Scored a weird one and got in a scrap on Tuesday.
Disregard anything he says as he's daft and doesn't actual watch nearly as much as he lets on. In junior point production is very misleading sometimes but Patrick is the driver of every line he's on and isn't gifted special treatment by getting all the PP minutes like Hischier. His teammates also don't force passes to him and only look for him when he's the obvious option. Patrick was the playoff MVP because he was the main reason Brandon won the WHL championship as he took over the games. Also for the linemates argument Patricks linemates benefit far more from playing with him than he does with them. The ineptitude of certain posters is amusing at times
The 2nd team will be lucky picking Hischier.Picking Patrick over Hischier will almost be as bad of a move as picking Matthews over Laine
Then it must come down to the eye test and relative opinions on how one see's a particular player. From your opinion on Vilardi, maybe we can conclude that Wheat Kings brought Patrick perfectly up in terms of his development. His first season, he was on the 2nd/3rd line and played secondary PK minutes. Second season, he was 1st line centre and played in all the top situations on again, a very deep club that made the Memorial Cup. Remember that Patrick was a very late birthday for last year's draft. While Vilardi is missing a season and from what you said, is being brought up more slowly which is entirely fine (playing out of position could be also be a result from not superior numbers). Nonetheless, that extra season absolutely helps Patrick right now, where Vilardi can explode next year once they play the same amount of games.True, but for example, the guy you like at 1 also plays with a boatload of offensive talent and isn't putting up those types of numbers. In some ways, Windsor's current depth (when not injured) actually hurts Vilardi's ability to get prime ice-time and play in his desired position.
I'm more familiar with the OHL, I watch the Knights a lot, and have obviously seen them run rampant over terrible Sudbury, Flint and etc style teams. But, I think the stacked teammate argument is sometimes a bit overstated unless you are talking about fringe prospects playing with ridiculous talents. Obviously, a guy stuck on a very bottom level team will have trouble putting up elite numbers in that situation. But, let's be realistic, most elite talents never even report to these teams. So in a bunch of cases, it is less ice-time but playing with better teammates on a more balanced team or playing on a good to middling team but getting a boatload of ice-time. I just wish one day the CHL accurately tracked TOI so we could actually see this effect. We have eTOI but that is far from perfect.
Yes, but I was putting their respective 16 and 17 year old season against each other. I like Vilardi as a player, and I would comfortably have him 3rd in this class. My main point though is that, being on a good team isn't always a positive for someones numbers, especially if they are a key drive in that situation. Vilardi, most of the year was used as a winger next to Logan Brown on the top line, who is a comparable talent to the Wheat Kings players you mention. His season has also been disjointed due to injuries. Only reason, I would put Patrick above is that his stride and skating technique is alarming.Then it must come down to the eye test and relative opinions on how one see's a particular player. From your opinion on Vilardi, maybe we can conclude that Wheat Kings brought Patrick perfectly up in terms of his development. His first season, he was on the 2nd/3rd line and played secondary PK minutes. Second season, he was 1st line centre and played in all the top situations on again, a very deep club that made the Memorial Cup. Remember that Patrick was a very late birthday for last year's draft. While Vilardi is missing a season and from what you said, is being brought up more slowly which is entirely fine (playing out of position could be also be a result from not superior numbers). Nonetheless, that extra season absolutely helps Patrick right now, where Vilardi can explode next year once they play the same amount of games.
Vilardi has 92 games of OHL experience.
Patrick has 142 games of WHL experience (should be more if not for injuries).
Then it must come down to the eye test and relative opinions on how one see's a particular player. From your opinion on Vilardi, maybe we can conclude that Wheat Kings brought Patrick perfectly up in terms of his development. His first season, he was on the 2nd/3rd line and played secondary PK minutes. Second season, he was 1st line centre and played in all the top situations on again, a very deep club that made the Memorial Cup. Remember that Patrick was a very late birthday for last year's draft. While Vilardi is missing a season and from what you said, is being brought up more slowly which is entirely fine (playing out of position could be also be a result from not superior numbers). Nonetheless, that extra season absolutely helps Patrick right now, where Vilardi can explode next year once they play the same amount of games.
Vilardi has 92 games of OHL experience.
Patrick has 142 games of WHL experience (should be more if not for injuries).
Picking Patrick over Hischier will almost be as bad of a move as picking Matthews over Laine
I don't get it.
Still, guys like Schiefele, Monahan, and Barkov have been quite successful playing this relentless style and being able to convert their chances. Although, Barkov has been plagued with injuries and Monahan is having a down year. There is still a lot of room left for centers who play this style.I do agree that Patrick is an extremely dominant ES player, he completely controls the game when he steps on the ice. A case can be made for either one getting picked #1 OA imo, Patrick is the prototypical "oldschool" center and Hischier is more of the modern day Marner, Ehlers, Pastrnak (etc.) type player.
Players like Hischier who have highend skill have transitioned extremely well into the NHL, stylistically the game's changing and Hischier-type player's are flourishing in the modern day NHL.
I do agree that Patrick is an extremely dominant ES player, he completely controls the game when he steps on the ice. A case can be made for either one getting picked #1 OA imo, Patrick is the prototypical "oldschool" center and Hischier is more of the modern day Marner, Ehlers, Pastrnak (etc.) type player.
Players like Hischier who have highend skill have transitioned extremely well into the NHL, stylistically the game's changing and Hischier-type player's are flourishing in the modern day NHL.
Granlund is an example of a young NHL player who couldn't handle the grind of being a Center in the NHL, but has excelled at wing.
Granlund is an example of a young NHL player who couldn't handle the grind of being a Center in the NHL, but has excelled at wing.
imo people are too hard on Patrick - he's not the next Crosby, but I think he has more upside than people are giving him credit for. I definitely see a scenario where he's a decent 2-way 1C and certainly a serviceable top-2 C.