Confirmed with Link: Boucher fired

[danielpalfredsson]

I’m pretty sure 90% of the other teams can’t afford these contracts, and most of the teams with money are at the cap already and have their own players to worry about, and why would other teams drive up the price of RFA players? They are already upset with what Toronto gave their own players, never mind doing it to each other.

8 million for Chabot is not driving up the RFA market anymore than Ryan O'Reilly signing for 5 million back in 2012 would drive up the RFA market. There's significant historical evidence to support that market value for Chabot should be in the 8.5-9.0 million range over 7 years when he becomes an RFA on July 1st 2020. This is based around elite young defenders historically getting over 10 percent of the cap, and the cap projected to be around 86.5 million.

The idea that he'd sign 8.XX x 5 years is not enough to drive up the market. It would also (similar to O'Reilly) be seen as an apple and oranges type situation since it would have been a contract signed under an offer sheet and not a typical RFA negotiation. You can listen to interviews with agents and execs who will explain that typically agents use comparable situations to dictate contracts (IE they won't go in with an RFA and say "this UFA got this"). Similar to how O'Reilly didn't lead to a bunch of 5M (which was a ton at the time) bridge deals, a Chabot offer sheet won't be likely to disrupt the RFA market.

4.XXM for White over 4-5 years is also not enough to drive up the market for the same reasons above.

 

[Countdown0]

Love how in that Tim and Sid video, we see them playing the clip of Dorion saying that he "hasn't made Boucher's job easy" for the last few weeks. I think it'd be more accurate to say he "made Guy's job difficult." No time line, just difficult.

 

[supsens]

What is zero concern?

There were rampant stories that structure was an issue with the Stone contract. If we couldn't shell out signing bonuses for Stone, how is it plausible we could shell them out to defend offer sheets against White or Chabot?

How is it plausible we could start an offer sheet war? A team would be GLAD if we sent their player an offer sheet. Amazing, they get cap space, and they get a few first round picks that are going to be in the top 5 of the draft. You think it's plausible we are going to give up 1, 2, or 4 first round picks in a rebuild?

Let's also not ignore how implausible it is that a player would sign an offer sheet here. It would have to be way above market value to compensate for the fact that he is signing with a team that has finished at the bottom of the league two years in a row and is a constant source of league wide drama.

What you're saying makes no sense and isn't backed up by anything that has happened here in the last year and a half. We're both arguing from a circumstantial point of view, but at least there's significant evidence based on using our team's past behavior as a predictor of future behavior to support the ideas I am putting forward.

Haha whatever makes you lose sleep at night. Here’s what’s going to happen..nothing
Anyone offer Nurse money? Nylander? Trouba?

 

[Alex1234]

You guys will argue anything. We would match end of story. Other GM’s don’t ever do it,they don’t want the prices of RFA’s going up and they don’t want there 22 year old players being targeted, not Ceci their players
Did you see how many nice young RFA’s had issues getting paid this summer? Back away from the edge and calm yourself

 

[danielpalfredsson]

Haha whatever makes you lose sleep at night. Here’s what’s going to happen..nothing
Anyone offer Nurse money? Nylander? Trouba?

No, but the last time there was a team with a major RFA who was perceived to be handcuffed by finances, the Flyers took advantage of it by offering that team's star player a massively front loaded contract filled with signing bonuses.

The idea that an offer sheet is plausible is predicated on our inability to pay front loaded signing bonuses being a threat we would have to defender against. The teams you listed don't have to defend against that threat because they can pay that money.

 

[supsens]

We offered EK 11, we offered stone 10.5 we offered Duchene 8.
It’s fairly obvious there is money to pay someone.
Ya ya bonus whaaa whaaa, if push comes to shove will we pay those. But there is no offer incoming anyway.
Talk about fear mongering

 

[supsens]

No, but the last time there was a team with a major RFA who was perceived to be handcuffed by finances, the Flyers took advantage of it by offering that team's star player a massively front loaded contract filled with signing bonuses.

The idea that an offer sheet is plausible is predicated on our inability to pay front loaded signing bonuses being a threat we would have to defender against. The teams you listed don't have to defend against that threat because they can pay that money.

And the cap?

 

[danielpalfredsson]

And the cap?

Having a salary cap is not the same as there not being cap flexibility. If that was the case, we wouldn't see the amount of player movement we do. That's not an argument against the plausibility of offer sheets against the Ottawa Senators.

 

[supsens]

Having a salary cap is not the same as there not being cap flexibility. If that was the case, we wouldn't see the amount of player movement we do. That's not an argument against the plausibility of offer sheets against the Ottawa Senators.

I’m saying EM could drive up those players prices on you out of spite year in and year out forever. All of a sudden every player you own costs minimum 1 million more then you want. It’s a no win game

 

[danielpalfredsson]

I’m saying EM could drive up those players prices on you out of spite year in and year out forever. All of a sudden every player you own costs minimum 1 million more then you want. It’s a no win game

That's not how offer sheets work.

A team has to own the appropriate compensation. The Senators would not be able to give out perpetual offer sheets because they would run out of picks. The amount a player can be signed to an offer sheet for without giving up a pick is incredibly low, too low to execute the plan you are describing.

Players would also have to want to sign here. This was gone over about 10 posts ago.

It would also be incredibly idiotic for us to risk giving up our draft picks to spite other teams and overpay players ourselves.

How is that going to work?

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

I’m saying EM could drive up those players prices on you out of spite year in and year out forever. All of a sudden every player you own costs minimum 1 million more then you want. It’s a no win game

That's ridiculous.

 

[BonkTastic]

Has anyone found the audio of Maclean and Burke ripping Melnyk to shreds?

It's one thing to read summaries of what was said, but I feel like that it would be somewhat cathartic and good therapy to actually hear it.

 

[Mr Hat]

We offered EK 11, we offered stone 10.5 we offered Duchene 8.
It’s fairly obvious there is money to pay someone.
Ya ya bonus whaaa whaaa, if push comes to shove will we pay those. But there is no offer incoming anyway.
Talk about fear mongering

If push comes to shove we pay bonus money? We've basically gotten shoved off a 100 story building to avoid paying Stone and EK bonus heavy NMC contracts.

Unless coupons to Bert's Bar that expired in 2017 count as bonus money it's not happening.

 

[Engineer]

You guys are arguing with somebody whose most coherent arguments are "ya ya" and "blah blah"

Just let it talk to the wall.

 

[Dale Gribble]

Has anyone found the audio of Maclean and Burke ripping Melnyk to shreds?

It's one thing to read summaries of what was said, but I feel like that it would be somewhat cathartic and good therapy to actually hear it.

March 1: The circus continues in Ottawa - Sportsnet.ca

 

[danielpalfredsson]

Has anyone found the audio of Maclean and Burke ripping Melnyk to shreds?

It's one thing to read summaries of what was said, but I feel like that it would be somewhat cathartic and good therapy to actually hear it.

I am guessing it was probably on Hockey Central at Noon Hockey Central @ Noon - Sportsnet.ca

 

[RaMai]

Post of the year candidate, with this poster words don't work maybe this is getting through

 

[supsens]

That's not how offer sheets work.

A team has to own the appropriate compensation. The Senators would not be able to give out perpetual offer sheets because they would run out of picks. The amount a player can be signed to an offer sheet for without giving up a pick is incredibly low, too low to execute the plan you are describing.

Players would also have to want to sign here. This was gone over about 10 posts ago.

It would also be incredibly idiotic for us to risk giving up our draft picks to spite other teams and overpay players ourselves.

How is that going to work?

Ya but other teams want to overpay for our players and give up their picks cause it’s incredibly idiotic right?
They would sign here for money that was already gone over. You know the thing 21 year old nhl kids are looking for

Thanks for Building my case for me. The point is the other team matches and enters cap hell, also you get new picks back every year and they don’t have RFA’s you want to target every year so I have no idea why you would run out of picks. Plus we have all the cap room in the world so adding a decent young 4 or 5 million dollar player isn’t going to hurt.
Anyway I’m right so it does not matter

 

[BonkTastic]

March 1: The circus continues in Ottawa - Sportsnet.ca

Gracias!

 

[supsens]

If push comes to shove we pay bonus money? We've basically gotten shoved off a 100 story building to avoid paying Stone and EK bonus heavy NMC contracts.

Unless coupons to Bert's Bar that expired in 2017 count as bonus money it's not happening.

Stone didn’t want to play here anymore. Sucks but it happened, anyway this is going nowhere you guys can waste your time being worried about a non issue, enjoy

 

[L'Aveuglette]

Stone didn’t want to play here anymore. Sucks but it happened, anyway this is going nowhere you guys can waste your time being worried about a non issue, enjoy

Not that you merit any response with your unabashed support of a tire-fire of an organisation, but you have to realize that losing Stone was for the majority of the fanbase the last straw, so dismissing it with "sucks but it happened" shows that your standards are incredibly low. Non-existent really.

 

[harrisb]

Stone didn’t want to play here anymore. Sucks but it happened, anyway this is going nowhere you guys can waste your time being worried about a non issue, enjoy

You’ve already said it wasn’t about money, all of our glorious picks you mention guarantee we’re going to be a dynasty soon, so why exactly is it that these guys don’t want to stay? Provide examples for each of EK, Stone, Duchene, Dzingel please, we’re contenders in no time so I’d like to hear why they left?

Sounds like a perfect scenario, tons of cash, tons of cap room, prospects galore, cheap cost of living, lots of picks, I’m confused....

 

[supsens]

You’ve already said it wasn’t about money, all of our glorious picks you mention guarantee we’re going to be a dynasty soon, so why exactly is it that these guys don’t want to stay? Provide examples for each of EK, Stone, Duchene, Dzingel please, we’re contenders in no time so I’d like to hear why they left?

Enjoy!

 

[Alex1234]

We offered EK 11, we offered stone 10.5 we offered Duchene 8.
It’s fairly obvious there is money to pay someone.
Ya ya bonus whaaa whaaa, if push comes to shove will we pay those. But there is no offer incoming anyway.
Talk about fear mongering

Of course money is never a problem with this franchise
Never will
Yaa Yaa badluck Whaa Whaa

 

[harrisb]

Enjoy!

Hey Pierre, you should really stop contradicting yourself