Can the NHL STOP Melnyk from moving to Quebec City ( or anywhere else )?

[Melrose Munch]

No.

 

[Centrum Hockey]

That better be sarcasm cause he paid 2.2b for the rockets.

2.2 billon for the rockets how much whould be left for a team that is currently bleeding money I doubt he whould want to use all of his money for sports

 

[gstommylee]

2.2 billon for the rockets how much whould be left for a team that is currently bleeding money I doubt he whould want to use all of his money for sports

You think he wrote up a check for exactly 2.2b? No one pays that kind of money exactly up front. That's not how these transactions actually happen. He probably took out a loan and is making payments on that loan.

 

[Jumptheshark]

Back in Boston after working Sunday night's game in Ottawa and THREE different Sens gameday employees told me the same thing - Sunday was possibly the last time the Bruins will play in Ottawa.

They all believe that Melnyk will bolt for Quebec City and the NHL can not stop him. Then once the team has relocated he can then sell part or all of the team to people based from QC.

Keep in mind that the BoG was powerless to stop the North Stars from moving to Dallas in 1993

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All I can report firsthand is there in genuine apathy in Ottawa concerning the Sens right now - mostly because of Melnyk. The owner of a popular diner on Elgin St told us the damage he has caused can not be repaired. The attendance for a late Sunday afternoon game with a divisional rival says it all

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This is a toxic situation and Melnyk avoiding the BoG meeting in Georgia last week didn't help.

the NHL would try to force him to sell the team first and then move them.

Many of us have been saying for awhile that Quebec is being held back for relocation

but the nhl can stop him from doing a midnight move because the internal rules have changed--all relocation needs to be voted on and get a 75% agreement with the other clubs.

I can see the nhl forcing him to sell the team by putting pressure on him.

 

[gstommylee]

the NHL would try to force him to sell the team first and then move them.

Many of us have been saying for awhile that Quebec is being held back for relocation

but the nhl can stop him from doing a midnight move because the internal rules have changed--all relocation needs to be voted on and get a 75% agreement with the other clubs.

I can see the nhl forcing him to sell the team by putting pressure on him.

Legally the NHL can't even force the guy out as well.

 

[Masked]

The only person who would know this to be the plan would be Eugene Melnyk and he is a liar and a lunatic. So if he is telling this to people and it is trickling down to game day workers, it's to be taken with a couple pounds of salt.

 

[Gil Gunderson]

The relocation fee cited in that article is set as the difference between the franchise value in place and the projected franchise value if relocated. The franchise value difference between Ottawa and QC is bound to be pretty small.

In fact, it might be in negative territory.

Oh ok.

Is there anything preventing the league from enforcing a relocation fee that Melnyk would have no way to pay or destroy the possibility of earning a profit with a move to QC?

 

[Jumptheshark]

Legally the NHL can't even force the guy out as well.

I could be wrong--by the sens are getting equalization money from the sens and the NHL can "withhold" money from him if they want to go the legal route

 

[Melrose Munch]

Some simple thoughts on the subject:

Legally they can't stop him. He's owned the team well beyond the 7-year clause, if that even exists in his purchase contract. He owns the CTC, so there is nothing in a lease there binding him. So, let's say he moves:

If he tries to move to Houston:
Fertitta apparently, from recent news about his reaction to luxury tax in the NBA, is not an overly-wealthy man. It's unlikely that Melnyk would get anything favorable in the way of a lease, leaving him subject to game night revenues only. I would think it unlikely that Fertitta would even share Naming Rights. So, on the financial balance, this doesn't look like a good move.

If he tries to move to Hamilton:
Well, at least there is a place to play. I suppose ticket prices would be sky high. And, I suppose he could negotiate something from the increased sponsorship and Naming Rights. But, the arena is probably not going to be viable for long without serious cash involved, so again i don't see this as a really good move.

If he tries to move to Quebec:
Here is where things are complicated, and positive in many ways. The situation in Quebec for Quebecor, who has the operating rights to the arena is that:
#1- Quebecor is a publicly traded company, and as such may not have a way to put up the cash necessary to purchase a team.
#2 - Quebecor is a media company, and have the operating rights, but are currently, from reports, losing money on that deal.
#3 - Quebecor, as a media company in Quebec, would see their value absolutely sky-rocket if there were an NHL team playing there, because of the rabid nature of Quebec fans toward NHL.
For these reasons, there is an argument to be made that Quebecor, as a company, would be MORE profitable with a team playing in the Centre Videotron, even if they had to make some concessions to the team in the matters of sponsorship and Naming Rights.

The team, under Melnyk, would have this:
#1 - A huge local fan base, very rabid, which I suppose could be killed, but that would take a lot of time in Quebec.
#2 - Because of that, the team would function better financially in Quebec than they could in Ottawa.
#3 - No need for investing cash into an arena, because the current one there is state of the art.

Now, I'm not predicting anything. Nothing at all. But, I see Quebec as the ONE AND ONLY possibility for a relocation under present ownership, simply because the operators of the arena in Quebec are the only ones anywhere whose own business would profit from the presence of a team.

Think about it:
In Kansas City, you will have to pay rent, in a new market, and the rent will be somewhat high, because the city is losing revenue booking you there.
In Houston, same thing applies, except that now it's Fertitta who has 41 nights he can't book a concert of something. He loses money because of that.
In Hamilton, the arena costs are going to be prohibitive for Melnyk.

But, in Quebec, and only in Quebec, you have a situation where the operator might WELCOME a team, because of how it would affect their other business.

That alone makes it intriguing.

The Houston nba owner does not seem to be that rich he did not want to pay a player 4.3 million no wonder why he won’t bite at any nhl team

That better be sarcasm cause he paid 2.2b for the rockets.

2.2 billon for the rockets how much whould be left for a team that is currently bleeding money I doubt he whould want to use all of his money for sports

You think he wrote up a check for exactly 2.2b? No one pays that kind of money exactly up front. That's not how these transactions actually happen. He probably took out a loan and is making payments on that loan.

Fertitta paid too much for the Rockets. He should taken on some of his family. He paid 2.2 billion straight up. That's why he's haggling with the NHL price right now.

 

[Slashers98]

You make it way too much complicated... Melnyk simply has to sell a share of the Senators and move them to Quebec City after to have the team play in the Videotron Centre with a great arena lease. Everybody wins, except the fans in Ottawa. No need to change the newest realignment and it would an instant rivalry with the Habs. The Sens already play on TSN5, which is already broadcasted in Quebec City as they own the territorial rights for this part of Quebec...

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Most Bellvillians wouldn't much care, the city just wants a hockey team.

Hell half the season ticket holders are Leaf fans who just want a good time.

Belleville is a non issue, but the assumption is flat out wrong, the AHL team has nothing to do with Vancouver or Utica's scenario, again, there are reports that the Canucks aren't leaving Utica.....the 3 yr extension has been agreed to in principle....

 

[gstommylee]

Oh ok.

Is there anything preventing the league from enforcing a relocation fee that Melnyk would have no way to pay or destroy the possibility of earning a profit with a move to QC?

The NHL will never do that. That would be consider to me retaliation and i don't think the league wants to deal with the issue in the courts.

 

[Mightygoose]

You make it way too much complicated... Melnyk simply has to sell a share of the Senators and move them to Quebec City after to have the team play in the Videotron Centre with a great arena lease. Everybody wins, except the fans in Ottawa. No need to change the newest realignment and it would an instant rivalry with the Habs. The Sens already play on TSN5, which is already broadcasted in Quebec City as they own the territorial rights for this part of Quebec...

What makes it complicated is if Melnyk is willing to sell part of the team, then there are buyers that want to keep it in Ottawa and can also offer to buy part of the team.

Whoever takes over LeBreton could fit that bill weather it's Devcore or another developer.

Big questions to be is 1) will the NCC still move forward with plans that can include an arena and 2) can Melnyk reach an acceptable lease in QC while maintaining 100% ownership until it's approved.

 

[Fandlauer]

Melnyk can't even move the team 30 minutes down the 417 without it ending in disaster and a massive lawsuit lol. There's no way he has the ability or financial capacity to relocate the team.

 

[NorthCoast]

Yes, a new arena would have to be a part of a planned move. The issue in Ottawa is essentially Melnyk doesn't want to bring anything to the Lebreton project other than the Sens. He believes his asset is worth around $700 million and that's too rich for his partners. The trick would be to find someone in the GTHA that would bite and be willing to go in on some kind of new development. A long shot to be sure.

Haha...yeah, and then his price would be 1.5 bil.

If Melnyk is pricing the sens at 700 mil based on the Lebreton opportunity. Any GTA opportunity would impact the price in the same manner. From Melnyk's perspective the franchise is worth the same as an expantion franchise into a market. So whatever the league could get for a new franchise into a market is what Melnyk believes the price should be.

Do I agree with him, of course not because someone else is assuming all the risk of the opportunity actually coming to fruition, but alas this is where his head is at.

 

[NorthCoast]

This is an interesting question and I wonder where the league stands on Melnyk. It's been clear in the past that they've been unhappy with him and Bettman's recent comments on the situation have been curious. It's possible the NHL might be willing to sacrifice Ottawa and face all the upheaval and negative press of a relocation but it would have to be for an attractive location in the US. Quebec City doesn't offer the NHL anything that Ottawa doesn't already.

To which I still ask...if a market is THAT much better than Ottawa, why would the other Owners want to relocate Melnyk there instead of collect the expansion fee? Or, would the relocation fee be set the same as the expansion fee, making it prohibitive for Melnyk.

Bettman said that 32 is not a magic number.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

To which I still ask...if a market is THAT much better than Ottawa, why would the other Owners want to relocate Melnyk there instead of collect the expansion fee? Or, would the relocation fee be set the same as the expansion fee, making it prohibitive for Melnyk.

Bettman said that 32 is not a magic number.

this is a transfer, you'd still have 32

 

[gstommylee]

To which I still ask...if a market is THAT much better than Ottawa, why would the other Owners want to relocate Melnyk there instead of collect the expansion fee? Or, would the relocation fee be set the same as the expansion fee, making it prohibitive for Melnyk.

Bettman said that 32 is not a magic number.

And that doesn't mean they will end up expanding again any time soon. He also said they are not expanding again for the foreseeable future. Regardless you think Quebec is gonna pay 650m or more for a team? I doubt it.

 

[NorthCoast]

How can the 31 owners can really do other than get the league sued in Canadian courts. You can't really force an owner out unless the owner committed unethically/criminal acts. Not going to happen. They aren't going to do anything that might end up being done on themselves later.

You can if the team goes bankrupt

There is enough flexibility in relocation fees, board approval of new owners (including any minority owners), and just power/influence of the owners en mass that if they wanted to stop a relatively broke and all-together pain in the ass owner from relocating from one market to a smaller, less lucrative market, then they will find a way.

 

[NorthCoast]

this is a transfer, you'd still have 32

I'm saying the owners would rather add the new amazing US market as 33 over letting melnyk move there for a small relocation fee.

 

[powerstuck]

Most likely either the kroenkes or the league owns the nords trademarks either chould refuse to give them to melinyk

That's the smallest of the issues, if any. Team could have a totally different name and while people in Qc would be SAD, they wouldn't be MAD.

Quebecor certainly has the motivation to put an NHL team in QC, but I don't see how Melnyk benefits from his team in QC. I think of the bolded only your third point is valid. The Quebec and Ottawa markets are not that different and a well managed team in downtown Ottawa would be just as successful as a team in QC. Quebecor would need to offer Melnyk a very sweet deal in order for it to make sense and unless they could do something on the media front, I don't see it.

Melnyk's best (and easiest) option is to be a part of a larger, more lucrative development in downtown Ottawa.

I agree, but Melnyk being Melnyk, I think selling the Sens to someone else is a much more realizable outcome than Melnyk working with someone to build a new arena in downtown Ottawa. The guy is a control freak.

 

[gstommylee]

I'm saying the owners would rather add the new amazing US market as 33 over letting melnyk move there for a small relocation fee.

And who is going to pay 650m+ a team. NHL already said expanding agian won't happen again for the foreseeable future

 

[Slashers98]

An expansion is not on the NHL's agenda for the next decade...

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

So far, I haven't seen where DevCore is willing to build an arena and rent it to Melnyk. They are saying they will leave room for one. That's a totally different thing.

Lots of options, from Devcore.


"The Devcore team has left things open for Melnyk who, after all, owns the NHL franchise and has real leverage here. Devcore has offered to build the arena and rent it to the Ottawa Senators, or allow Melnyk to build the rink himself. Also on the table: If Melnyk wants to sell the team, he will find a willing buyer in the Devcore group, if the price is right."

LeBreton: the options on the table

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

You make it way too much complicated... Melnyk simply has to sell a share of the Senators and move them to Quebec City after to have the team play in the Videotron Centre with a great arena lease. Everybody wins, except the fans in Ottawa. No need to change the newest realignment and it would an instant rivalry with the Habs. The Sens already play on TSN5, which is already broadcasted in Quebec City as they own the territorial rights for this part of Quebec...

The Senators do NOT own the Territorial rights to broadcast games in QC.

What they have is an agreement, with the Canadiens, when the re-joined the NHL, to allow "Local/Regional" games to be broadcast in each others market.

This is why ALL Canadiens games, National and Local/Regional, are broadcast in Ottawa's "Market".