Confirmed with Link: [BUF/FLA] Dmitri Kulikov, #33 for Mark Pysyk, #38, #89

[Royal Thunder]

Nelson is the wildcard. I think they see him as playing on the 3rd pair and improving the transition game and the PP.

Would be great to see him keep Franson out of the lineup

 

[Orvald]

They're pretty split on this on the Panthers board, too.

To be honest if you look at it.

Draftpicks
we moved up 5 spots for our 2nd rounder and 3rd rounder. This is just a normal draft trade.

Pysyk for Kulikov, Pysyk has played 126 games over 4 seasons, and is only a year younger than kulikov. If I was a panthers fan I would be worried about getting a fringe NHL'er.

 

[Matt Ress]

I think it's pretty clear we got the better pick and the better player.

 

[1972]

I think Kulikov is a far better player and fit for us then Pysyk. Great trade.

 

[Lock3Boys]

Coller deserves to be criticized for not properly understanding and using the analytics he references.

Totally agree, and will add that his man crush on Pysyk is clouding his vision.

 

[flashsabre]

Hilarious listening to HH with Peters and Rivet glowing about the deal and Kulikov's game while Coller sits silently as producer. I like Pysyk's game but I thought Coller's meltdown was ridiculous.

 

[truthbluth]

Digging deeper into Kulikov's advanced stats, and what I see is that Matthew Coller needs to stop letting his love for Pysyk cloud his judgement.

He cherry picks one Kulikov stat in his article.

"When with Kulikov, Ekblad’s Goals For Percentage was 51.1% and 47.5% Corsi, but when Ekblad played with anyone else, he had a 61.1% GF% and 52.9% Corsi."

That certainly looks bad, but if you dig a little deeper, you get a different story.
All numbers are 5v5 unless otherwise mentioned.

Together, Kulikov and Ekblad took:
31.5% O zone faceoffs
28.7% D zone faceoffs
39.8% N zone faceoffs
and finished 52.3% of their shifts in the O zone.

After they split up, Kulikov with a rotation of partners including Petrovic, Kampfer and Gudbranson, he took:
29.3% O zone faceoffs
35.0% D zone faceoffs
35.7% N zone faceoffs
and finished 45.6% of their shifts in the O zone.

After they split up, Ekblad paired almost exclusively with Campbell and took:
37.4% O zone faceoffs
26.3% D zone faceoffs
36.3% N zone faceoffs
and finished 58.7% of their shifts in the O zone.

So together, Kulikov and Ekblad took 32% O zone vs 29% D zone, but after they split up:
Kulikov 29/35%, while Ekblad went 37/26%
That is a massive difference.

But if you look even close, the disparity gets crazier.
When playing just with Campbell, with whom Ekblad played nearly 500 minutes, they Ekblad took 39% O zone, and 24% D zone faceoffs. That is a wild difference.


Kulikov also had negative relative corsi with Fla's big 3 forwards, without a corresponding split in O zone, vs D zone faceoffs, but he had positive corsi effects on Petrovic (next most min. after Ekblad among D), and the shutdown line of Mackenzie, Howden, Thornton (all of whom had negative corsi effects from Campbell).

Basically, when asked to drive offense, he wasn't great. But when asked to match up against top competition and prevent scoring, he was excellent.

Coller's analysis that he's an average 2nd pairing defenseman seems way off here. He's an average top pairing, #2 guy, but a top tier, 2nd pairing shut down guy. Could be a fit with Risto, may not, but he'll be very good in the top 4.

 

[Revelate]

Basically, when asked to drive offense, he wasn't great. But when asked to match up against top competition and prevent scoring, he was excellent.

Coller's analysis that he's an average 2nd pairing defenseman seems way off here. He's an average top pairing, #2 guy, but a top tier, 2nd pairing shut down guy. Could be a fit with Risto, may not, but he'll be very good in the top 4.

Exactly. It's embarrassing for Coller.

 

[truthbluth]

Exactly. It's embarrassing for Coller.

I wouldn't go that far, but he's definitely feeling personally distraught from the Sabres trading 'his guy'.
Give him time to warm up to Kulikov, and I'm confident he'll see the upside. Right now, he's a little more focused on what went out the door, vs what came in.

 

[Myllz]

Anyone have the audio? I want to hear Coller's meltdown.

 

[Chainshot]

It also allows them to push Gorges down the lineup and either make him Bogosian's safety valve or a third pairing PK specialist with someone like Franson or Nelson.

 

[Sabretip]

It also allows them to push Gorges down the lineup and either make him Bogosian's safety valve or a third pairing PK specialist with someone like Franson or Nelson.

I see:
1) McCabe sliding up into Gorges' spot alongside Ristolainen;
2) Kulikov filling McCabe's spot alongside Bogosian;
3) Gorges sliding down to 3rd pairing with either Nelson or Franson.

 

[dasaybz]

I see:
1) McCabe sliding up into Gorges' spot alongside Ristolainen;
2) Kulikov filling McCabe's spot alongside Bogosian;
3) Gorges sliding down to 3rd pairing with either Nelson or Franson.

Exactly how it should be. From the eye test last year, Gorges was nothing more than a 3rd pairing guy. My opinion ...

 

[billsandsabres]

And he would write you a detailed diatribe in an argument that would make you foam at the mouth... And the salutation would still always read "Ta,"


Ahhhhh TBT

the Ta, !!!

unmistakable! solid reappearance, that's a blast from the past.

 

[Royal Thunder]

Exactly how it should be. From the eye test last year, Gorges was nothing more than a 3rd pairing guy. My opinion ...

Gorges was playing way over his head with the matchups and minutes last year. He did his best but didn't look great, his skating and lack of puck skills really got exposed. In a bottom pairing / PK role he can still be a useful player. This is part of the benefit of adding Kulikov for sure

 

[jBuds]

Is there audio of on air meltdown from Collared greens ??

 

[jBuds]

I hate snobs who misuse analytics / forget to factor immeasurables

 

[1972]

Coller isn't a hockey guy, not sure why so many care what he has to say. He's a stats guy, who much like Yost and others isn't even that great at interpreting data. They would get schooled by actual analytics people employed by teams.

You basically hope Mark Pysyk can become as good as what Kulikov is today, he's not there. Kulikov isn't a star but he's a top pairing dman or at the very least a terrific second pairing guy.

 

[dasaybz]

Gorges was playing way over his head with the matchups and minutes last year. He did his best but didn't look great, his skating and lack of puck skills really got exposed. In a bottom pairing / PK role he can still be a useful player. This is part of the benefit of adding Kulikov for sure

Exactly how I feel. Well put.

 

[Dubi Doo]

I see:
1) McCabe sliding up into Gorges' spot alongside Ristolainen;
2) Kulikov filling McCabe's spot alongside Bogosian;
3) Gorges sliding down to 3rd pairing with either Nelson or Franson.

McCabe is not ready for top pairing minutes. He's too much of a liability defensively, and he struggles moving the puck up the ice from the defensive zone. It seems like he's being massively overrated lately. Am I a fan of his potential? Sure, but he hasn't even proven he's a reliable top-4 defenseman, and yet people want to put him on the top pairing? Eeeek. Let the man develop on the 3rd pairing. He's got all the tools, but needs a lot of work on the mental side of the game.

 

[dasaybz]

McCabe is not ready for top pairing minutes. He's too much of a liability defensively, and he struggles moving the puck up the ice from the defensive zone. It seems like he's being massively overrated lately. Am I a fan of his potential? Sure, but he hasn't even proven he's a reliable top-4 defenseman, and yet people want to put him on the top pairing? Eeeek. Let the man develop on the 3rd pairing. He's got all the tools, but needs a lot of work on the mental side of the game.

I feel like he's more suitable for the top 4 than Gorges. McCabe was a much better player than Gorges last year IMO. Also, I think he definitely makes improvement in year 2. That first year is so tough on these players ...

 

[Chad Thundercock]

Coller isn't a hockey guy, not sure why so many care what he has to say. He's a stats guy, who much like Yost and others isn't even that great at interpreting data. They would get schooled by actual analytics people employed by teams.

But that's what Florida is now.

The trade makes sense on both ends, and will come down to if the Sabres were right/wrong in not giving Pysyk more of an opportunity.

 

[JackTheRipper]

WGR had a Panthers reporter on this morning and he had a very high opinion of Kulikov.

 

[jBuds]

I feel like he's more suitable for the top 4 than Gorges. McCabe was a much better player than Gorges last year IMO. Also, I think he definitely makes improvement in year 2. That first year is so tough on these players ...

I don't think he's more suitable for the top four than Gorges AT THIS TIME, nor do I think he had a better season than Gorges did last year, either.


Why do I think the USA WC trip and being named to the all-tournament team are clouding the view of what actually happened with McCabe last year?


He wasn't bad by any means. He had a decent year, especially when you consider where he came from and how long it usually takes players to settle in when they take that route and play that position on the ice.


He is a part of my future blueline; he has a lot of work to do, still...






As for Gorges, I agree. Again... all year, you could see that Gorges was hanging on by a thread with regards to his role. He did it, he didn't break, he played pretty well, but you can't expect that to happen again. We got lucky. Kulikov eating into those minutes in ANY fashion, alleviating the "imminent demise" (for lack of a nicer term), is a bonus for our D corps.

 

[jBuds]

WGR had a Panthers reporter on this morning and he had a very high opinion of Kulikov.

As long as you don't have any delusions as to what we're getting, you should see that he can handle a lot and is a fit for what we need.