News Article: Botchford died of overdose of cocaine and fentanyl

[orcatown]

Drug addiction is such tough one. I believe we must be responsible for our own lives and whether you are success (which itself is not always easy to define) or a failure is determined by your ability to make decent choices. Making excuses for yourself such as my parents sucked, the patriarchy screwed me up, didn't have chance because of racism, poverty, body shape etc, etc... may make you feel better but don't, I believe, in our present society, determine people's inability to make the best of themselves. In fact, I'd say relying on such excuses often inhibits much ability to do so. Ultimately, I believe, that it is one's own personal shortcomings (and we all have them) that results in us falling short of what we might have become. As Shakespeare said - "The fault lies not in our stars, but in ourselves.."

Life is mostly IMO about getting off the mat and facing, with as much courage as we can muster, the difficulties life is going to bring. And no one said it was going to be easy.

That said, addiction seems almost beyond our ability to control. It is rampant in our society. How many people, just to get enough sleep so they can work the next day (and support their families) take sleeping aids and ultimately become addicted, how many people waddle around many pounds over weight heading toward all manner of health problems because they have a sugar addiction, how many live in constant and horrible back pain and seek some relief which they then become habituated to. In many cases it is the physical and chemical demands of your body that is making decisions and totally overriding any mental ability to control these demands. It is something beyond morality or rationally.

Addition is sneaky and happens at chemical level. It is something like Depression. Chemical imbalances are happening which you don't control and they are creating impulses which you can't control. They differ from the kinds of intellectual or emotional rationalizations of poor decisions which can be surfaced and thus considered and decided upon.

I don't know what the circumstances were with Botchford. To me, he always seemed to a high energy, high anxiety, driven person. That IMO contributed to his success as reporter and commentator. But such underlying anxiety can be so strong that it is impossible to control and can drive you to decisions which are beyond your capacity to control.

 

[Seattle Totems]

The issue here is the total silence from Botch's friends and colleagues. They surely knew how he died and some would have partaken in the same behaviours but not a single word regarding the dangers of casual drug use has been uttered. I dont think his family needs more condolences. Surely they made this public so that regular people who are not addicts would speak out or be warned.

 

[Canadian Canuck]

So sad. Doesn't diminish the amazing career he had as a writer.

Don't do drugs everyone. They ruin lives, even if you think they are safe, addiction and lacing are becoming more and more common, especially in BC

 

[Seattle Totems]

Drug addiction is such tough one. I believe we must be responsible for our own lives and whether you are success (which itself is not always easy to define) or a failure is determined by your ability to make decent choices. Making excuses for yourself such as my parents sucked, the patriarchy screwed me up, didn't have chance because of racism, poverty, body shape etc, etc... may make you feel better but don't, I believe, in our present society, determine people's inability to make the best of themselves. In fact, I'd say relying on such excuses often inhibits much ability to do so. Ultimately, I believe, that it is one's own personal shortcomings (and we all have them) that results in us falling short of what we might have become. As Shakespeare said - "The fault lies not in our stars, but in ourselves.."

Life is mostly IMO about getting off the mat and facing, with as much courage as we can muster, the difficulties life is going to bring. And no one said it was going to be easy.

That said, addiction seems almost beyond our ability to control. It is rampant in our society. How many people, just to get enough sleep so they can work the next day (and support their families) take sleeping aids and ultimately become addicted, how many people waddle around many pounds over weight heading toward all manner of health problems because they have a sugar addiction, how many live in constant and horrible back pain and seek some relief which they then become habituated to. In many cases it is the physical and chemical demands of your body that is making decisions and totally overriding any mental ability to control these demands. It is something beyond morality or rationally.

Addition is sneaky and happens at chemical level. It is something like Depression. Chemical imbalances are happening which you don't control and they are creating impulses which you can't control. They differ from the kinds of intellectual or emotional rationalizations of poor decisions which can be surfaced and thus considered and decided upon.

I don't know what the circumstances were with Botchford. To me, he always seemed to a high energy, high anxiety, driven person. That IMO contributed to his success as reporter and commentator. But such underlying anxiety can be so strong that it is impossible to control and can drive you to decisions which are beyond your capacity to control.

Literally no statement has been released to suggest that Botchford was an addict. Suggesting that he was an addict or that the fentanyl crisis only affects addicts is flippant and does nothing to address the underlying issue at hand.

Regular everyday people with careers and family are dying because cocaine use is normalized and the supply is tainted with fentanyl. Thats what people should be talking about. Not more of the same nonsense about addiction. All the addiction talk in this thread does is smear the Botchford.

 

[RandV]

Eating cheeseburgers is a choice. Drinking 2L of pop a day is a choice. Such choices can lead to cardiovascular disease and type II diabetes....and food addiction is real.
We all make poor choices for our health. But the underlying social/psychological drivers for these choices are incredibly complex. I'm afraid that characterizing it as "easily avoidable" is a gross over simplification and promotes a "not my problem" culture that hinders the search for solutions.

What should also be taken into account is that we're all wired differently. As someone who has never done and never will take drugs it would be easy for me to take the high ground, but the truth is I'm just wired that way. As a happy introvert I find the idea of mind altering substances, alcohol included, a huge turnoff. Then you get to the price point where I'm frugal to begin with and these habits can be very expensive, and the thought of doing drugs becomes downright appalling. But on the other hand, author Brandon Sanderson has a new Stormlight Archive book coming out in November, and maybe one of these days GRRM will finish Winds of Winter, and I'll dive into those 1200 pages tomes like the absolute worst junky and finish them in 2-3 days.

So drugs, along with many other things, are basically a carrot and stick thing. The stick is about your life circumstances, and the carrot is about appealing it is based on how you're wired. While it's a 'personal choice' to eat the carrot in the end (unless you're force fed it via Dr. prescribed pain medications) I don't think you should judge people when we all have widely different circumstances and tastes.

 

[orcatown]

Literally no statement has been released to suggest that Botchford was an addict. Suggesting that he was an addict or that the fentanyl crisis only affects addicts is flippant and does nothing to address the underlying issue at hand.

Regular everyday people with careers and family are dying because cocaine use is normalized and the supply is tainted with fentanyl. Thats what people should be talking about. Not more of the same nonsense about addiction. All the addiction talk in this thread does is smear the Botchford.

Clearly said that I don't know the circumstances were surrounding death of Botchford. There was a general discussion about addiction and that is what I addressed.

If you want to be a moderator then apply. People can talk about what they want here and you are nothing like the arbitrator of that. People have a perfect right to talk about addiction since the substances involved in Botchford's death have everything to do with addiction. That doesn't mean anyone is calling Botchford an addict.

Saying we cannot talk about addiction, even in a general way, because it smears Botchford is inane. If you extend that argument then we can never talk about addiction since it will always smear someone. And you saying that we should only be talking about cocaine use being normalized or that fentanyl being tainted and not the underlying problem of addiction is massively short-sighted. Of course, we should address the the underlying issue of addiction. It is like you are saying that if fentanyl wasn't tainted or cocaine use normalized and the nonsense of addiction was disregarded then everything would be fine. Not sure what rock you've been under but addiction is a huge problem for people and needs to addressed.

Also, you seem upset that the underlying issue at hand, as you put it, is not being addressed. Well if you are saying that the underlying issue at hand in the Botchford death is related to the fentanyl crisis aren't you suggesting that Botchford case is related to addiction??? Or does the fentanyl crisis have nothing to do with addiction? Ironically you bringing up the fentanyl crisis in connection of Botchford death does much more to connect Botchford with addiction than I, at any point, do.

And where did I say that the fentanyl crisis was only related to addicts??? You are putting words in my mouth to try to create some sort of platform for yourself. And here again, you seem bizarrely to indicate that addition has nothing to do with fentanyl use.

It seems like you are so invested in the good name of Botchford (and I'm not saying that he should be criticized b/c I don't know what the circumstances of his death) that were you can't get involved with a rational discussion of addiction. Need to separate your arguments from your emotions here.

 

[Fatass]

Literally no statement has been released to suggest that Botchford was an addict. Suggesting that he was an addict or that the fentanyl crisis only affects addicts is flippant and does nothing to address the underlying issue at hand.

Regular everyday people with careers and family are dying because cocaine use is normalized and the supply is tainted with fentanyl. Thats what people should be talking about. Not more of the same nonsense about addiction. All the addiction talk in this thread does is smear the Botchford.

Why is fentynol put into certain drugs anyway? Is it because it’s used as filler, so saves the drug dealers’ money, or is it addictive too, so better hooks the user?

 

[MS]

If only addiction were that simple.

Please tell me you're the sort of person who also calls suicide selfish.

There is nothing to indicate that Botchford was an addict. This was probably recreational drug use.

And it's an interesting dynamic. If Botch had left his young family fatherless by getting liquored up in a bar and hopping in a car and wiping himself out on a telephone pole, nobody would be disagreeing with comments like those of @Brickstrom . And I'm not really sure how recreationally using drugs in the current climate with what he should have known about Fentanyl risks is much different. I have a few friends who used to party fairly hard and now have kids and they definitely have a 'Not touching that shit anymore!' attitude about things now that they're parents and people are dropping like flies.

If you're a parent, you have responsibilities outside of yourself and if you make stupid/risky decisions that impact your family negatively, I don't necessarily think you should get a free pass for it.

 

[m9]

There is nothing to indicate that Botchford was an addict. This was probably recreational drug use.

And it's an interesting dynamic. If Botch had left his young family fatherless by getting liquored up in a bar and hopping in a car and wiping himself out on a telephone pole, nobody would be disagreeing with comments like those of @Brickstrom . And I'm not really sure how recreationally using drugs in the current climate with what he should have known about Fentanyl risks is much different. I have a few friends who used to party fairly hard and now have kids and they definitely have a 'Not touching that shit anymore!' attitude about things now that they're parents and people are dropping like flies.

If you're a parent, you have responsibilities outside of yourself and if you make stupid/risky decisions that impact your family negatively, I don't necessarily think you should get a free pass for it.

Agreed 100%, well said.

 

[Bam19]

Why is fentynol put into certain drugs anyway? Is it because it’s used as filler, so saves the drug dealers’ money, or is it addictive too, so better hooks the user?

To make the drugs feel stronger, so you can use more fill.

 

[Boose Brudreau]

Why is fentynol put into certain drugs anyway? Is it because it’s used as filler, so saves the drug dealers’ money, or is it addictive too, so better hooks the user?

it's an opioid that is almost 100x stronger than morphine. it absolutely contributes to how f***ed up one gets. being an opioid it possibly increases the chances of a physical dependence but i don't know.

 

[Grub]

You’d be surprised how many normal functioning individuals are using for recreational use, I work in investment banking in asia and I can tell you ALOT of rich 6-7 figure folks, intelligent individuals, influential people, folks that many kids inspire to be, are using it recreationally, and still operating normally.

Some do it due to the stressful environment and some do it because it makes them think better and have more energy. Many just do it for fun. They aren’t addicts but rec users.

I’m not going to judge here, but I think poor Botchford was just using this recreationally and had a bad batch given to him.

RIP Botch.

 

[Catamarca Livin]

Is it your 'bad life choice' to be born into systemic poverty and disenfranchisement where the people kids look up to are broken people themselves? Is it your bad life choice to grow up in a toxic family where your dad beats your mom and you every weekend? Is it your bad life choice to get sexually abused as a little kid by your alcoholic dad's alcoholic friend? Is it your bad life choice to feel inferior as a kid every day compared to your peers? How much 'personal responsibility' does the victims of those circumstances that broke them really bear? Although I'm not absolving anyone of the responsibility of their actions here, it's still very safe and stable middle class thinking to expect a healthy and balanced adult to grow up from those situations. It's a massive uphill battle and very few are able to make it out of that pit of despair.

Now I'm not saying Botch had to experience any of that, I'm talking about what more often than not leads to things like drug use, addiction and crime. I think with Botch it was probably (speculating) more about addictive personality and the relation of that to the conditions of his life/job. He was working and churning out content 24/7, people can't do that naturally. Is the Athletic salary structure different than traditional journalism?

You have a victim's mentality. Everyone's situation is different but most everyone is dealing with something. However, most people are handling their circumstances without resorting to destructive behavior. There are reasons for everything but when you are in your 40's like I am, your life is what you have made it. Jason made bad choices freely (free will)and thus it is his personal responsibility. If you do not believe in personal responsibility then everyone is just a victim or benefactor of their circumstances. I choose to believe I have some control of my life.

Though I will admit that mental health issues make my assertions questionable. No one chooses to fail in life so perhaps circumstances lead to mental illness which leads to bad life choices.

 

[VanillaCoke]

Why is everyone assuming this guy was addicted to drugs? Not everyone that does cocaine/fentanyl is addicted to it lmao

Both options are equally likely based on the information presently available.

Neither of which matter at all.

If you're willing to bet your life on your plugs supply being clean, thats a you decision.

The whole point is making that message very clear to everyone, that is what you're risking, every time.
Choose wisely.

 

[bandwagonesque]

Why is fentynol put into certain drugs anyway? Is it because it’s used as filler, so saves the drug dealers’ money, or is it addictive too, so better hooks the user?

Fentanyl is added to opiates because it's also an opiate and is cheap to manufacture and easy to smuggle due to being incredibly potent relative to other opiates. There's no actual evidence it's deliberately added to drugs with different modes of action, such as cocaine. It's more likely the contamination takes place accidentally in the distribution process.

 

[iceburg]

What should also be taken into account is that we're all wired differently. As someone who has never done and never will take drugs it would be easy for me to take the high ground, but the truth is I'm just wired that way. As a happy introvert I find the idea of mind altering substances, alcohol included, a huge turnoff. Then you get to the price point where I'm frugal to begin with and these habits can be very expensive, and the thought of doing drugs becomes downright appalling. But on the other hand, author Brandon Sanderson has a new Stormlight Archive book coming out in November, and maybe one of these days GRRM will finish Winds of Winter, and I'll dive into those 1200 pages tomes like the absolute worst junky and finish them in 2-3 days.

So drugs, along with many other things, are basically a carrot and stick thing. The stick is about your life circumstances, and the carrot is about appealing it is based on how you're wired. While it's a 'personal choice' to eat the carrot in the end (unless you're force fed it via Dr. prescribed pain medications) I don't think you should judge people when we all have widely different circumstances and tastes.

People are definitely wired differently. That wiring comes from genetics, epigenetics and experience. Bottom line is that our “choices” are a product of different influences...and,yes, as a result don’t judge.

 

[RussianRacket]

Not up to us to judge his actions or decisions even within the realm of "he is a parent he should have known better". Absolutely worthless posts and I am ashamed of all of you.

Keep your judgments to yourself.

 

[VanillaCoke]

Fentanyl is added to opiates because it's also an opiate and is cheap to manufacture and easy to smuggle due to being incredibly potent relative to other opiates. There's no actual evidence it's deliberately added to drugs with different modes of action, such as cocaine. It's more likely the contamination takes place accidentally in the distribution process.

Don't listen to this rubbish because it is baseless, misleading and incredibly incorrect.

And not the first time.

 

[bandwagonesque]

Don't listen to this rubbish because it is baseless, misleading and incredibly incorrect.

And not the first time.

What rubbish are you talking about, exactly?

 

[Diamonddog01]

Don't listen to this rubbish because it is baseless, misleading and incredibly incorrect.

And not the first time.

Uh what? As someone who peripherally works in the field it’s accurate.

 

[Diamonddog01]

delete

 

[bandwagonesque]

Don't listen to this rubbish because it is baseless, misleading and incredibly incorrect.

And not the first time.

From a Vox article listing various possible explanations for tainted drugs --

"Explanation 2: dealers are purposely mixing cocaine with fentanyl

Another possible explanation is that the mixing is happening not at the user level but at the dealer or trafficker level. With or without the buyer’s knowledge, drug sellers or someone up the chain may be mixing cocaine and fentanyl before the product hits the street.
There is some data to support this. New York City Police Department laboratory testing, for one, found that about 1 percent of cocaine that it analyzed tested positive for fentanyl from January to March 2017. Christopher Moraff, a freelance journalist and co-host of the soon-to be-released podcast Narcotica, has found in his own testing of street drugs a few samples of cocaine that were contaminated with fentanyl, but he noted that this is still rare. And Julia Lurie at Mother Jones and Scott Pham and Dan Vergano at BuzzFeed reported stories of some people who meant to use cocaine and ended up inadvertently ingesting fentanyl too, causing an overdose.
Sarah Wakeman, the medical director at the Massachusetts General Hospital Substance Use Disorder Initiative, told me this is something she’s witnessed in her own practice: “I have seen patients who use cocaine who have had positive fentanyl toxicology, and I have also seen people who thought they were using heroin/fentanyl who tested positive for cocaine.”
There are two reasons typically given for why drug dealers would do this: One, it’s a relatively cheap way to give a product a bit more kick. Two, it could be an attempt to get cocaine buyers hooked on opioids.
Experts, however, are very skeptical that deliberate mixing is widespread.
For one, people who are buying cocaine want cocaine, and they’re going to be unhappy if a totally different drug ends up in what they buy. Cocaine is an upper, and fentanyl, like other opioids, is a downer — so cocaine and fentanyl have generally opposite effects, which can be unpleasant to someone who wants a pure upper or downer experience.
“When you go into a Starbucks, you expect a certain quality of coffee. And if it comes out different that day, you’re like, ‘WTF?’” Ciccarone said. People who use drugs, he added, have similar expectations.
Besides, at this point, drug dealers have to be aware of the deadliness of fentanyl — given that it’s been all over the news for years. In that light, they would have to know that adding fentanyl to their cocaine could seriously risk killing their customers — an outcome that’s, if nothing else, bad for business.
And, experts noted, why would a seller who already has a customer buying cocaine feel the need to additionally get that customer addicted to and using fentanyl?
“You’re already making money off this person,” Humphreys said. “Why would you want to kill them or piss them off?”
Still, it’s not completely unprecedented for this kind of thing to happen. Kathleen Frydl, a historian and author of The Drug Wars in America, 1940-1973, told me this is something that happened during the Vietnam War: US military soldiers in South Vietnam were tricked into trying heroin with the claim that it was cocaine, and that led some of them to a heroin addiction. Maybe something similar is going on here.
But so far, the evidence suggests that this is very rare — given that cocaine samples are still, based on NYPD data and Moraff’s reports, by and large coming back negative for fentanyl. So, as Ciccarone told me, this explanation is still “highly speculative.”

 

[VanillaCoke]

Okay cool whatever you say. But its wrong. "Experts" in office buildings know best.



Its not an accident.

 

[m9]

I think that report was probably true for that area 3-1/2 years ago, but things change.

 

[bandwagonesque]

I think that report was probably true for that area 3-1/2 years ago, but things change.

What parts of the rationale they offer for their being little incentive to do it are no longer true?