a rookie trying to make the squad, and just setting the whole preseason on fire offensively...no matter how many extra years of "seasoning" you give him at lower levels. Just seems to be wired as a "defence first" player through and through.
 

denkiteki

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Jun 29, 2010
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The question with Horvat for me is...even if you send him back with those instructions, and even if he succeeds and just blitzes that league racking up huge point totals...

He comes into NHL camp next year...does he default back to that hyper-cautious mode anyway? It just seems like some players are wired for that sort of mentality and only start to branch out when they're really comfortable.

Basically, i just find it hard to imagine a guy like Bo Horvat coming in to camp as a rookie trying to make the squad, and just setting the whole preseason on fire offensively...no matter how many extra years of "seasoning" you give him at lower levels. Just seems to be wired as a "defence first" player through and through.

Difference next year for Horvat is he doesn't need to make the team in the pre-season. He will have a chance to earn a call up @ Utica. On top of that, there should be more holes in the line-up (than right now). Right now, we have "depth" in terms of numbers (since we more or less have 13 players who are NHL bound/played last year... 12 + Vey who pretty much has a spot to lose and doesn't appear to be losing it) but lack the top end talent.

Next year, however, out of these 13 players, 4 of them are UFA (Vey is a RFA too). Unlikely all of them will be back... actually odds are most or all of them will be gone. Matthias, Dorsett, Richardson, and Sestito pretty much make up forwards 10 - 13 right now so that's 3 possible roster spots. On top of other possible moves (i.e. someone getting traded at the deadline). Of course its possible we also add players to either via trade or UFA between now and start of next season but the landscape should be different regardless.
 

a Fool

Emperor has no picks
Mar 14, 2014
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Just a couple thoughts on Kass: he was pretty passive to start the game; passive to the point where Jensen got his spot with Burr and Bonino. However, later in the game he got dumped in the corner (or slashed pretty hard) and went to the bench hunched over. He woke up after that and had some nice possession and passing. These power guys never play at 100% all the time - not worried at all.
 

DCantheDDad

DisplacedNuckfan
Jul 1, 2013
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Im hoping Kassian just needs to find his feet a bit and can shake off that poor play from early in the game.

Shinkaruk was the standout player for me, tonight. His speed and finishing ability make me happy.

Higgins had a solid game. His goal was beautiful.
 

Nona Di Giuseppe

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Jul 14, 2009
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Just a couple thoughts on Kass: he was pretty passive to start the game; passive to the point where Jensen got his spot with Burr and Bonino. However, later in the game he got dumped in the corner (or slashed pretty hard) and went to the bench hunched over. He woke up after that and had some nice possession and passing. These power guys never play at 100% all the time - not worried at all.

I agree with this. Kassian is the type of guy that need to play tough hockey and preseason isn't it.

He's not going to get into a meaningless game and this is probably one of the first years he's truly confident in his up-coming role.

I also expect inconsistency while he's still young.
 

WetcoastOrca

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Jun 3, 2011
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Exhibition game.
But.
Was anyone else a little concerned about how badly we were outplayed by a team that is supposed to be one of the bottom feeders.
I'm not going to read too much into this as we were missing our defence corp and top line but this has been the pattern in all three games.
Listening to Desjardins this morning..he was not impressed.

In terms of who impressed me, Lack was far and away the best player on either team last night. Stanton and Higgins looked great. Oh and Shinkaruk doesn't do much but then keeps showing up on the score sheet. We could really use a guy like him if he can keep this up.
 

PhilMick

Formerly PRNuck
May 20, 2009
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Got totally owned early on with only great goal keeping it goalless. But by the third were the stronger team. Canucks seem to be doing something in the room to improve going into the third. Been their best period this pre-season.

The Good

snip

Orcatown reviews are back! :handclap:

Screw you summer! Don't come back!
 

ddawg1950

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Jul 2, 2010
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I recall him even playing a small bit of RW here under AV at one point. But i also recall mentions that he wasn't as comfortable there.



The question with Horvat for me is...even if you send him back with those instructions, and even if he succeeds and just blitzes that league racking up huge point totals...

He comes into NHL camp next year...does he default back to that hyper-cautious mode anyway? It just seems like some players are wired for that sort of mentality and only start to branch out when they're really comfortable.

Basically, i just find it hard to imagine a guy like Bo Horvat coming in to camp as a rookie trying to make the squad, and just setting the whole preseason on fire offensively...no matter how many extra years of "seasoning" you give him at lower levels. Just seems to be wired as a "defence first" player through and through.[/QUOTE]

One of the more accurate descriptions of Bo's game that I've seen.

Just have to let this kid play his game right now and see what we have by the end of the pre season. I've said all along that he is on the bubble...and the only way he makes the team this year is to show he can help the team as a defensively responsible forward.

People might be wishing for a dangling sniper, but that's not who this kid is. Best to let him play to his strengths and hopefully he shows enough to stick around.

The more I see of him, the more I see him as a realistic possibility for opening night.
 

brownbello

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May 6, 2009
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I remember a conversation about Horvat from last year. Playing as much as top players do in the ohl they develope a tendency to conserve energy on each shift instead of going all out. You see it in two way players. Also in London Horvat also plays longer shifts. This is why I think another year in the ohl could hurt him. He needs to develope the habit of going all out because a) his shifts would be shorter and b) his playing time will be reduced.

Side not I am surprised his face off skills are as good as they are in this pre season. I'm not sure if it's sustainable but last night it was like he was learning. Started off rough but mad some adjustments to finish off strong against stajan and monohan. That could help him stay up because sadly we really don't have that consistent face off guy outside of Henrick and say maybe Richardson.
 

arsmaster*

Guest
Bonino was frustrating to watch in the first period, some really bad plays just inside both bluelines. Nice pass on Higgins goal though.
He'll need to be sheltered 5 on 5.

Sbisa was a hot mess, sure he has decent skating and is well built, but he cannot make a play to save his life. He's #6 at best on the depth chart. Stanton is clearly the smarter more effective player. Tommernes looked the better player, but he's obviously not an NHLer and won't get a look because of his size.

The puck follows Shinkaruk, and guess where it usually finds him? In a scoring area. He's forcing the teams hand, which is all he can do.

Horvat is literally the best option we have for 3C. Why people expect him to go end to end every shift is beyond me. Those plays IMO will come, but that's not who or what he is. He's on my team if I have to submit the roster today.

Matthias is a 4th liner, like I've said for 4 years. He can be effective from that spot, but again, how much money to we want to invest in that line.

Hansen is an offense killer. Much rather see a Higgins-Horvat-Vey line than the Preparation H line. If Hansen has a spot on this team, it's as a 4th liner who is one of your top 3 PKers. Might be time to look at filling a need on defense (puck mover) for this redundant asset.

Kassian was disappointing. Which sucks, because if he can't start to realize some of his immense potential and can only light it up when the season is in shambles I don't like that outcome moving forward. Here's hoping that demotion was a wakeup call for him. Looked to me to be over thinking and not reading and reacting. He'll get better.

Jensen was good, but I still find myself wondering why a guy with his vitals can't knock anyone off the puck. I think that is what Willie was looking to see from him given the linemates he had to start. Give his space to shoot and he's dangerous, but I think he needs space. Would like to see him be a little more energetic in tight spaces. A goal is a goal, and he's got 2 in 2 games. He's making the choices tough, which is all he can do.


Edit* Forget to touch on Lack. This guy is ready to be a #1. Take away the stupidity of starting a franchise record 26 straight games as a rookie behind a terrible team and this was fairly clear last year. He looks good. The controversy remains, unfortunately.
 
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arsmaster*

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Exhibition game.
But.
Was anyone else a little concerned about how badly we were outplayed by a team that is supposed to be one of the bottom feeders.
Bottom feeder or no, I'm concerned that in 3 games we are -30 something in shot differential.
I remember a conversation about Horvat from last year. Playing as much as top players do in the ohl they develope a tendency to conserve energy on each shift instead of going all out. You see it in two way players. Also in London Horvat also plays longer shifts. This is why I think another year in the ohl could hurt him. He needs to develope the habit of going all out because a) his shifts would be shorter and b) his playing time will be reduced.

Side not I am surprised his face off skills are as good as they are in this pre season. I'm not sure if it's sustainable but last night it was like he was learning. Started off rough but mad some adjustments to finish off strong against stajan and monohan. That could help him stay up because sadly we really don't have that consistent face off guy outside of Henrick and say maybe Richardson.
Yeah, I noticed that too. Obviously Monahan learned some tricks as a rookie pro last year and beat Bo clean early, but he came back and salvaged himself.
 

arsmaster*

Guest
Let's all take this opportunity to laugh at Edmonton for continually sucking.

Yup, Calgary looks like they're building a team, and while Bennett was impressive last night we also must remember that there were 2 NHL defensman on the ice against him last night, and most of his excellent chances came against Carter Bancks line (Sestito and Kassian) and against the god awful Negrin-Huskins pair.

That was a skilled player, vs plugs. Don't get me wrong, incredibly impressive player for his first taste at this level. The battle of western canada should be fun moving forward with Nuge/Draisatl in Edmonton, Bennett/Monahan in Calgary and hopefully we can counter that with Horvat/McCann/Gaunce down the middle and Shinkaruk, Jensen and Virtanen down the wings.

I guess Edmonton is a step ahead having Nurse in the system.

Hopefully sometime in the next decade these become legit rivalries again.
 
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