Post-Game Talk: Canucks 3, Nailers 0

[Speaking Moistly]

Yeah, but that's not on the organization-- that's on Bylsma.

Bylsma was employed by the organization and allowed to keep doing that ****, that's on them.

Most teams around the league let the coach have final say on the game roster, unless they're shopping pieces for a trade.

Sure, but that doesn't mean it can't end badly for a player's development or that it's always smart.

I just don't see the AHL affiliate (as our developmental league) as the problem with our situation, at all. Especially when you compare our prospect development now to what it was like 15 years ago.

Which is what I'm saying. Development was fine until it was time to play these guys in the NHL, at that point it fell apart because Bylsma didn't like them and Shero would block the defensemen. The AHL portion was fine, the NHL one was not but it's still a part of development.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Bylsma was employed by the organization and allowed to keep doing that ****, that's on them.

No, fair enough. I meant more that our farm team, or player development within the organization wasn't the issue. It was the coach.

Sure, but that doesn't mean it can't end badly for a player's development or that it's always smart.

Uh, how many coaches would want a job where the GM is designating their roster choices for them all season long? None.

Which is what I'm saying. Development was fine until it was time to play these guys in the NHL, at that point it fell apart because Bylsma didn't like them and Shero would block the defensemen. The AHL portion was fine, the NHL one was not but it's still a part of development.

At some point, the blame can be laid to Shero and Bylsma for that. No argument there. But saying that the organization as a whole doesn't develop players reasonably well is misleading. The Pens have, by all accounts, been up front about what prospects need (skating, nutrition, conditioning, system-wise) and have turned out a pretty good string of players, blueliners especially, from WB/S who play here or elsewhere. They're not miles better than the rest of the league, but I'm not getting the "failure" tag here.

 

[PensFanSince1989]

No need for that type of hyperbole either. We can run two NHL defenses, have two capable regular season goalies, the best center depth in the game.

We need wingers. It's needed fixed for a long ass time. That's literally the only position the Oilers are strong at. And even then, they don't have the right mix of them.

lol, wow, some fans are deluded. It's funny you say no need for hyperbole...and then.. The best centre depth of the league? Maybe, only because of Malkin and Crosby (which the post you are responding to was saying 'without Crosby and Malkin". Sutter could not step up to be a valid 1st line centre.

Two NHL defences? I get that we like our defence prospects, but please....talk about hyperbole.

 

[Speaking Moistly]

No, fair enough. I meant more that our farm team, or player development within the organization wasn't the issue. It was the coach.

That we agree on.

Uh, how many coaches would want a job where the GM is designating their roster choices for them all season long? None.

How many organizations should be letting the coach have so many issues with young players? Some of what came out, if it's even part true, is ridiculous and what Bylsma showed on the ice was bad; dude took it to a ludicrous level. It shouldn't have been allowed and if that ended with Bylsma being fired or quitting...

At some point, the blame can be laid to Shero and Bylsma for that. No argument there. But saying that the organization as a whole doesn't develop players reasonably well is misleading. The Pens have, by all accounts, been up front about what prospects need (skating, nutrition, conditioning, system-wise) and have turned out a pretty good string of players, blueliners especially, from WB/S who play here or elsewhere. They're not miles better than the rest of the league, but I'm not getting the "failure" tag here

.

I think we agree.

The organization can develop players, they're not horrible at it, in fact they've had some nice success with defensemen. It's just that the last NHL regime acted as a roadblock or detriment when it came to the playing in the NHL part. It was all good until that part.

 

[Confounding Factor]

the problem is the pens just dont have enough good players/assets to address all their needs.

they have some solid blueline prospects, but nothing particularly special. not nearly enough to land the type of winger sid/geno need/deserve. they have next to no prospects up front. and they have very few assets on the nhl roster that are expendable. maybe martin. thats really it.

too many holes, not enough assets to fix them.

teams like chicago and kings have built up a lot of depth and assets through smart drafting and by dumping expensive vets when appropriate. the pens have done neither.

this is a mediocre team/organization that is propped up to pseudo-contender status by the greatness of sid and geno.

and the pens hire jim rutherford to fix the team??? laughable proposition.

You must be ignored here, since nobody ever replies to you.

 

[HandshakeLine]

The organization can develop players, they're not horrible at it, in fact they've had some nice success with defensemen. It's just that the last NHL regime acted as a roadblock or detriment when it came to the playing in the NHL part. It was all good until that part.

We're on the same page it seems.

 

[IcedCapp]

The Hynes portion of development actually seems pretty good. Bennett moved along much faster than anyone though, Despres, Dumoulin. Every grinder who has come up after 150 injuries seems ready to contribute.

I think the disconnect is between "development" and "usage." Despres had developed into an NHL player 2 years ago. He was never used as such. I know you guys are on the same page, just thought I'd stick my nose in where it wasn't needed.

 

[HandshakeLine]

The Hynes portion of development actually seems pretty good. Bennett moved along much faster than anyone though, Despres, Dumoulin. Every grinder who has come up after 150 injuries seems ready to contribute.

I think the disconnect is between "development" and "usage." Despres had developed into an NHL player 2 years ago. He was never used as such. I know you guys are on the same page, just thought I'd stick my nose in where it wasn't needed.

That is a great distinction, actually. Good call there, IC.

 

[mpp9]

lol, wow, some fans are deluded. It's funny you say no need for hyperbole...and then.. The best centre depth of the league? Maybe, only because of Malkin and Crosby (which the post you are responding to was saying 'without Crosby and Malkin". Sutter could not step up to be a valid 1st line centre.

Two NHL defences? I get that we like our defence prospects, but please....talk about hyperbole.

I'll take our group of centers over any in the league. If you took away Kopitar and Carter away from LA, they'd have two 3Cs left, just like we do.

We have NHL D-men in the minors. How is this even debatable? Dumoulin just stepped in and performed very well. Harrington outplayed him in camp. MJ stated he wants DP in the NHL this year.