Speculation: Bolland on trading block (with link)

[hockeydoug]

Whether he bounces back or not, he'll leave as a UFA after the season, and we'll get no assets for him.

If the cap isn't an issue, you gamble on him for the sake of winning again. Consider him a rental. I don't think Bolland or Seabrook will struggle as much as they did this year.

If that cap is in the way of another transaction, move Bolland, even if his value isn't great. The value is in the cap space at this point.

 

[hockeydoug]

If they do keep Bolland, I hope he's a little better than that horrific 2 months he had to start 2011. He's not going to help put pts in the standings for 3.375 (he hasn't for 4 years now), but he will probably be a better postseason option than one of the rookies.

3 days of negotiations with Bickell haven't wrapped anything up yet. Doesn't look like any scenario is ruled out yet.

 

[topnotch]

I Acknowledged the injuries, where in 2 of those "3 of 5 years", he was coming off back surgery and the other a concussion. Again, I don't foresee a back surgery in Bolland's near future and to the best of our knowledge, he hasn't suffered a concussion since 2011 - and a concussion can happen to any player, at any time. It's the most random injury in the NHL. Point being, I don't see him missing 20-30 games next year. Could he get injured? Yes, but no one should rationally be expecting him to miss that much time.

When he was given his extension, it was paying for some potential as him as the 2nd line centre. Instead of becoming that, he became an outstanding third line centre that still produced at a ~0.5PpG pace. Just because he didn't become what he was expected to be when that contract was given, doesn't mean he's not worth what he got. He is.

The Bolland of "3-4 years ago"? Bolland was outstanding just 2 years ago. He was scoring at a career-high pace, and then beasted Vancouver in the playoffs. 2011-12 wasn't a bad year for him, but it was for his linemates and it was for the entire team in the playoffs.. and this year he struggled in a new role. Again, I don't get how people aren't expecting Bolland to bounce back. Just doesn't make sense to me.

The fact that Bolland has been injured in 3 of the last 5 years makes it more likely he will miss time in the future, not less likely. Back injuries and concussions tend to be chronic problems that probably won't get better by playing a professional contact sport.

I agree with Raptor - if there were assurances that Bolland would revert to old form I would certainly keep him over Frolik. But there are no assurances. Not being a core player means that Bolland leaves after the 2013-14 season unless he would take a BIG paycut. Frolik, a player who have drastically improved his defensive game, is still and RFA after next season and can still be moved for assets when the Hawks need more cap room.

Also the million difference in Bolland and Frolik could be very helpful next season.

 

[Bubba88]

Bobby, you still think Stalberg will be back or hope for it? He is gone. Some like it (BWC, Ike and me) and some don't (like you). If you like it or not, he will hit the market

 

[HockeySauce]

You don't pay or keep a guy based on what he did 3 or 4 years ago. You keep him based on what he can do in the future. I don't see Bolland being any different next year than he was this year. Problem is the Hawks are thin at C and if Stan doesn't have another plan can use him. If he he has a plan then fine. Maybe the Hawks have proven they can win with this team and only one good center. They did this year. Can Pirri be any worse than Bolland was this year?

You can't see Bolland being better than his worst NHL season? Really? How has no one learned their lesson from Kane, Bickell and Crawford?

Pirri can be a lot worse than Bolland, especially if he doesn't produce. Pirri is average defensively on a great day, below-average otherwise. That's bad for a winger, really bad for a centre.

 

[HockeySauce]

The fact that Bolland has been injured in 3 of the last 5 years makes it more likely he will miss time in the future, not less likely. Back injuries and concussions tend to be chronic problems that probably won't get better by playing a professional contact sport.

I agree with Raptor - if there were assurances that Bolland would revert to old form I would certainly keep him over Frolik. But there are no assurances. Not being a core player means that Bolland leaves after the 2013-14 season unless he would take a BIG paycut. Frolik, a player who have drastically improved his defensive game, is still and RFA after next season and can still be moved for assets when the Hawks need more cap room.

Also the million difference in Bolland and Frolik could be very helpful next season.

I never said he's less or more likely to be injured. Fact is, the majority of games he's missed in that time frame was from back surgery and a concussion. Again, I don't foresee any back surgeries in Bolland's near future, and while he could suffer a concussion in game 1 next year, you can't be expecting him to suffer one - especially when, as far as we know, he hasn't suffered one since his concussion in 2011.

Could Bolland's back get worse as he goes along? Sure, but Chicago's only concerned next year and if there's no surgeries scheduled for him, I don't see the problem.

There are as many assurances that Frolik plays as well next year, or that Bickell plays as well next year. That's why experience matters. That's why you take into account a players track record in the NHL. Bolland will be in a contract year next season, if he wants to get another decent contract after next season, you can bet you're house he'll be better than he was this year. not to mention - again - this was his worst season in the NHL. He'll bounce back.

 

[SLarmer28*]

Drew Leblanc

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/prospects/drew_leblanc/

LeBlanc is a 6’0”, 195-pound playmaking center that plays an intelligent two-way game. LeBlanc’s decision-making is excellent. He makes few mistakes and thinks the game remarkably well. He also has the ability to make those around him better. LeBlanc is an excellent skater that moves exceedingly well with the puck. LeBlanc, who is one of St. Cloud State’s co-captains, also possesses strong leadership qualities.

Two-way hockey player
Excellent decision making
Leadership

The antithesis of Kyle Beach.

 

[HawkeyFanatic]

At this point it's clear that bolland should be traded.

I have a dream of getting a young C like burmistrov in return

Either way I think he should be traded for a prospect and a cheap C brought it for that #2 line. The emergence of shaw and Kruger makes it less of a blow loosing bolland

But the bolland money is needed for bickell and you know that bolland is injury prone and his game in on the decline

 

[hockeydoug]

You can't see Bolland being better than his worst NHL season? Really? How has no one learned their lesson from Kane, Bickell and Crawford?

Pirri can be a lot worse than Bolland, especially if he doesn't produce. Pirri is average defensively on a great day, below-average otherwise. That's bad for a winger, really bad for a centre.

Kane, Bickell, and Crawford are healthy players by comparison.
I like Bolland over Pirri, I'm not a fan of relying on a rookie defensively, but health risks and the cap difference has to be considered.

That's why experience matters.

I agree, and experience shows us he's going to go on extended stretches on or near IR, extended stretches of playing poor hockey, some stretches of excellent hockey, and diminishing likelihood of him being healthy for the playoff run. He's going to be a role player eating 3.375 of the cap while everyone will be hoping he is healthy for a postseason run. I don't think many have confidence that he'll be a big help throughout the regular season and I doubt many will be surprised if he has a better year.

His ceiling is known, his floor is lower than we hoped and not established yet. He's a gamble to keep on the roster as a role player at his point, we'll get a better idea of the risk he carries as the roster rounds out, if he's kept. Everyone appreciates what he did, but that doesn't change what he is now.

 

[Easton Modano Curve]

Drew Leblanc

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/prospects/drew_leblanc/



Two-way hockey player
Excellent decision making
Leadership

The antithesis of Kyle Beach.

I preface my comment by saying I've never seen Drew Leblanc play live and have only watched clips online. Still, I think it's hard to judge overage NCAA players. This kid is the same age as Patrick Kane and 3 years older than Brandon Saad.

Matt Gilroy also had a lot of hype as a Hobey Baker free agent a couple of years ago. He was rated a 7.0B (Leblanc 7.0C) and here was his scouting report:

"A defensively responsible blueliner, Gilroy has excellent hockey sense, a strong determination, and good vision. A very good puck mover, Gilroy is a character player, with captain potential."

Gilroy is now a fringe NHLer and may end up being a career AHL player. I'm not saying Leblanc will be bad, I just think its a good idea to measure our expectations. What excites me about the Hawks prospect pool is that multiple prospects are vying for each position. Hopefully one will hit at center!

 

[HockeySauce]

Kane, Bickell, and Crawford are healthy players by comparison.
I like Bolland over Pirri, I'm not a fan of relying on a rookie defensively, but health risks and the cap difference has to be considered.



I agree, and experience shows us he's going to go on extended stretches on or near IR, extended stretches of playing poor hockey, some stretches of excellent hockey, and diminishing likelihood of him being healthy for the playoff run. He's going to be a role player eating 3.375 of the cap while everyone will be hoping he is healthy for a postseason run. I don't think many have confidence that he'll be a big help throughout the regular season and I doubt many will be surprised if he has a better year.

His ceiling is known, his floor is lower than we hoped and not established yet. He's a gamble to keep on the roster as a role player at his point, we'll get a better idea of the risk he carries as the roster rounds out, if he's kept. Everyone appreciates what he did, but that doesn't change what he is now.

Bickell has a grade 2 knee sprain.

No, it doesn't. Do you expect Bolland to have back surgery next year? Do to expect him to suffer a concussion? I'm not saying I guarantee he'll be 100% healthy next year - most players aren't - but I can't see a rational argument in which you expect Bolland to miss 15-30 games next year.. which, for some reason, seems to be the general tag following Bolland and it makes no sense.

Bolland's always been a role player in Chicago. An average Bolland is one of the best role players in the NHL. He'll score his share of goals/points, play on the PK and PP, play great defense and most of the tough assignments. That's worth 3.3M.

The bolded is what's wrong with this board, and proves lessons will never be learned. Crow will be eaten next year, whether Bolland's with Chicago or another team. He'll be much better next year than this year.

Bolland is a hell of a lot better than a 4th line centre, and anyone that expects him to be on the 4th line if he's here next year is out of their mind.

 

[SLarmer28*]

I preface my comment by saying I've never seen Drew Leblanc play live and have only watched clips online. Still, I think it's hard to judge overage NCAA players. This kid is the same age as Patrick Kane and 3 years older than Brandon Saad.

Matt Gilroy also had a lot of hype as a Hobey Baker free agent a couple of years ago. He was rated a 7.0B (Leblanc 7.0C) and here was his scouting report:

"A defensively responsible blueliner, Gilroy has excellent hockey sense, a strong determination, and good vision. A very good puck mover, Gilroy is a character player, with captain potential."

Gilroy is now a fringe NHLer and may end up being a career AHL player. I'm not saying Leblanc will be bad, I just think its a good idea to measure our expectations. What excites me about the Hawks prospect pool is that multiple prospects are vying for each position. Hopefully one will hit at center!

You ever consider why the Chicago Blackhawks organization put Dave Bolland on the trading block this week? Do you think the Chicago Blackhawks organization would be so dumb to trade Dave Bolland if contingency plans were not in place?

 

[HockeySauce]

You ever consider why the Chicago Blackhawks organization put Dave Bolland on the trading block this week? Do you think the Chicago Blackhawks organization would be so dumb to trade Dave Bolland if contingency plans were not in place?

Obviously Chicago has a plan. That plan doesn't have to be Drew LeBlanc. Your comment isn't really relevant to the posters comment. He's saying just because LeBlanc looks good in college, and won the Hobey Baker as an overage college player, doesn't mean he'll pan out. Obviously, the posters right. Personally though, I like LeBlanc and he looked good in his NHL games this year.

 

[SLarmer28*]

Obviously Chicago has a plan. That plan doesn't have to be Drew LeBlanc. Your comment isn't really relevant to the posters comment. He's saying just because LeBlanc looks good in college, and won the Hobey Baker as an overage college player, doesn't mean he'll pan out. Obviously, the posters right. Personally though, I like LeBlanc and he looked good in his NHL games this year.

He's also comparing a defenseman to a centerman, apples and oranges.

 

[HockeySauce]

He's also comparing a defenseman to a centerman, apples and oranges.

The hardest NHL skater position vs. the 2nd hardest skater position. Not that it really matters. His point was that despite the hype, recently hyped college free-agents haven't really panned out.

 

[Easton Modano Curve]

You ever consider why the Chicago Blackhawks organization put Dave Bolland on the trading block this week? Do you think the Chicago Blackhawks organization would be so dumb to trade Dave Bolland if contingency plans were not in place?

I think Bolland is on the trading block because of the cap crunch and Bolland's big cap hit. If Bolland had the cap hit of Pirri or Leblanc I think they would keep him.

And Chicago does have a contingency plan.
1) As I mentioned in my previous post, "multiple prospects are vying for each position."
2) Wouldn't shock me either if Stan signed someone else who could play center from FA pool.
3) Emergency center could also be Sharp.

Hope this answered your questions.

 

[SLarmer28*]

The hardest NHL skater position vs. the 2nd hardest skater position. Not that it really matters. His point was that despite the hype, recently hyped college free-agents haven't really panned out.

Meanwhile, Leblanc just maybe the long term solution for the Chicago Blackhawks second line center woes. I keep a positive attitude about a prospect who provides leadership, skill, and productivity.

 

[HockeySauce]

Meanwhile, Leblanc just maybe the long term solution for the Chicago Blackhawks second line center woes. I keep a positive attitude about a prospect who provides leadership, skill, and productivity.

I already said that I like LeBlanc. That doesn't mean the poster was wrong. In fact, he wasn't even negative - nor was I - about LeBlanc's upside.

 

[SLarmer28*]

I think Bolland is on the trading block because of the cap crunch and Bolland's big cap hit. If Bolland had the cap hit of Pirri or Leblanc I think they would keep him.

And Chicago does have a contingency plan.
1) As I mentioned in my previous post, "multiple prospects are vying for each position."
2) Wouldn't shock me either if Stan signed someone else who could play center from FA pool.
3) Emergency center could also be Sharp.

Hope this answered your questions.

The Chicago Blackhawks could have put Michael Frolik on the trading block instead. It's hard to justify paying a fourth line winger $2.333 million (salary cap hit) during a salary cap squeeze.

 

[HockeySauce]

We don't know that Chicago's not shopping Frolik. Most of Chicago's deals come out of no where anyways. No one will be (or should be) shocked if Frolik's moved.

 

[SLarmer28*]

I already said that I like LeBlanc. That doesn't mean the poster was wrong. In fact, he wasn't even negative - nor was I - about LeBlanc's upside.

At the end of the day, I don't agree with Stan Bowman's decision to trade Dave Bolland considering the prospect pool. It's easier to replace a winger or wingers than a centerman or centermen. One could argue that Ben Smith and Jeremy Morin are further developed than Brandon Pirri (questionable two-way game) and Drew Leblanc (lack of AHL experience).

The Michael Frolik penalty killer hysteria is quite laughable. Michael Frolik is just a cog in a penalty killing scheme. Michael Frolik's contract sucks based upon his goal scoring production as a Chicago Blackhawk during the regular season.

It's not my decision which Chicago Blackhawks skater stays or goes.

 

[Easton Modano Curve]

Not here to bash Leblanc. Never even seen the kid play! I was just trying to say we should temper our expectations if the prospects get a shot. I remembered Kruger looking lost his rookie year and getting ripped by the fans.

In an ideal world the center prospects could develop on one of the lower lines and get moved up when they've adjusted. They are going to be under the microscope pivoting for Hossa, Sharp, and Kane. We saw that this year with Bolland!

 

[Easton Modano Curve]

He's also comparing a defenseman to a centerman, apples and oranges.

OK better comparison then.

Andy Miele
-2010–11 Hobey Baker winner
-Undrafted free agent
-Played center in college (not sure where they're using him now)
-8 NHL games with 0 points (impressive AHL numbers in 139 games)

 

[SLarmer28*]

Not here to bash Leblanc. Never even seen the kid play! I was just trying to say we should temper our expectations if the prospects get a shot. I remembered Kruger looking lost his rookie year and getting ripped by the fans.

In an ideal world the center prospects could develop on one of the lower lines and get moved up when they've adjusted. They are going to be under the microscope pivoting for Hossa, Sharp, and Kane. We saw that this year with Bolland!

Unless the contingency plan is to sign Michal Handzus on the cheap for one year ($1 million or less) and hopefully squeeze another year out of him, while the Chicago Blackhawks organization decides to promote a centerman (Pirri or Leblanc) from Rockford at the trade deadline.

 

[hockeydoug]

No, it doesn't. Do you expect Bolland to have back surgery next year? Do to expect him to suffer a concussion? I'm not saying I guarantee he'll be 100% healthy next year - most players aren't - but I can't see a rational argument in which you expect Bolland to miss 15-30 games next year.. which, for some reason, seems to be the general tag following Bolland and it makes no sense.

I don't expect any one single injury. He's missed a game or more 10 times in the last 3 seasons (between 24 and 26 years of age) for a number of different reasons. He struggled to get back to full speed or effectiveness for extended periods after a number of those injuries as well. He had a brutal 5 or 6 week stretch last year after his foot injury, not sure to call that a terrible streak or attribute to injury.
He's played a full year once as a pro and now he's 27.

Injury prone players like Bolland tend to get injured, it's what they do. It doesn't matter if it's a groin, back, leg, foot, whatever, he's one of those guys that seems to get taken off of the ice. Similar to a player like Willie Mitchell when he was younger, I think he's a guy that takes more injuries than most and comes back too soon on occassion too, and that doesn't help things. If he's healthy for a full year, it's the exception, not the rule.

The bolded is what's wrong with this board, and proves lessons will never be learned. Crow will be eaten next year, whether Bolland's with Chicago or another team. He'll be much better next year than this year.

I'm not sure what lessons you're referring to. Bolland has a large and relatively consisent sample size of excellent streaks in all zones, bad streaks in all zones, and injuries. I've stated before that Bolland will likely bounce back to an extent, but he'll likely still be the same guy as he has been with lots of bad with slumps and a very nice upside. I have some nice crow recipes, but I don't think my expectations for Dave are any more sensational or different than they were last year..and the year before.

Bolland is a hell of a lot better than a 4th line centre, and anyone that expects him to be on the 4th line if he's here next year is out of their mind.

I don't expect him to be on the 4th line anywhere next year whether it's in Chicago or another city, the concern is that he can be on the ice and effective in relation to his cap hit.

Bickell has a grade 2 knee sprain.

Yes, and he had a wrist injury 2 years ago. He has missed very few games because of injury as a pro, that was my point about the comparison. The concerns about a contract or cap hit for each player are different.