Post-Game Talk: Canucks 0 @ Flyers 2 | 17/12/15 (MOD Warning Post #235)

[TruGr1t]

Yes all those great Ahl teams we had during Gillis tenure.lol Comets were a first place team that made the finals last year. This year they are competitive with Canuck prospects actually scoring a bit unlike last year. It could get ugly if Virtanen goes to junior and Vrbata Higgins are traded for futures.

All I remember was that Chicago Wolves disaster.

 

[Bad Goalie]

Gaunce.

Would like to see that. It would be his first shift at center since turning pro except for taking faceoffs which he has done a few times and was good at winning the draw.

 

[Bad Goalie]

Time for Mike Zalewski to shine. Thank you Gillis.

They'd have to sign him first. Benning didn't see fit to resign him after only his first pro season.

 

[clunk]

Would like to see that. It would be his first shift at center since turning pro except for taking faceoffs which he has done a few times and was good at winning the draw.

I've never understood why they're so adamant on him playing as a LW. He's made his name playing center in junior. Probably because he's a big body, but really, I see him much more of a fit at center and could see him developing into an elite 4C or good 3C at the NHL level.

 

[Bad Goalie]

Yes all those great Ahl teams we had during Gillis tenure.lol Comets were a first place team that made the finals last year. This year they are competitive with Canuck prospects actually scoring a bit unlike last year. It could get ugly if Virtanen goes to junior and Vrbata Higgins are traded for futures.

They have defeated one team with a record above .500.

Talk to me in March. Let's see if your belief system has been altered.

"It could get ugly"

It's already ugly. Go Back to post #451 and see if you believe the myth you are posting.

If the Canucks take a center to replace Hank, the Comets won't have 4 centers on the roster. Cassels who is over his head at 3rd center is one. Hamilton centers the energy line. Zalewski will get one line and the only guy left who has played center for real is Gaunce. I've wanted to see that since he got here. Maybe now?

Down to 3 centers and exactly 6 D of which only 2 (both rookies with less than 30 games as pros) are Vancouver property, 2 PTOs, and Negrin and Ehrhardt now the #1 pairing.

Tell me what you drink and we'll all go out and get some if it makes one that blind to reality.

 

[NuxFan09]

Looks like I missed a great game....

We're now in the bottom 5 in the standings, though.

 

[thepoeticgoblin]

Positives:
- Markström was great and is proving himself game by game in the NHL (finally). Unless Miller has an insane game against DET (or if they actually WIN?!?!?) he should go again against Florida.
- Played a competitive game

Negatives:
- no offensive threat really, Mason made 36 saves but I didn't really think he had to make enough tough stops.
- Henrik injured and we're off to the lottery.

 

[OzFlyers]

Zero goals against the worst defense in the entire league

You wan't them to score against themselves?

 

[Hansen]

Can see you have not watched a Comets game. Fedun and Biega are the two best Comets defenders. Pedan is paired with Fedun on the Comets top 2. Pedan is the guy being sheltered and helped along despite how much talent he has. Knock on Fedun is the same as Biega, to the hockey world they are too small.

Also hard to call a guy up who is out for at least a month with an injury.

Oh well? They are not the potential future of the organization. God forbid I dont give a **** about paying inordinate amounts of money to watch a faltering canucks team's less-successful-than-last-year's farm team play every single game, unlike I have for the last 4 to 5 years.

 

[go comets]

Check out the Utica thread where we have been asking why Benning didn't replace the ton of guys lost after last season many due to his simply not resigning them. The team was desperate from the start for a puck moving AHL level veteran D-man, never acquired. Team desperate for a #1 center never acquired. Needed at least one Scoring forward preferably on the RW but LW would have also been fine, nope.

The feedback from the Canucks base that follows Utica was and still is in agreement, but there are a whole bunch who respond that Benning equipped the team just fine and it allowed the young guys to, take on the heavy load. Go back to post #451 on this thread and see what's available to the Canucks now that they need help.

Whatever you do don't let another D-man go down.

Everyone involved knew that this season would be a rebuilding year for the comets. It was well known that both The canucks and comets moved out vets to make room so young players could get ice time. Don't really understand why you keep bringing up the same argument every week. You simply can not stock a farm team with vets and that in turn pushes the young players into even less minutes and thus stunting their development. No team could forsee the amount of injuries at both the NHL and Ahl level that has happened this year. First year Ahl players have shown in the past that they can improve rapidly once they figure things out. We have seen that all three years here in Utica.

 

[biturbo19]

If Henrik is done for any length of time on top of the other injuries, i suppose the good news is all the "tank fans" can try watching the team get run out of the building every night on for size.

 

[Ace of Hades]

With hank out for a uncertain amount of time, might as well roll out this lineup as it can't get any worse:

D.Sedin-Horvat-Hansen
Baertschi-McCann-Vrbata
Higgins-Gaunce-Burrows
Prust-Cracknell-Dorsett

 

[NuxFan09]

Without Hank, this team certainly has the worst centre depth in the league. I'm certain of it. Our other 3 centres are a sophomore, a rookie, and an AHL lifer.

Let's let that sink in for a moment.

 

[biturbo19]

Without Hank, this team certainly has the worst centre depth in the league. I'm certain of it. Our other 3 centres are a sophomore, a rookie, and an AHL lifer.

Let's let that sink in for a moment.

I mean yeah, your #1C and your veteran #2b or whatever you want to call Sutter end up injured...most teams are going to have terrible "center depth" if their top-2 guys go down. I mean, how many teams look anything other than miserable down the middle if you lop off their two highest minute centers?

Not sure how much there is to really "sink in" there, other than how much injuries can completely sink a team when there's this much parity in the league.

 

[m9]

I mean yeah, your #1C and your veteran #2b or whatever you want to call Sutter end up injured...most teams are going to have terrible "center depth" if their top-2 guys go down. I mean, how many teams look anything other than miserable down the middle if you lop off their two highest minute centers?

Not sure how much there is to really "sink in" there, other than how much injuries can completely sink a team when there's this much parity in the league.

No doubt. I guess we should have had another veteran center and played Horvat as a 4th liner, I'm sure that would have gone over well around here at the beginning of the year.

 

[m9]

Everyone involved knew that this season would be a rebuilding year for the comets. It was well known that both The canucks and comets moved out vets to make room so young players could get ice time. Don't really understand why you keep bringing up the same argument every week. You simply can not stock a farm team with vets and that in turn pushes the young players into even less minutes and thus stunting their development. No team could forsee the amount of injuries at both the NHL and Ahl level that has happened this year. First year Ahl players have shown in the past that they can improve rapidly once they figure things out. We have seen that all three years here in Utica.

Totally agreed, good post.

 

[Proto]

Last night there was a quintessential Bartkowski play in the 1st period. He got the puck in his own end, got up to full speed (with his head up), ignored every passing option he had, blew through the neutral zone to the red line, panicked, and then flipped the puck weakly to the opposition blue line for a turnover.

Benning is an awful, awful pro scout. He is able to identify skillsets at the amateur level, but using those same skillsets at the pro level means he routinely acquires players who simply don't think the game of hockey at a high level. No wonder he had to be "sold" on Tanev. He's the antithesis of a Benning player.

The worst part about that for a rebuild is that he's almost guaranteed to continue targeting players that will fall off a cliff faster than your average veteran as they grow older. All the guys he likes rely on physical skillsets or "having a good motor" (like Dorsett). There won't be a "cagey veteran" left on this team in two years.

 

[Proto]

I mean yeah, your #1C and your veteran #2b or whatever you want to call Sutter end up injured...most teams are going to have terrible "center depth" if their top-2 guys go down. I mean, how many teams look anything other than miserable down the middle if you lop off their two highest minute centers?

Not sure how much there is to really "sink in" there, other than how much injuries can completely sink a team when there's this much parity in the league.

The Canucks centre depth sucked when their third line centre got injured. Don't even try to chalk up this nightmarish garbage hockey team to bad luck and injuries. Before Henrik went down, they'd been pretty healthy overall. I mean, if losing a 35 point 2nd-line centre to injury derails your entire season and turns you into a bottom 5 team... you built a junk hockey team.

 

[Kickassguy]

They have defeated one team with a record above .500.

Talk to me in March. Let's see if your belief system has been altered.

"It could get ugly"

It's already ugly. Go Back to post #451 and see if you believe the myth you are posting.

If the Canucks take a center to replace Hank, the Comets won't have 4 centers on the roster. Cassels who is over his head at 3rd center is one. Hamilton centers the energy line. Zalewski will get one line and the only guy left who has played center for real is Gaunce. I've wanted to see that since he got here. Maybe now?

Down to 3 centers and exactly 6 D of which only 2 (both rookies with less than 30 games as pros) are Vancouver property, 2 PTOs, and Negrin and Ehrhardt now the #1 pairing.

Tell me what you drink and we'll all go out and get some if it makes one that blind to reality.

It's almost like Benning didn't have the foresight to plan ahead and build depth.

 

[biturbo19]

The Canucks centre depth sucked when their third line centre got injured. Don't even try to chalk up this nightmarish garbage hockey team to bad luck and injuries. Before Henrik went down, they'd been pretty healthy overall. I mean, if losing a 35 point 2nd-line centre to injury derails your entire season and turns you into a bottom 5 team... you built a junk hockey team.

Regardless of what you think Sutter is as a player...he was playing as our de facto #2C. With Bo mired in one gnarly mess of a sophomore slump...Sutter was playing top-2 Center minutes for our team. We could've had Tyler Seguin playing the 2nd most minutes on our team at Center instead of Sutter for all it matters to to the scenario of the top 2 minute playing center ice players going down to injury - result is the same.

There isn't a team in the league that could afford to lose both of it's two highest minute Centers at the same time, and not have their outlook take a steep nosedive for the duration of those injuries. That the Canucks were a middling team without any margin for issues in the first place is pretty irrelevant to the comment about our "depth down the middle" being so bad now that #1 and #2 on the depth chart are injured. Nobody has a spare #1 and #2 center just kicking around.

So of course our center depth is going to look miserable if you knock off the #1 and #2 on the depth chart at the same time. But that's universally true across nearly every team in the league save for...maybe St.Louis?

 

[Proto]

Regardless of what you think Sutter is as a player...he was playing as our de facto #2C. With Bo mired in one gnarly mess of a sophomore slump...Sutter was playing top-2 Center minutes for our team. We could've had Tyler Seguin playing the 2nd most minutes on our team at Center instead of Sutter for all it matters to to the scenario of the top 2 minute playing center ice players going down to injury - result is the same.

There isn't a team in the league that could afford to lose both of it's two highest minute Centers at the same time, and not have their outlook take a steep nosedive for the duration of those injuries. That the Canucks were a middling team without any margin for issues in the first place is pretty irrelevant to the comment about our "depth down the middle" being so bad now that #1 and #2 on the depth chart are injured. Nobody has a spare #1 and #2 center just kicking around.

So of course our center depth is going to look miserable if you knock off the #1 and #2 on the depth chart at the same time. But that's universally true across nearly every team in the league save for...maybe St.Louis?

Henrik hasn't been out at all before now. If the centre depth was so bad that losing BRANDON SUTTER turns the team into a bottom-5 club... well... that's a badly constructed roster. That's all I'm saying.

 

[Bad Goalie]

Everyone involved knew that this season would be a rebuilding year for the comets. It was well known that both The canucks and comets moved out vets to make room so young players could get ice time. Don't really understand why you keep bringing up the same argument every week. You simply can not stock a farm team with vets and that in turn pushes the young players into even less minutes and thus stunting their development. No team could forsee the amount of injuries at both the NHL and Ahl level that has happened this year. First year Ahl players have shown in the past that they can improve rapidly once they figure things out. We have seen that all three years here in Utica.

No one has ever suggested that the Comets be "stocked" with vets at the expense of the youth. Why can't you see that? What young player would be hurt by the presence of a center to help these young guys get the puck more often. Would Shink, Gaunce, Jensen, or Grenier whine about having to play with a a good center instead of Vey or Cassels? Would Subban's ice time be hurt playing with a Huskins instead of Negrin? Would Sautner learn more with a Sanguinetti then Shields, Landry, or Ehrhardt?

I have not threatened the youth development with my post requests. I have pushed for players to accelerate their development. I would expect you of all posters to recognize that. ALL AHL teams have a certain number of vets. The vet acquisitions this season are mostly AHL/ECHL rejects aside from Bachman and Fedun. Kurtz, Jones, Landry, Shields, and now Reid along with the PTOs already released are filler for the roster, not guys who will help the young guys develop. Archi was brought back due to a weakness in the forwards. I love the guy, but wouldn't a more skilled guy on that wing benefit Jensen's game? Was Negrin an integral need? Could Ehrhardt have been replaced?

There was plenty of room for guys with more skill who were available that would have done exactly what you want for the young guys, helped them develop not hold them back.

Oh. and every year i read about how no one could have foreseesn the injkuries. Yes, they could it happens every year. Last season the Comets were without 4 of their top 6 D for a stretch and almost always were missing at least 1 or 2 of them due to an injury or call-up. The injuries in vancouver coupled with injuries on the farm always leaves the farm team in the lurch. That's why 3 solid vets in the D-corps is necessary unless you have 2 experienced prospects to fill out the top 6 in which case you'd only need two of the vets. Then Negrin and Ehrhardt become depth not regulars. Note the Comets only have 1 experienced prospect (Pedan barely meets the definition with his # of AHL games played so he's real close to a rookie) and the rookie corps is a whopping 2!

Simple question. Where are all of these guys who are robbing the kids of valuable ice time? What forward would be hurt by the extra RW they have needed all year. We have already established the Center need would have hurt no one. Even with the team they have Sautner and Subban were being rotated in and out of the lineup until the issues that have occurred made it impossible not to play them every game and without any real insulation that coaches like to provide the developing player.

 

[Proto]

No one has ever suggested that the Comets be "stocked" with vets at the expense of the youth. Why can't you see that? What young player would be hurt by the presence of a center to help these young guys get the puck more often. Would Shink, Gaunce, Jensen, or Grenier whine about having to play with a a good center instead of Vey or Cassels? Would Subban's ice time be hurt playing with a Huskins instead of Negrin? Would Sautner learn more with a Sanguinetti then Shields, Landry, or Ehrhardt?

I have not threatened the youth development with my post requests. I have pushed for players to accelerate their development. I would expect you of all posters to recognize that. ALL AHL teams have a certain number of vets. The vet acquisitions this season are mostly AHL/ECHL rejects aside from Bachman and Fedun. Kurtz, Jones, Landry, Shields, and now Reid along with the PTOs already released are filler for the roster, not guys who will help the young guys develop. Archi was brought back due to a weakness in the forwards. I love the guy, but wouldn't a more skilled guy on that wing benefit Jensen's game? Was Negrin an integral need? Could Ehrhardt have been replaced?

There was plenty of room for guys with more skill who were available that would have done exactly what you want for the young guys, helped them develop not hold them back.

I agree with all this. The Comets roster this year was constructed as haphazardly as the Canucks roster, which is damning for an organization that routinely pays lip service to developing their prospects "the right way'. The Comets absolutely needed a signing like the Jason Krog/Andrew Ebbett type signings Gillis made back in the day. It would have also given the NHL club a bit of much-needed depth if they wanted to bring one of those guys up in order to cover for injuries/have the flexibility to return McCann to junior. Where the heck would the Canucks be right now if McCann hadn't been ready? What was the plan -- Linden Vey? In that case, the Comets wouldn't even have as much "depth" as they do now.

I'm pretty high on Subban. Having him stuck playing with someone like Negrin is the polar opposite of developing him the right away. The areas of his game that need work should be reinforced by whomever he's paired with so that he can A) learn, B) have someone cover for him when he inevitably makes mistakes.

This is a rudderless ship careening towards the rocks.

 

[opendoor]

If Henrik is done for any length of time on top of the other injuries, i suppose the good news is all the "tank fans" can try watching the team get run out of the building every night on for size.

Yeah, that'll be a big adjustment compared to the great hockey the Canucks have been playing so far.

 

[Tiranis]

Yeah, that'll be a big adjustment compared to the great hockey the Canucks have been playing so far.

League-worst L10 record. With Henrik out, they might not win until February or so.