C Jack Hughes - USNTDP (2019, 1st, NJD) Part 5

[Maple Leaf]

Devils got it in

 

[HBK27]

From Scott Wheeler's Top 50 Prospects Rankings, which was released today & had Hughes #1 on the list:

I didn’t give this a second thought. Hughes is going to be a star. If not immediately, then by the end of his rookie season. He’s a front-runner for the Calder, though linemates will likely dictate his ability to win it. I have almost no concerns about his size or his ability to stick at center and remain a dominant force. He’s going to be one of the better passers in hockey for more than a decade. Even if the goal totals are never going to be monumental, his blend of puck skill, speed and creativity will make him one of hockey’s more electric puck carriers.

Wheeler: The top 50 drafted NHL prospects ranking, 2019...

 

[Cheddabombs]

From Scott Wheeler's Top 50 Prospects Rankings, which was released today & had Hughes #1 on the list:

I didn’t give this a second thought. Hughes is going to be a star. If not immediately, then by the end of his rookie season. He’s a front-runner for the Calder, though linemates will likely dictate his ability to win it. I have almost no concerns about his size or his ability to stick at center and remain a dominant force. He’s going to be one of the better passers in hockey for more than a decade. Even if the goal totals are never going to be monumental, his blend of puck skill, speed and creativity will make him one of hockey’s more electric puck carriers.

Wheeler: The top 50 drafted NHL prospects ranking, 2019...

sure Scott doesn't, but this guy on HF does and that's what matters here and we are shills to believe otherwise. shills.

 

[cg98]

Wow what a s*** show. Trying to completely tear apart a player because muh faceoffs and muh penalty kill?

Buch, youve been pumping Petterssons tires and come in here and rave about how Hughes cant take faceoffs or cant play PK. Yet Pettersson played a GRAND TOTAL OF 4:41 minutes on the PK this past season, and his faceoff percentage is 41%. Give me a break

 

[93LEAFS]

sure Scott doesn't, but this guy on HF does and that's what matters here and we are shills to believe otherwise. shills.

To be fair, there are NHL scouts who doubt his ability to stay at center. Here are some direct quotes from the Black Book from NHL scouts.

“I'm not the biggest Hughes fan compared to previous first overalls because I'm not sold he can play Center, but I haven’t seen enough of the Finn to have an opinion on who is better." - NHL Scout, December , 2018

“Hughes will need at least a year on the wing. Kakko will make a bigger impact for the first two years if not more. The guys picking Hughes could be fired before Hughes catches up.- NHL Scout, December 2019

“He’ll need to play on the wing for a bit, but he’ll be great down the middle in time.” - NHL Scout, May 2019

“I’m not convinced he can play down the middle. Look at the World Championships, he had a tough time there.” - NHL Scout, May 2019

I only took the quotes which had to do with him playing center or closely related to it. I'd also trust most veteran HF posters over Scott Wheeler when it comes to player analysis, not that it makes him necessarily wrong in this case.

 

[Favin]

A few things...

First, cherry-picked anonymous quotes like these are meaningless. (and one of these quotes even says "he'll be great down the middle")

To be fair, there are NHL scouts who doubt his ability to stay at center. Here are some direct quotes from the Black Book from NHL scouts.



I only took the quotes which had to do with him playing center or closely related to it. I'd also trust most veteran HF posters over Scott Wheeler when it comes to player analysis, not that it makes him necessarily wrong in this case.

Two, there are plenty of other scouts and talent evaluators who have whole-heartedly endorsed Hughes. Why not quote them? If people want to pull all the quotes about his size (the center/wing argument is a proxy for the size argument)...you may find some negative ones. Yes...he is small. Now, post all the quotes about his generational skill, speed, skating, etc and maybe how they could factor into his position. I pulled a few for ya....(I am sure others find additional ones):

To me, the player that has the puck more and can have more of a free-skating game, instead of playing on the wing, is going to have more of a chance to impact the game. Jack does that, he does it with his mind, he does it with skating and does it with his hands.

He impacts the game wherever he is on the ice, and he has the ability to be dangerous at the snap of your fingers.

He’s like (Chicago star) Patrick Kane, except he’s a center

It's been 20 years, to find many comparables for Jack Hughes in terms of how he transports the puck with speed and individual skill but at the same time has an incredible awareness of everyone else on the ice around him.

His ability to be elusive in traffic is similar to what Connor McDavid does; he's not afraid to challenge that opening that others may not be able to get through because he sees beyond with the opportunities there.

Three, the Devils routinely describe Hughes as a center.

Four, Hughes was the best player on the best U18 team ever assembled. Even when Turcotte played on his line, Hughes always played center.

Five, I have seen this "Hughes is a perimeter player" or "Hughes afraid to go into traffic" types arguments and all I can say is this: the people making those assertions have either (a) never watched him play or (b) have no idea what they are talking about. These are areas of strength for Hughes. He very routinely skates through traffic and is fearless. I encourage anyone to watch tape - even highlights of him 'playing against men' at Worlds - and make your own judgements. Post them here if you like.

Six, People love to make the "Hughes gets knocked off his skates" argument. Well, yes, that's because he is small and skates into traffic. But we covered that.

Seven, some of this nonsense is poorly hidden Hughes-envy from fans of another certain player or team. Folks think we don't notice, but we do.

Carry on.

 

[Favin]

A few things...

First, cherry-picked anonymous quotes like these are meaningless. (and one of these quotes even says "he'll be great down the middle")

To be fair, there are NHL scouts who doubt his ability to stay at center. Here are some direct quotes from the Black Book from NHL scouts.



I only took the quotes which had to do with him playing center or closely related to it. I'd also trust most veteran HF posters over Scott Wheeler when it comes to player analysis, not that it makes him necessarily wrong in this case.

Two, there are plenty of other scouts and talent evaluators who have whole-heartedly endorsed Hughes. Why not quote them? If people want to pull all the quotes about his size (the center/wing argument is a proxy for the size argument)...you may find some negative ones. Yes...he is small. Now, post all the quotes about his generational skill, speed, skating, etc and maybe how they could factor into his position. I pulled a few for ya....(I am sure others find additional ones):

To me, the player that has the puck more and can have more of a free-skating game, instead of playing on the wing, is going to have more of a chance to impact the game. Jack does that, he does it with his mind, he does it with skating and does it with his hands.

He impacts the game wherever he is on the ice, and he has the ability to be dangerous at the snap of your fingers.

He’s like (Chicago star) Patrick Kane, except he’s a center

It's been 20 years, to find many comparables for Jack Hughes in terms of how he transports the puck with speed and individual skill but at the same time has an incredible awareness of everyone else on the ice around him.

His ability to be elusive in traffic is similar to what Connor McDavid does; he's not afraid to challenge that opening that others may not be able to get through because he sees beyond with the opportunities there.

Three, the Devils routinely describe Hughes as a center.

Four, Hughes was the best player on the best U18 team ever assembled. Even when Turcotte played on his line, Hughes always played center.

Five, I have seen this "Hughes is a perimeter player" or "Hughes afraid to go into traffic" types arguments and all I can say is this: the people making those assertions have either (a) never watched him play or (b) have no idea what they are talking about. These are areas of strength for Hughes. He very routinely skates through traffic and is fearless. I encourage anyone to watch tape - even highlights of him 'playing against men' at Worlds - and make your own judgements. Post them here if you like.

Six, People love to make the "Hughes gets knocked off his skates" argument. Well, yes, that's because he is small and skates into traffic. But we covered that.

Seven, some of this nonsense is poorly hidden Hughes-envy from fans of another certain player or team. Folks think we don't notice, but we do.

Carry on.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Four, Hughes was the best player on the best U18 team ever assembled. Even when Turcotte played on his line, Hughes always played center.

Five, I have seen this "Hughes is a perimeter player" or "Hughes afraid to go into traffic" types arguments and all I can say is this: the people making those assertions have either (a) never watched him play or (b) have no idea what they are talking about. These are areas of strength for Hughes. He very routinely skates through traffic and is fearless. I encourage anyone to watch tape - even highlights of him 'playing against men' at Worlds - and make your own judgements. Post them here if you like.

Six, People love to make the "Hughes gets knocked off his skates" argument. Well, yes, that's because he is small and skates into traffic. But we covered that.

Seven, some of this nonsense is poorly hidden Hughes-envy from fans of another certain player or team. Folks think we don't notice, but we do.

Carry on.

4. Wroblewski said Turcotte was the team MVP. Also, you try to claim others might've never watched Hughes play, but then you try to throw out a claim towards the dart board to hope it sticks that Hughes and Turcotte played on the same line. I can say that in watching over 20 games, maybe close to 30 NTDP games that I never once saw them play on the same line at 5 on 5. I saw one or two shifts in overtime, but I don't believe there were any face-offs on those shifts, so there was no center position. If you want to count PP, Turcotte takes the face-offs, so if either of those two was the center, it's Turcotte.

7. I suspect you are directing this towards me. Very lazy on your part. Check my posting history. Maybe its not even lazy and you are claiming this on purpose, knowing that I've been consistent in my opinion of Hughes for over a year. But I guess when you can throw an outlandish claim out there against someone else because they insulted your favorite player in the 2019 draft, why not do so?

 

[My3Sons]

If Hughes’ skill and skating translate as NJ hopes it will and he stays on the wing to keep him up high by the blue line for quick breakouts in the defensive zone (would you want to be that defender having Hughes one on one by the blue line and there is no one behind you but the goalie if he gets the puck?) and someone else takes face offs is that really a big deal? If he drives play and creates offense and can possess the puck is it that critical whether he is a wing or center? This seems like splitting hairs.

 

[Favin]

4. Wroblewski said Turcotte was the team MVP. Also, you try to claim others might've never watched Hughes play, but then you try to throw out a claim towards the dart board to hope it sticks that Hughes and Turcotte played on the same line. I can say that in watching over 20 games, maybe close to 30 NTDP games that I never once saw them play on the same line at 5 on 5. I saw one or two shifts in overtime, but I don't believe there were any face-offs on those shifts, so there was no center position.

If you think face-offs are the only thing that distinguishes a center from a wing, I can't help you. I will let someone else explain for you.

 

[TGWL]

I'm not sure why some of you bother going back and forth with him. Even we (NYR fans) stop after a while.

 

[Favin]

7. I suspect you are directing this towards me. Very lazy on your part. Check my posting history. Maybe its not even lazy and you are claiming this on purpose, knowing that I've been consistent in my opinion of Hughes for over a year. But I guess when you can throw an outlandish claim out there against someone else because they insulted your favorite player in the 2019 draft, why not do so?

#7 was not aimed at you...was a rather general comment. There are a number of anti-Hughes people here, and over time, they all just kind of blend together.

 

[Azathoth]

Well I'm now convinced that if the first words out of Shero and Castron's mouths upon learning they won the draft lottery weren't "but can Hughes kill penalties?" They should be fired. Like immediately.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

imagine caring one single iota that 18 year old Jack Hughes can't kill penalties on a team with some of the better penalty killing forwards in the NHL. Couldn't be me.

 

[NJ DevLolz]

Pavel Zacha, Blake Coleman, and Travis Zajac are elite penalty killers. Why are we having this conversation?

 

[ijuka]

If you think face-offs are the only thing that distinguishes a center from a wing, I can't help you. I will let someone else explain for you.

Amazing comment. Except, it was referring to the overtime, where there are 2 forwards. So which of the two forwards do you think is the center, if not the one taking faceoffs? You can criticize him for plenty of things, but seeing this sort of a response and seeing it even getting upvotes is pretty depressing.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

....the bottom line here is Hughes is a center and will be given every opportunity to play that position in the NHL.

 

[branch]

Anyone else think he is going to need to be sheltered big time? He has the exact same build as Quinn and Quinn needed another year to presumably bulk up. I doubt he weighs more than 165lbs.

 

[lemonybergamot]

Anyone else think he is going to need to be sheltered big time? He has the exact same build as Quinn and Quinn needed another year to presumably bulk up. I doubt he weighs more than 165lbs.

I just came from the Kakko thread and thought I was reading about David Quinn, Rangers' head coach. Was confused for a second lol.

Idk about "big time", some maybe. Just like most other prospects. Hughes' excellent skating and elusiveness will help him navigate those dirty areas and other players looking to welcome him to the NHL

 

[93LEAFS]

A few things...

First, cherry-picked anonymous quotes like these are meaningless. (and one of these quotes even says "he'll be great down the middle")




Two, there are plenty of other scouts and talent evaluators who have whole-heartedly endorsed Hughes. Why not quote them? If people want to pull all the quotes about his size (the center/wing argument is a proxy for the size argument)...you may find some negative ones. Yes...he is small. Now, post all the quotes about his generational skill, speed, skating, etc and maybe how they could factor into his position. I pulled a few for ya....(I am sure others find additional ones):

NHL scouts aren't going to go on record. So, if you think them hiding behind anonymity is meaningless, then I guess Bob McKenzie's list is meaningless because his sources also are given anonymity. I legit said I took only the quotes related to him being a center because one person said Wheeler should be believed over a poster here, when there are NHL scouts who have the same issue. The discussion was purely about whether he will be a center, why would I pull a bunch of quotes unrelated to that.

 

[TheUnseenHand]

Anyone else think he is going to need to be sheltered big time? He has the exact same build as Quinn and Quinn needed another year to presumably bulk up. I doubt he weighs more than 165lbs.

We thought the same about Nico, but he stepped right in to first line center. Everyone was concerned about him and he handled it fine. He's not half as elusive as Jack, so my guess is Hughes will be fine too. I think it's a valid concern, but I tend to believe he won't have much issue handling second line center duty.

 

[Hockey Man]

hahaha

 

[nbwingsfan]

Why would I care if partisans who are only here to defend their team take me seriously? This isn’t your thread. I don’t believe this is the Devils section.

Your criticisms aren’t more valid because he plays for your team. The discussion was about his ability to play center, and Devils fans and one Rangers fan who is mad about the draft lottery results set up a false dilemma.

Hughes operates very well in one zone, and he’s good when in possession of the puck in the neutral zone. The rest of his game is shaky. There aren’t many centers in the NHL like that, especially undersized ones. There’s the occasional Malkin, but like it or not, 6’3 200 guys who have generational talent aren’t moved off the position. It’s much more likely when you have the same capability, but are only 5’10 170. Or at least it should be more likely. Marner is an example of this, as is Kane.

I’m a Wings fan who literally could not care less about the NJD, and I agree with everyone else that your so called scouting report is ridiculous, and using a player not playing on the PK at 18 to detract him is a little crazy to say the least.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

If you think face-offs are the only thing that distinguishes a center from a wing, I can't help you. I will let someone else explain for you.

Very dishonest post.

You took a sentence about 3 on 3 overtime, and turned it into 5 on 5 to try some gotcha moment.

Edit: I see @ijuka already mentioned this. Credit to him for calling out what is either poor reading comprehension or an attempt to fool everyone.

 

[Favin]

I'm not sure why some of you bother going back and forth with him. Even we (NYR fans) stop after a while.

Got it

Amazing comment. Except, it was referring to the overtime, where there are 2 forwards. So which of the two forwards do you think is the center, if not the one taking faceoffs? You can criticize him for plenty of things, but seeing this sort of a response and seeing it even getting upvotes is pretty depressing.

Not talking about overtime. Turcotte played in two overtime game this year (one vs Lincoln, one vs Russia) and they didn't appear together. There were other shifts during season when they were on ice together and Hughes was up the middle. Small sample size....but still true. I was using a small anecdote in larger response to Hughes being too small, perimeter player, not a center (or whatever the gripe de jour was).

NHL scouts aren't going to go on record. So, if you think them hiding behind anonymity is meaningless, then I guess Bob McKenzie's list is meaningless because his sources also are given anonymity. I legit said I took only the quotes related to him being a center because one person said Wheeler should be believed over a poster here, when there are NHL scouts who have the same issue. The discussion was purely about whether he will be a center, why would I pull a bunch of quotes unrelated to that.

You cherry-picked anonymous quotes. If Bob McKenzie polled his list of scouts, reviewed the results, and selected which responses to include to fit his own view...then, yes, that would be a meaningless exercise. (Thankfully, Bob does not do this).