DKH
The Bergeron of HF
- Feb 27, 2002
- 74,405
- 52,635
Post-Game Talk: Buffalo 24 PATS 10 - 6-6
- Thread starter Fenway
- Start date
LSCII
Cup driven
Ironically, this is one of the big gripes Brady had before he left, which means Bill has not learned a damn thing. I forget who said it but the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. It's time for some fresh faces on the sidelines.
At least we're making progress here. In order for Mac to be a stud he needs elite weapons, high end OL, and a star in the making OC. Very few if any teams have all of that. A true "stud" is able to make up for some of a team's deficiencies. Mac could be a nice little QB if he is surrounded by everything you mentioned but he is not a stud.You kidding methe longest I ever been pissed at you is 20 minutes….basically family time
Give Mac AJ Brown & Devonta Smirh with a high end OL and star in the making OC; or Jaylen Waddle & Tarek Hill with a strong OL and a veteran play caller like Frank Smith and he’s a stud
I can smell a rat when they go right after Jones - it’s the Tuukka crowd
All we need is something called Frank Smith!
You can defend Jones to the horizons end but if he needs every surrounding aspect of the game to be excellent in order for success, then what is he? Supposed to make the team excel with his play, not the other way around.
But the shitty thing is neither can or could happen because of MP. (Being serious here)
But the shitty thing is neither can or could happen because of MP. (Being serious here)
LSCII
Cup driven
Eh, I don't think he needs everything to succeed, as he had the same receiving core last year aside from their speedy draft pick from this year that has done jack shit so far, and Mac looked a hundred times better. But a good offensive line is a key for any team to be successful. I mean look at Green Bay and Rodgers this season. He's a multiple MVP winner for the league and his line sucks so bad he looks terrible most games. Just like with Mac, I don't think the issue lies at the feet of him either. A QB needs time to be able to pass the ball. If he's got 2 seconds before multiple players from the defense are on top of him, there's only so much success a guy can have. So I'd say he needs a decent line and competent and qualified coaches to scheme it up right. Not the shit sandwich he has this season
Add Mitch Trubisky's numbers for comparison and you'll find that they are similar as well. That's probably a more realistic comparison of skill sets...
GloryDaze4877
Barely Irrelevant
Just my personal take, but the Patriots have been developing coaches and getting raided for years and it happened again this past offseason with McDaniels and several offensive coaches going to Vegas. I wonder if BB wasn’t trying to circle the wagons and give more responsibility to two guys in Patricia and Judge whom he felt would stick around and lend some continuity to things.
Supposedly, the reason Nick Kaley wasn’t given a bigger role was because his contract is up after this year. They tried to extend him and couldn’t come to an agreement. Do you want that guy taking over the play calling and then leaving? Some speculated that was the same reason they didn’t try to nab BOB. If he came back and did well as OC, I’m sure he would be in line for another HC shot. If this is BB’s reasoning, I sorta get it, but I think he’s spreading himself and the remaining coaches too thin.
I don’t buy your “red flag” theory about the penalties and such being a “strong commentary”. The coaches can only do so much. I do believe that Brady was an absolute pr*** and the players were afraid to make mistakes with him, but that’s more of a commentary on Brady than a negative for BB. Plus, we all know you are a Bill hater anyway
Mac Jones was a redshirt junior. Bryce Young was a true freshman. Totally disingenuous to try and beat your chest over Mac winning that job. We don't need to rewrite history.
LSCII
Cup driven
How is the track record of the guys that get "raided" from the staff though?Just my personal take, but the Patriots have been developing coaches and getting raided for years and it happened again this past offseason with McDaniels and several offensive coaches going to Vegas. I wonder if BB wasn’t trying to circle the wagons and give more responsibility to two guys in Patricia and Judge whom he felt would stick around and lend some continuity to things.
Supposedly, the reason Nick Kaley wasn’t given a bigger role was because his contract is up after this year. They tried to extend him and couldn’t come to an agreement. Do you want that guy taking over the play calling and then leaving? Some speculated that was the same reason they didn’t try to nab BOB. If he came back and did well as OC, I’m sure he would be in line for another HC shot. If this is BB’s reasoning, I sorta get it, but I think he’s spreading himself and the remaining coaches too thin.
I don’t buy your “red flag” theory about the penalties and such being a “strong commentary”. The coaches can only do so much. I do believe that Brady was an absolute pr*** and the players were afraid to make mistakes with him, but that’s more of a commentary on Brady than a negative for BB. Plus, we all know you are a Bill hater anyway
I also wouldn't say I'm a hater. I'd say I'm a realist and I call it the way it is. If someone does a good job, I give them credit. If someone shits the bed like Bill did this year, I give them credit. And make no mistakes. There were plenty of people here and out in the league questioning the move to scrap their offensive scheme for the last 20 plus seasons in favor of installing the one they went with. And that was before they turned it over to Fat Patricia and Blow Judge. Those guys are both f***ing clowns and had no practical experience calling plays or game planning for offense. And again, there were plenty of people here and abroad questioning that decision well before the season started and we all got to see how brutal it was.
Nick Caley wasn't given that role because Bill's ego needed to show the world he could do it all by himself. If he had given the reins to Caley, it would have still been Josh's system being run. Just like his ego forced Brady out the door so he could prove to the world it was Bill and nobody else. Well, that hasn't gone so well now has it? The guy is a marginal coach with a losing record when Brady isn't playing for him, and the only thing worse than his coaching is his job as GM. He can't draft. He can't evaluate skill players. He reaches for guys that will be available far later. It's a complete shit show.
Again, all fact. Not hate. Just truth.
Absurdity
light switch connoisseur
- Jul 6, 2012
- 10,815
- 6,853
I disliked McDaniels as the offensive coordinator, don't know how much of that was on Brady, in his time here, but Patricia just sucks.
Thats bullshit and you know it. I've given plenty of criticism to him when warranted. Nobody is doing the kid any favors by having Matt Patricia coach him and that's on Bill.
Are you a Zappe lover or was that the other guy in here? Either way you know damn well we have people in here blaming Mac. I think last night was a eye opener to many. Not Mac's fault the offense sucks
Donnie Shulzhoffer
Rocket Surgery
The second Belichick leaves, this Pats team is a bottom feeder. The roster kinda sucks, Bill is a master of drawing blood from a stone. I don't like how they've decided to run the offense, but moving on from Bill ain't the answer.
Bottom feeders pick at the top of the draft. The team needs additional infusion of youth.
Maybe Sean Payton wouuld take $$$$$$$$$$$$$. Better offensive mind than we have now.
Bill is 70, not going to coach forever and is certainly not going to listen to new ideas.
Greatest coaches of all time just have longer expiration dates. They still go bad.
B to B+ on D if they don't need to play more than 60% of the minutes.
B on special teams.
D+ on O.
Lack sustained drives. Lack 2H drives and points. Massive swings on O-line and TE/RB block schemes to gain more time. The O doesn't seem to be play calling effectively against the D and there are far too many one and done possessions putting all the pressure back on the D who have no juice in the 2H. Orlovsky (sp?) nailed it a week ago when he said the receivers and the QB aren't working on the same timing... Is that because the plays are shit and Mac when he has time is told to take the first checkdown, and when he doesn't have time it's a stretch play with the O line caving... I don't know but it is worse than the Cassel offence from back in the day and that's telling on how far they have fallen.
Mac still has a noodle arm and limited mobility, but he does have smarts to make the safe throw. Only issue is the safe throw isn't getting 3rd down conversions or 2H points. Either because he is being told to play against what he is seeing, or he can't see it... 3rd year will be the telltale on this squad and it's disappointing to see the D taking miles off the clock to be mediocre - if they get better in Y 3 / 4 the D is going to be beaten down and tired so the window will be short.
B on special teams.
D+ on O.
Lack sustained drives. Lack 2H drives and points. Massive swings on O-line and TE/RB block schemes to gain more time. The O doesn't seem to be play calling effectively against the D and there are far too many one and done possessions putting all the pressure back on the D who have no juice in the 2H. Orlovsky (sp?) nailed it a week ago when he said the receivers and the QB aren't working on the same timing... Is that because the plays are shit and Mac when he has time is told to take the first checkdown, and when he doesn't have time it's a stretch play with the O line caving... I don't know but it is worse than the Cassel offence from back in the day and that's telling on how far they have fallen.
Mac still has a noodle arm and limited mobility, but he does have smarts to make the safe throw. Only issue is the safe throw isn't getting 3rd down conversions or 2H points. Either because he is being told to play against what he is seeing, or he can't see it... 3rd year will be the telltale on this squad and it's disappointing to see the D taking miles off the clock to be mediocre - if they get better in Y 3 / 4 the D is going to be beaten down and tired so the window will be short.
Oh, sorry Donnie. Feel free to find one person who has done it.
You're simply not listening. A lot of people have blamed Mac. Nobody is ONLY blaming Mac.
DKH
The Bergeron of HF
- Feb 27, 2002
- 74,405
- 52,635
Like Cassidy was hated, Ullmark was a great signing, and the Bruins are very good many here will likewise eventually realize Mac is very good but was surrounded by a shit sandwich
Donnie Shulzhoffer
Rocket Surgery
Guys, it's really pretty simple. Mac Jones was throwing moronic interceptions earlier in this season. I will give him credit for reigning that in recently. The coaching staff blows. Bob Kraft more and more feels like just a casual fan and not the ruthless owner I want to see. There doesn't seem to be any pressure on Bill whatsoever internally. That allows him to bring in old bobos like Joe Judge and Matt Patricia because they are cheap yes men. That allows him to draft Cole Strange in the first round. Everything about the operation sucks right now. This is not everyone ganging up on Mac Jones. The product stinks because of the collective failure of the organization. But at the same time we don't also have to prop up Mac Jones as some stud QB without any proof. It's just unnecessary.
ON3M4N
Ignores/60 = Elite
You likely looked it up so why not just include them in your post?
So then is it fair to say there are very few QB "studs" in the NFL?
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