C Auston Matthews - ZSC Lions, NLA (2016 Draft) III

[The Winter Soldier]

McKenzie recently called that "Can't carry Matthews' skates" quote outlandish and has said that it's near-consensus that the order would have been McDavid-Eichel-Matthews. I'd argue that the consensus Matthews would have went 3rd last year is stronger than the consensus that Matthews goes first this year. If Matthews was in last draft, I would have still taken Eichel, I wouldn't trade Eichel for pick 1 now. I hope Toronto enjoys Matthews, because he's a helluva player and will be a franchise center for them for a long time.

Here it is. Bob called out that comment by a Toronto writer I believe. I can sense this thread pointing this way already, since Matthews may go to the Leafs and the influx of posters to this thread, since it is obviously he or Laine.

We may have more of these outlandish statements. I won't argue with anyone that says they are comparable. But best to address this right now. Absolutely ridiculous IMO. And glad Bob addressed it last night.

 

[TheLeastOfTheBunch]

Here is what Mckenzie said yesterday. You pulled my post and I responded and it is backed up here.



Can there be a case of Matthews being comparable to Eichel? I won't argue against this. He can put of 56 points next season. But he was not ranked higher than Eichel IMO and it seems Mckenzie's also.

McKenzie's follow up tweet:



So it seems like the consensus is Matthews and Eichel would be neck and neck, and it would come down to team preference, which is a sentiment he's said for a very long time now.

 

[GellMann]

Also, Sabres fans didn't call Eichel generational to rationalize losing McDavid. Eichel is a ****ing good hockey player, and we were happy to get him because he's Eichel. We loved finishing last to guarantee one of two of the best players to be drafted since Crosby. We love Eichel and love going forward with Eichel as our franchise for the next 15 years. Leafs fans should feel the same way about Matthews. Everyone is happy, except our Atlantic division foes. In 2-3 years all will bow down to Florida, Buffalo, Toronto.

 

[Semantics]

McKenzie recently called that "Can't carry Matthews' skates" quote outlandish and has said that it's near-consensus that the order would have been McDavid-Eichel-Matthews. I'd argue that the consensus Matthews would have went 3rd last year is stronger than the consensus that Matthews goes first this year. If Matthews was in last draft, I would have still taken Eichel, I wouldn't trade Eichel for pick 1 now. I hope Toronto enjoys Matthews, because he's a helluva player and will be a franchise center for them for a long time.

Of course, and again, that's because Eichel was a year older and had an extra year of development. No one could be 100% sure at the time Matthews would take that next step like Eichel did. Heck, two years ago, it wasn't 100% certain that McDavid would go #1. He needed to take the the next step from his 2013-14 season, and he did. That extra development year is important. If you redid the 2015 draft now, with Matthews in it, there is no way there would be a consensus.

 

[Liminality]

It doesn't matter who'd go ahead of who imo. Eichel is a really great centre prospect and to see the notion that Matthews is the same type of potential is a great sign.

Think Matthews is going to be brought along carefully under Babcock and into positions to succeed and develop, I really can't wait for next season now.

 

[93LEAFS]

Also, Sabres fans didn't call Eichel generational to rationalize losing McDavid. Eichel is a ****ing good hockey player, and we were happy to get him because he's Eichel. We loved finishing last to guarantee one of two of the best players to be drafted since Crosby. We love Eichel and love going forward with Eichel as our franchise for the next 15 years. Leafs fans should feel the same way about Matthews. Everyone is happy, except our Atlantic division foes. In 2-3 years all will bow down to Florida, Buffalo, Toronto.

I'd add JT and Stamkos were in that tier behind McDavid and Crosby. And I view Matthews vs Eichel in a similar fashion, Eichel is absolutely more dynamic, flashy with elite athleticism, similar to Stamkos. Matthews is similar to Tavares in being an insanely smart player, who doesn't wow you as much but seems to always be in the right place. I'd say though Eichel is more of a playmaker than Stamkos (while Stammer is the better goal scorer) and Tavares has better vision than Matthews, but Matthews is a better skater and has a more all around game.

 

[Semantics]

Something about the idea of Matthews and Marner on the same line just puts a huge smile on my face. Both have skills that just compliment each other so well:
Vision
Hands
Patience
Hockey IQ
Creativity
They both play a 200 ft game

Once they get some time together I think this combo will click and be a joy to watch for many years.

Matthews is kind of like a much better version of Dvorak. Both are incredible finishers, have a 200 foot game, and have size that makes them difficult for defenders to control. I think he and Marner will have instant chemistry.

 

[nbwingsfan]

Would have been awfully close between Eichel and Matthews in last year's draft and its pretty hard to judge now with where Matthews played.

A Marner/Matthews duo terrifies me to play against as a Wings fan. They'll put up 3 pts a game each against our pathetic D.

 

[Space Coyote]

Can't wait for the draft.

 

[93LEAFS]

Would have been awfully close between Eichel and Matthews in last year's draft is pretty hard to judge now with where Matthews played.

A Marner/Matthews duo terrifies me to play against as a Wings fan. They'll put up 3 pts a game each against our pathetic D.

haha, don't forget about Willy anchoring that 2nd line with easy zone starts. You guys at least look to have found a gem in 2014. Seeing Detroit having to rebuild will be strange.

 

[Semantics]

For me the big reason I prefer Matthews to Eichel is that he has a stronger two way game. Eichel's positioning on the ice is sometimes a little strange and he's sometimes too willing to try low percentage plays (e.g. the giveaway to McDavid in OT). Eichel had a -1.7% CF rel in his rookie year. I suspect we'll see Matthews have a more positive effect on possession. But they're both very close and it's going to make for a great BUF-TOR rivalry.

 

[GellMann]

I'd add JT and Stamkos were in that tier behind McDavid and Crosby. And I view Matthews vs Eichel in a similar fashion, Eichel is absolutely more dynamic, flashy with elite athleticism, similar to Stamkos. Matthews is similar to Tavares in being an insanely smart player, who doesn't wow you as much but seems to always be in the right place. I'd say though Eichel is more of a playmaker than Stamkos (while Stammer is the better goal scorer) and Tavares has better vision than Matthews, but Matthews is a better skater and has a more all around game.

I see Matthews as being similar to Kopitar, but with a higher offensive ceiling, and mayyyyyyybe slightly less defensive ability, but a negligible amount if so, just because Kopitar is insane. Which is all you need at the #1 center position to win multiple cups, as we've seen.

I like Eichel's everything over Stamkos, besides shot (which is still elite.) His skating blows me away, and I'm much higher on JT and Doughty and other high picks than I am on Stamkos (if I'm Toronto, I don't go near Stamkos now)

Both pivots will be good enough to lead their teams to cups, IMO, and that's all that matters.

 

[93LEAFS]

I see Matthews as being similar to Kopitar, but with a higher offensive ceiling, and mayyyyyyybe slightly less defensive ability, but a negligible amount if so, just because Kopitar is insane. Which is all you need at the #1 center position to win multiple cups, as we've seen.

I like Eichel's everything over Stamkos, besides shot (which is still elite.) His skating blows me away, and I'm much higher on JT and Doughty and other high picks than I am on Stamkos (if I'm Toronto, I don't go near Stamkos now)

Both pivots will be good enough to lead their teams to cups, IMO, and that's all that matters.

Stamkos prior to breaking his leg was an elite skater (and is still very good). Was talking about how they were preceived entering the draft, while factoring in a bit of what they evolved to. At the moment you clearly take Doughty or JT over Stammer, but you probably take Stammer at 20-24 over JT and Doughty at that age.

But I agree, I tend to say Toews with more offensive upside when talking about Matthews. Either way it should be a good rivalry between two guys who know each other.

 

[Subbanned]

Are you kidding me the Leafs have this guy and Mitch Marner now?

Ugh. Stick Matthews with Marner shelter them this year and with some Babcock love I'm like 90% sure they will be demolishing us for the next decade.

And Nylander in there somewhere too?

To say I'm jealous would be an understatement. Didn't expect us to win but I was really hoping for two West teams to take Matthews and Laine so we dont have to play against them that often.

 

[Mad Brills*]

He is ahl eligible.............

 

[Fazkovsky]

Irony is that Kessel and Kane were both late birthdays

I don't think it prevented them from being dominant players

 

[TLeafsFan]

Are you kidding me the Leafs have this guy and Mitch Marner now?

Ugh. Stick Matthews with Marner shelter them this year and with some Babcock love I'm like 90% sure they will be demolishing us for the next decade.

And Nylander in there somewhere too?

To say I'm jealous would be an understatement. Didn't expect us to win but I was really hoping for two West teams to take Matthews and Laine so we dont have to play against them that often.

The tide is indeed turning and it won't be much longer now before the Leafs Nation tidal wave that has started to form comes crashing into shore.

 

[In It 2 Winnik]

He is ahl eligible.............

I highly doubt this guy plays any AHL games besides when the Leafs season is over and he goes down for the playoffs.

 

[Subbanned]

The tide is indeed turning and it won't be much longer now before the Leafs Nation tidal wave that has started to form comes crashing into shore.

Yeah congrats.

At least with your old management I had hope they'd mess something like this up and trade one of the young guys or make a bad pick or something.

But now it's like...welp gg.

 

[snizzbone*]

On the Matthews/Eichel debate for last year...

Yes Matthews born 2 days late but Eichel was also born a couple months late for the 2014(!) draft. Easy to say Eichel was consensus #2 because he was playing in his 18 year old season already, while Matthews would have been in his 17 year old year.

If you compare Eichel and Matthews 17 year old seasons with the USNDP, Id think Matthews would have gone ahead of Eichel. But obviously Eichel played in the NCAA and destroyed it. And now Matthewa destroyed the Swiss league.


Anyways regardless both are sick players and I'm hyped to have one. That's all that matters.

 

[bobbyt 91*]

zero doubt in my mind that Matthews would have gone 3rd. Not at all saying Eichel>Matthews but when you factor in Eichel and Matthews being closer than Pulu and Laine and that Buf picked 2nd and Ari 3rd it just makes sense that Buf takes the semi local kid in Eichel and Ari does the same with Matthews.

 

[BayStBullies]

Let's just settle at both being great players; with an arguable slight advantage for (insert your favourite here).

This discussion is going in a circle. These guys are both very good and in the same universe. Both teams should be happy.

 

[Ducks Nation*]

Eichel has better tools offensively, Matthews is better defensively. I would take Matthews.

 

[MarryMarner]

To me comparing Laine and Matthews is like comparing Ovechkin to Kopitar. Sure Ovechkin has more flash but your team is probably more complete with Kopitar.

 

[Stephen]

I really like Laine and would have been happy at 2 with him, but Matthews gives the Leafs the potential answer to Eichel and Barkov in the Atlantic for the next 10-15 years...

It's going to look a lot like Getzlaf, Thornton and Kopitar for the Pacific.