News Article: Bullying and backstabbing: the Ottawa Senators are pro sport's biggest mess

[Ice-Tray]

He is straight up the definition of a puppet. Wtf is this man.

Sure, if it pleases you dude.

 

[Ice-Tray]

More experienced GM's with employment options would arguably have walked away long ago, or like the POHO hiring attempts, not entertained the job in the first place.

When was the last time a GM quit? Was it Bryan Murray choosing to come to Ottawa to coach or was his contract up.

This kind of sentiment is just not realistic. Sounds good at first glance as a means to insult someone, but it doesn’t pass a few moments of scrutiny.

 

[DaveMatthew]

Ehhh, I mean good on you for this fabrication, and I understand that it feels a little good inside to believe that any of that is true, but the cold reality is that your entire post was mostly just fantasy. Sorry man.

There is close to zero chance that PD is looked at this way around the league by other team’s management groups.

I suppose the most painful bit is that the foundation for the rebuild looks surprisingly good for year one, with a few more years of picks to go, while D and goaltending look pretty solid, all under oppressive financial constraints. No, other league officials likely don’t share your opinion.

Fabrication? What makes you think Dorion is in any way respected as an executive around the league, or would ever get another job?

The guy’s an amateur scout masquerading as a GM. He’s never played at any level of pro hockey, has never won anything as a player, coach, or executive, and quite frankly, has difficulty putting a coherent sentence together.

Look what happened to Fenton after a couple of bad trades, and he has a way more impressive resume than Dorion. Yet somehow, Pierre is still here.

And pump the brakes on the “rebuild” is looking good. The Lightning, Leafs, Bruins, and Panthers all play in our division, are already much better than us, AND have better U-24 talent.

And this is the situation after we’ve traded all of our assets.

Keep pumping Pierre’s tires though. You probably think Milbury was a good GM too. Must have been Wang that made him do everything. At least he can speak though, so he managed to carve out a niche on TV.

Pierre is going back to scouting in Northern Quebec as soon as Melnyk loses patience and needs to distract attention, which will probably be in February.

The fact that not one player has ever said anything complimentary about Dorion, in 4 years, while all still thanking Bryan Murray, speaks volumes. As does Alfredsson stepping down as soon as Murray was no longer in charge. And did you forget that Yzerman, Francis, Linden, etc didn’t even want to talk about potentially working with him?

But yes, the hockey world is clamouring for more Pierre Dorion.

 

[Micklebot]

When was the last time a GM quit? Was it Bryan Murray choosing to come to Ottawa to coach or was his contract up.

This kind of sentiment is just not realistic. Sounds good at first glance as a means to insult someone, but it doesn’t pass a few moments of scrutiny.

To be fair, it's pretty damn rare for the circumstances to exist in which one might reasonably see a GM consider walking away from a contract.

Ottawa is a pretty unique sort of tire fire these past few years. Not sure it's enough to justify quitting as the GM, and a GM who has the resume and reputation to be comfortable enough in his league standing to just walk out might also have not let it get this bad, so who knows.

I agree it's not really fair to expect Dorion to quit. Perhaps he thinks he can get the team through this, perhaps he feels he's the only thing keeping it from getting worse, or maybe he's just holding out in hopes of a sale like some of the fans around here...

I'm not big on Dorion because I find he over-promises and under-delivers. I find he sets himself up to fail by backing himself into corners. It might all stem from him being too much of an optimist and thinking things will get better until it's too late, but at the end of the day, even acknowledging his constraints, I've often found his tenure leaves a lot to be desired. I don't think he should have quit though, he should probably be fired.

 

[DaveMatthew]

When was the last time a GM quit? Was it Bryan Murray choosing to come to Ottawa to coach or was his contract up.

This kind of sentiment is just not realistic. Sounds good at first glance as a means to insult someone, but it doesn’t pass a few moments of scrutiny.

Steve Yzerman quit last year.
Bob Clarke resigned from the Flyers in the late 00’s.

In a different sport, Alex Anthopoulous left the Blue Jays because he didn’t want to work under Mark Shapiro. Look at him and the Braves now, and compare it to the Jays. He left when his stock was at an all time high, and he chose not to get sucked into the mess that we’ve seen in Toronto over the past 3 years. Smart move.

It happens.

Also, Pierre Dorion’s contract would have been up. He chose to sign an extension after a weekend in Barbados.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Fabrication? What makes you think Dorion is in any way respected as an executive around the league, or would ever get another job?

The guy’s an amateur scout masquerading as a GM. He’s never played at any level of pro hockey, has never won anything as a player, coach, or executive, and quite frankly, has difficulty putting a coherent sentence together.

Look what happened to Fenton after a couple of bad trades, and he has a way more impressive resume than Dorion. Yet somehow, Pierre is still here.

And pump the brakes on the “rebuild” is looking good. The Lightning, Leafs, Bruins, and Panthers all play in our division, are already much better than us, AND have better U-24 talent.

And this is the situation after we’ve traded all of our assets.

Keep pumping Pierre’s tires though. You probably think Milbury was a good GM too. Must have been Wang that made him do everything. At least he can speak though, so he managed to carve out a niche on TV.

Pierre is going back to scouting in Northern Quebec as soon as Melnyk loses patience and needs to distract attention, which will probably be in February.

The fact that not one player has ever said anything complimentary about Dorion, in 4 years, while all still thanking Bryan Murray, speaks volumes. As does Alfredsson stepping down as soon as Murray was no longer in charge. And did you forget that Yzerman, Francis, Linden, etc didn’t even want to talk about potentially working with him?

But yes, the hockey world is clamouring for more Pierre Dorion.

Go Milbury!!!!

 

[Ice-Tray]

Steve Yzerman quit last year.
Bob Clarke resigned from the Flyers in the late 00’s.

In a different sport, Alex Anthopoulous left the Blue Jays because he didn’t want to work under Mark Shapiro. Look at him and the Braves now, and compare it to the Jays. He left when his stock was at an all time high, and he chose not to get sucked into the mess that we’ve seen in Toronto over the past 3 years. Smart move.

It happens.

Also, Pierre Dorion’s contract would have been up. He chose to sign an extension after a weekend in Barbados.

I’m sorry man, I just can’t take this opinion seriously.

EM is a buffoon, but he’s not breaking the law or putting people in danger. PD is having to run a team with an extremely thin budget, the horror!!!!

Get real.

 

[Micklebot]

Steve Yzerman quit last year.
Bob Clarke resigned from the Flyers in the late 00’s.

In a different sport, Alex Anthopoulous left the Blue Jays because he didn’t want to work under Mark Shapiro. Look at him and the Braves now, and compare it to the Jays. He left when his stock was at an all time high, and he chose not to get sucked into the mess that we’ve seen in Toronto over the past 3 years. Smart move.

It happens.

Also, Pierre Dorion’s contract would have been up. He chose to sign an extension after a weekend in Barbados.

I don't think it's fair to expect Dorion to leave, he does not have the reputation to land another job after walking out on an owner, even if that owner is Melnyk. Had Murray walked away, he probably could have found another GM role or President of hockey ops when one opened up, but Dorion?

 

[DaveMatthew]

I’m sorry man, I just can’t take this opinion seriously.

EM is a buffoon, but he’s not breaking the law or putting people in danger. PD is having to run a team with an extremely thin budget, the horror!!!!

Get real.

What?

Mark Shapiro wasn’t putting anyone’s life in danger either, but Anthopolous left because he knew he couldn’t put together a good team and win under the constraints he’d be under. So he left and succeeded elsewhere.

If Dorion really disagreed with Melnyk, he could’ve done the same.

I blame Melnyk for the terrible PR and financial state of the team.

I blame Dorion for the terrible trades, signings and press conferences.

Neither belongs near an NHL team after this dark era is over.

 

[DaveMatthew]

I don't think it's fair to expect Dorion to leave, he does not have the reputation to land another job after walking out on an owner, even if that owner is Melnyk. Had Murray walked away, he probably could have found another GM role or President of hockey ops when one opened up, but Dorion?

If Dorion had left in the summer of 2018, he would have been known as the guy who drafted Erik Karlsson and was a win away from getting an underdog team to the SCF.

Fast forward two years, and he’s known as the guy who couldn’t sign Erik Karlsson, Mark Stone or Matt Duchene, and who finished in last place the season after he traded away his 1st round pick... for Matt Duchene.

The first guy would get another job. The second guy won’t.

 

[Micklebot]

If Dorion had left in the summer of 2018, he would have been known as the guy who drafted Erik Karlsson and was a win away from getting an underdog team to the SCF.

Fast forward two years, and he’s now known as the guy who couldn’t sign Erik Karlsson, Mark Stone or Matt Duchene and finished in last place the season after he traded his 1st round pick.

The first guy would get another job. The second guy won’t.

He didn't draft Karlsson, Murray did, after Forsberg scouted him. Dorion was a good chief scout, sure he gets another scouting gig, but Idk if he gets a sniff as a GM or even an AGM had he quit or let his contract expire in year two.

 

[DaveMatthew]

He didn't draft Karlsson, Murray did, after Forsberg scouted him. Dorion was a good chief scout, sure he gets another scouting gig, but Idk if he gets a sniff as a GM or even an AGM had he quit or let his contract expire in year two.

Don’t tell that to Pierre. He bragged about drafting Karlsson until February 2018... he was his pride and joy, even named his dog Erik. I wonder what happened to that dog.

But either way, I hate Melnyk as much as the next guy, but that doesn’t absolve Dorion. Melnyk didn’t make the trades, Dorion did. He was as much on board with the direction as Eugene, which is why he never left.

 

[branch]

I’m sorry man, I just can’t take this opinion seriously.

EM is a buffoon, but he’s not breaking the law or putting people in danger. PD is having to run a team with an extremely thin budget, the horror!!!!

Get real.

Lmao this is a HoF worthy deflection. I expected more from you but @DaveMatthew absolutely bodied Pierre in his post. You can’t come back from that.

 

[branch]

He didn't draft Karlsson, Murray did, after Forsberg scouted him. Dorion was a good chief scout, sure he gets another scouting gig, but Idk if he gets a sniff as a GM or even an AGM had he quit or let his contract expire in year two.

Pierre’s drafting is good. I would say middle of the pack of the league. Maybe a bit higher. Other NHL teams have drafted just as well in the time Pierre was in charge of the scouting. So the narrative that he is some scouting savant is questionable as well.

 

[Micklebot]

Don’t tell that to Pierre. He bragged about drafting Karlsson until February 2018... he was his pride and joy, even named his dog Erik. I wonder what happened to that dog.

But either way, I hate Melnyk as much as the next guy, but that doesn’t absolve Dorion. Melnyk didn’t make the trades, Dorion did. He was as much on board with the direction as Eugene, which is why he never left.

Don't get me wrong, Dorion deserves plenty of criticism, I just don't blame him for not walking away from his job, one that he was never going to land anywhere else imo. Had he walked, it's not like it would have changed anything. We just would have seen some other guy trade Karlsson, and maybe that other guy does an even worse job. We certainly weren't going to see EM pay the salary needed to get somebody that had the experience to guarantee better results.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

Dorion wasn't that great a scout. What's the best pick we can actually attribute to him? Pageau?

The teams best picks over the past decade plus were from Forsberg, Lowes and Mann.

Dorion probably deserves some blame for the abysmal 2012-2014 drafts. I doubt it's a coincidence that our drafting took off once Lowes was promoted to head amateur scout in 2015 then Mann came after he left for Vegas.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

When was the last time a GM quit? Was it Bryan Murray choosing to come to Ottawa to coach or was his contract up.

This kind of sentiment is just not realistic. Sounds good at first glance as a means to insult someone, but it doesn’t pass a few moments of scrutiny.

I don't see it as a means to insult Dorion, I just think its a reality of the circumstances.

I think a respected GM confident in himself with a track record to get other high profile executive positions would absolutely throw their hands up and say enough is enough or not take the job in the first place based on the owner and the realities of the position in Ottawa.

Dorion on the other hand was brought up in the organization and was given the GM position likely in large part because of his expected pay scale and familiarity. Based on how he came in to the position, I would expect that he's not nearly as confident in getting other high profile exec positions and would be willing to put up with a lot more than any highly regarded, well paid executive with a track record would.

 

[justafan22]

 

[Qward]

Shut the front door. LA fans told us that Gaborik was done.

 

[PoutineSp00nZ]

Shut the front door. LA fans told us that Gaborik was done.

Yeah that's blatant horseshit. Everyone knew that gaborik was never playing again when they traded for him.

Hes not even trying to hide the fact that hes lying now.

 

[DaveMatthew]

So he acquired Gaborik with the intention of having him play for the team?

I mean, that was one of his good trades because Gaborik went on LTIR, but if that wasn't his intention... well... he's dumber than we thought.

 

[DaveMatthew]

Spending ~20 million under the cap floor is intentionally violating the spirit if the CBA, no matter how you spin it. It didn't happen by accident.

 

[FormentonTheFuture]

Yeah that's blatant horse****. Everyone knew that gaborik was never playing again when they traded for him.

Hes not even trying to hide the fact that hes lying now.

Just curious, why is this the case? I don't remember the details. After they traded for him he played for the Sens that year.

 

[BatherSeason]

Looks like the only guy left to control the PR damage done by this org is Dorion. Buckle up folks it could get even uglier if that's the guy you send out to control the message.

 

[OgieO]

Dorion has to say that. He can't come out and openly admit he's been instructed to game the system to pay as little as possible.

Hang the man for his terrible, terrible, trades. But this isn't really something he deserves criticism over.