Speculation: Blackhawks Shakeup

[Kaners Bald Spot]

I haven't seen the ad nauseum discussion but considering Kane's age and contract, Hawks should take any serious off they can get. They aren't going to be able to turn it around fast enough to contend before Kane goes into decline.

You have to remember where the Hawks were under Dollar Bill. If Rocky sells off stars the moment adversity hits it would be huge gut punch to the fanbase and would bring back memories of his father. Even though you may be right, Bill Wirtz still haunts the Hawks from the grave. Under zero circumstances can Toews and Kane be moved unless they make a request. It would tank the franchise value because they'd lose the trust of the fans. I think the fans could understand Keith, Seabrook and Crawford being moved. I don't think they could understand Toews or Kane being moved. They're finishing their contracts in Chicago unless they want out.

 

[HawkeyTalkMan]

Then Connor Murphy for a 2nd? What's his value pick-wise, you'd say? I'm not a Leafs fan, I'm just looking for a match.

I would say it's probably a 2nd+ because he's on a good contract with term left so a lone 2nd is probably not enough. 2nd and 2nd is probably close

Plus he's still young and a RHD who can play both sides

That combination just doesnt come cheap on the trade market

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

You have to remember where the Hawks were under Dollar Bill. If Rocky sells off stars the moment adversity hits it would be huge gut punch to the fanbase and would bring back memories of his father. Even though you may be right, Bill Wirtz still haunts the Hawks from the grave. Under zero circumstances can Toews and Kane be moved unless they make a request. It would tank the franchise value because they'd lose the trust of the fans. I think the fans could understand Keith, Seabrook and Crawford being moved. I don't think they could understand Toews or Kane being moved. They're finishing their contracts in Chicago unless they want out.

I see your point but, those contracts will handcuff the Hawks rebuild. How will the fanbase like staying in the basement an extra 3-5 years?

Kane would get something worthwhile as is. Not huge but good. Toews would bring a nice return with some heavy retention. Free up about 15 mil cap and get a couple of good pieces back plus a high pick this year could jump start the rebuild.

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

I see your point but, those contracts will handcuff the Hawks rebuild. How will the fanbase like staying in the basement an extra 3-5 years?

Kane would get something worthwhile as is. Not huge but good. Toews would bring a nice return with some heavy retention. Free up about 15 mil cap and get a couple of good pieces back plus a high pick this year could jump start the rebuild.

If you've been paying attention, the Hawks would only have to retain about $2M on Toews as he is absolutely worth 8.5M this year.

 

[wintersej]

1) Move Saad and Keith for ELCs and picks.
2) Sign Panarin or make a splash like that with the Saad/Keith cash.
3) Pray the prospects come thru before the vets decline

Starting the full rebuild is dumb.

 

[wintersej]

Bruins offer Grzelcyk+ or Bjork+ for Saad.

The Grzelcyk offer is the smart one to take, even with Chicago having some good prospects on D.

 

[Esq]

1) Move Saad and Keith for ELCs and picks.
2) Sign Panarin or make a splash like that with the Saad/Keith cash.
3) Pray the prospects come thru before the vets decline

Starting the full rebuild is dumb.

It's really not that dumb. It's rather essential.

 

[blankall]

Not really sure I see the point of keeping Toews and Kane while trading their supporting cast for futures. The kinds of assets you're asking for won't be ready for 3-4 years, and by then both will be on the decline. Are they going to want to stay in Chicago if it means being part of a rebuild?

It sounds more like your rebuild should be an all or nothing thing.

If the organization is confident they can get Panarin back, that's another matter. But if that's the case, it would make more sense to hang onto the current assets. You'd hope that Panarin can revitalize the offence and make you competitors again. It's not out of the question. Panarin seems capable of driving an offence himself.

The "Retool" really just seems like a one foot in/one foot out plan. You either have to keep Kane/Toews and go for it for the next 3-5 years or trade both and go full rebuild.

 

[De Montreal]

I would say it's probably a 2nd+ because he's on a good contract with term left so a lone 2nd is probably not enough. 2nd and 2nd is probably close

Plus he's still young and a RHD who can play both sides

That combination just doesnt come cheap on the trade market

Sure, and also there's a good demand for RHD. I think Leafs pass though, or maybe both team meet halway.

 

[De Montreal]

I would say it's probably a 2nd+ because he's on a good contract with term left so a lone 2nd is probably not enough. 2nd and 2nd is probably close

Plus he's still young and a RHD who can play both sides

That combination just doesnt come cheap on the trade market

Sure, and also there's a good demand for RHD. I think Leafs pass though, or maybe both team meet halway.

 

[dk2k]

Oilers will take DeBrincat, Strome, Crawford, Seabrook for Cagguila, Rattie, Talbot, Lucic, Benning, pick

I bet they would!

 

[wintersej]

It's really not that dumb. It's rather essential.

How long is it going to take you to get guys as good as Toews and Kane again?

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

If you've been paying attention, the Hawks would only have to retain about $2M on Toews as he is absolutely worth 8.5M this year.

He's having a good year so far but 27 pts in 33 games is a 67 pt pace. 67 pts doesn't get 8.5 mil, at least not if you don't win the cup. I think they need to retain more like 4 mil - but that's just opinion. He'll be 31 when this season ends and has 4 years left. He isn't likely going to continue to play as well as this year for 4 more.

 

[Esq]

How long is it going to take you to get guys as good as Toews and Kane again?

Do you mean Toews and Kane at age 23? Because if you have a time machine I'd love to use it. Throw Keith and Seabrook in there as well.

Bottom line is that the core of this team is on the wrong side of 30. Retooling is not the answer. It is going to be a long rebuild, but that's what you get by pushing the cap to the limit to win.

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

He's having a good year so far but 27 pts in 33 games is a 67 pt pace. 67 pts doesn't get 8.5 mil, at least not if you don't win the cup. I think they need to retain more like 4 mil - but that's just opinion. He'll be 31 when this season ends and has 4 years left. He isn't likely going to continue to play as well as this year for 4 more.

I put value on his faceoffs and defensive play, so that is where we disagree. Offensive production is not the end all be all to forward value.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I put value on his faceoffs and defensive play, so that is where we disagree. Offensive production is not the end all be all to forward value.

No argument from me but it is scoring that determines pay in the NHL - even for Dmen, much less C's.

 

[Voodoo Glow Skulls]

Saad
Krys

For

Johansson
Zacha
Noesen

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

Saad
Krys

For

Johansson
Zacha
Noesen

Nope try again.

 

[bernmeister]

Connor Murphy is a RD.
Would be willing to move Mitchell for a similar potential LHD.

sorry don't know who Mitchell is, and don't see him on capfriendly.
Is that nickname for Murphy?

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

sorry don't know who Mitchell is, and don't see him on capfriendly.
Is that nickname for Murphy?

Ian Mitchell is a sophomore at U of Denver and a 2nd rounder from 2017. Not signed yet. RHD, and probably has top pairing potential.
Ian Mitchell at eliteprospects.com

 

[bernmeister]

Ian Mitchell is a sophomore at U of Denver and a 2nd rounder from 2017. Not signed yet. RHD, and probably has top pairing potential.
Ian Mitchell at eliteprospects.com

thanks this was helpful
just eyeballing capfriendly, Lindgren a former 2nd rounder, seems to be closest match on paper.
Have a rough idea on him as prospect but no awareness of which is better prospect right now, or has better ceiling, or pros and cons.

Anyone care to enlighten/compare?
thanks in advance.

 

[Mrfenn92]

I haven't seen the ad nauseum discussion but considering Kane's age and contract, Hawks should take any
serious off they can get. They
aren't going to be able to turn it
around fast enough to contend
before Kane goes into
decline.

Kane is one player that will age very well.

 

[Ori]

I believe they need more of a shakeup - part of the old core don`t look interested recently.

 

[TML1967]

The problem is around here everyone equates 30 to the age where you're no longer good at hockey and will only be a waste of money for any team wanting to sign you.

I think the issue to a guy signed long term after 30, is almost every guy deteriorates year over year.
So your trading for an asset that has already peaked.

The gamble is if its gonna be a Thorton/ Marleau type decline where at 38 they are still NHLers, Jagr type who at almost 40 was still dominant, a Lecavier type who just allnofnthensudden sucks, or somewhere around the average where they just get a bit worse every year.

Imo, Kane will be fine going forward it's the cap hit that will scare teams off. I dunno if a 35 year old P Kane will be worth 10.5, same as a Leafs fan the last year or two of Tavares might be a cap suck

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Kane is one player that will age very well.

He's avoided injury pretty well. I think that helps as players age. We'll see how he does.

 

[Hawksfan8709]

Hawks need something they are to slow we need defence. I say chace petroanglo n go from there