Best LW in the league?

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

One way is always being a league leader in giveaways while having a giveaway/takeaway ratio of about 2:1 year after year.

Drew Doughty has 73 giveaways and only 10 takeaways, I suppose that makes him a defensive liability?

Giveaways just mean you have the puck a lot and make a lot of passes.

Gaudreau has the puck a lot and makes a lot of passes.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

What happens to Gaudreaus offense in the playoffs? How many hart votes does his "significantly" more offense get him?

Hard to get Hart votes when you are playing on a crap team.

I guess Hall > McDavid last year?

 

[KoozNetsOff 92]

Hard to get Hart votes when you are playing on a crap team.

I guess Hall > McDavid last year?

If Hall came ahead of McDavid every season (like OV does vs Gaudreau) then sure. But it was a 1x thing. Nice try though. Btw you still haven't answered, what happens to Gaudreaus offense in the playoffs?

 

[koyvoo]

If you were to poll GMs and coaches around the league as to who they would prefer for a playoff run starting tomorrow, Ovechkin would be winning that poll by even more than he’s winning this one.

 

[Rants Mulliniks]

Drew Doughty has 73 giveaways and only 10 takeaways, I suppose that makes him a defensive liability?

Giveaways just mean you have the puck a lot and make a lot of passes.

Gaudreau has the puck a lot and makes a lot of passes.

That's a quaint way to look at it. Problem is a lot of other people who "have the puck a lot and make a lot of passes" are NOT at the bottom of the league every year in giveaways and in fact have giveaway/takeaway ratios the exact opposite of Gaudreau (Mitch Marner being one). If it was a one off, you might "poo poo" it but it is every single year with Gaudreau. As for d-men, they historically have a lot of giveaways and less takeaways. Interestingly, over the past 3 or 4 years (forget which) there is only one forward in the league amongst the worst 15 players in giveaways. Care to hazard a guess who it is?

 

[Bounces R Way]

lmfao

"B-B-BUT THE GIVEAWAYS!" Amazing to me the ignorance some hockey fans display about their own sport of choice. You have the puck more than anybody else on your team, chances are very high you're going to have the most giveaways. That's really just basic logic if A then B stuff.

Gaudreau is a playmaker, one of the best in the league at it, he tries high risk passes through traffic, he's constantly double or even triple teamed in the offensive zone, and quite often he succeeds in getting to it to his linemates anyways(as evidenced by his 71! points on the year). He's a player that's not satisfied with dumping it into a corner or an unscreened wrister from the top of the circles. The only thing that giveaway stat shows is how hard Gaudreau has been carrying the Flames offence not only this year, but the 4 before this too. If he's on the ice he is almost exclusively the one carrying it through the neutral zone and across the opposing blue line because he is by far the best on the team at it. Despite the "weak defensively" misnomer people attach to him he's still top 30 in takeaways this year. So if you insist on attaching meaning without context to a largely pointless subjective stat then at least try for a second to pretend you're doing so without some bias.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

In my opinion, Ovechkin still has the crown until somebody else takes it. Last year’s playoffs and this year’s goal scoring are ridiculous.

Having said that, I think Panarin, Hall, and Gaudreau all have a chance at taking that crown soon. And I think Panarin will be the guy to do that if he joins a better team.

 

[CraigsList]

Ovechkin
Gaudreau
Marchand
Hall
Panarin

The 4 behind Ovechkin are interchangeable depending on the season.

 

[txpd]

Ovechkin. period

 

[txpd]

Ovechkin. period

That's a quaint way to look at it.

Its just a fact. The way they define a giveaway. Puck moving defensemen always have a high ratio of giveways because they have the puck so much. Same is true of puck carrying forwards. I am not here to support Gaudreau. I could care less about him one way or the other. But the point made about the giveaway stat is true

 

[Tobias Kahun]

Left Wing seems unique in that the dominant player from year to year seems to vary quite frequently - it probably has more legitimate contenders to the crown than any other position.

Over the last 5 years there's been 6 guys who really separated themselves from the pack: Benn, Ovechkin, Hall, Marchand, Gaudreau, and Panarin. It seems as if Benn is beginning to decline, but there are a few new contenders that could compete for the title, like Tkachuk, Huberdeau, Landeskog, and Forsberg.

Who's the best LW in the game today?

Current top scorers:

Gaudreau 71p
Draisaitl 56p
Tkachuk 55p
Giroux 52p
Ovechkin 52p
Panarin 52p
Landeskog 52p
Marchand 51p
Huberdeau 47p
Skinner 44p

Draisaitl plays RW when hes with McDavid.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

Who won the rocket last year? And 3 years ago
And 4 years ago ?
And 5 years ago
6 years ago

Gretzky won a bunch of art rosses years ago too.

Doesn't matter what someone did in the past when asking a question about the current player.

 

[mphmiles]

People that still think Gaudreau is a defensive liability don't actually watch him play. They just look at his size and assume that he must be.

He's a 55% flat corsi player the last 2 seasons and +3% rel for his career. With his quickness, active stick, and edgework, he's actually quite disruptive on defense- and his ability to drive play is a defensive skill as well, as valuable as it is offensively. (The "defensive" goal for any team is to stop pucks from going in the net, not just get the puck back when you don't have it. If you're controlling the puck most of the time, the other team is obviously going to have a harder time scoring)

I have no issue with anyone saying Ovi is still better, but lets use arguments that actually have some merit to do so.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

If Hall came ahead of McDavid every season (like OV does vs Gaudreau) then sure. But it was a 1x thing. Nice try though. Btw you still haven't answered, what happens to Gaudreaus offense in the playoffs?

He scores big goals in big moments in the playoffs, or did you miss this?

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

That's a quaint way to look at it. Problem is a lot of other people who "have the puck a lot and make a lot of passes" are NOT at the bottom of the league every year in giveaways and in fact have giveaway/takeaway ratios the exact opposite of Gaudreau (Mitch Marner being one). If it was a one off, you might "poo poo" it but it is every single year with Gaudreau. As for d-men, they historically have a lot of giveaways and less takeaways. Interestingly, over the past 3 or 4 years (forget which) there is only one forward in the league amongst the worst 15 players in giveaways. Care to hazard a guess who it is?

Did you know that during last year's world championship only 1 forward cracked the top 10 in passes completed?

It was Gaudreau. He was first by a large margin, followed by 9 defenseman.

Gaudreau makes a lot more passes than pretty much any other forward, and carries the puck a lot more as well (way way more than Marner). He also is aggressive with the puck on his stick - attacking defenses instead of settling for perimeter shots. Marner has an average shot length of 31 feet, Gaudreau's is 24. Because he goes to higher traffic areas to get better scoring chances.

 

[Rants Mulliniks]

lmfao

"B-B-BUT THE GIVEAWAYS!" Amazing to me the ignorance some hockey fans display about their own sport of choice. You have the puck more than anybody else on your team, chances are very high you're going to have the most giveaways. That's really just basic logic if A then B stuff.

That's logic if you aren't very bright. See there are all kinds of players who have the puck lots but aren't at the bottom of the league in giveaways every year AND sport more takeaways than giveaways. Johnny is both at the bottom and gives it up twice as much as he gets it back.

 

[Rants Mulliniks]

Did you know that during last year's world championship only 1 forward cracked the top 10 in passes completed?

It was Gaudreau. He was first by a large margin, followed by 9 defenseman.

Gaudreau makes a lot more passes than pretty much any other forward, and carries the puck a lot more as well (way way more than Marner). He also is aggressive with the puck on his stick - attacking defenses instead of settling for perimeter shots. Marner has an average shot length of 31 feet, Gaudreau's is 24. Because he goes to higher traffic areas to get better scoring chances.

Oh wow! So if you do something 100 times more than someone else there's a chance you might have it actually happen more? I remember this argument in the old Iverson days. Hey look, I scored more points, though I shot 30% more times so also missed more but please ignore one over the other.

Now have fun comparing him to all the other guys like McDavid, for example.

 

[Bounces R Way]

That's logic if you aren't very bright. See there are all kinds of players who have the puck lots but aren't at the bottom of the league in giveaways every year AND sport more takeaways than giveaways. Johnny is both at the bottom and gives it up twice as much as he gets it back.

Guess I'll just forward your email to Gaudreau so you can tell him how to play hockey because you know better.

Tied for 2nd in league scoring as an undersized 25 year old, but HF user "Rants Mulliniks" has the answers. Nearly scoring at a 1.5 point per game pace but he's doing it wrong

 

[Bounces R Way]

Kind of rattles me people still have no idea how good this kid is. Johnny Hockey is going to be a superstar in this league for a long long time. When the sport moves as fast as it does in this day and age a big part of how successful you'll be in the NHL is largely about two things 1) about how quick you play and 2) how quickly you think. Not only do you have to be a fantastic athlete but you need also much more than that. You need that anticipation, you need to be a step ahead of the best group of hockey players in the world. Look down the all the time scoring lists and you'll see some players had great shots, some great hands, some had great speed. What most of the best have in common is their mind for the game. How they think it. That they were a step ahead of rest of the best group of hockey players in the world and were a step ahead of these other players consistently over their careers.

Just see: McDavid, Kucherov, Crosby, MacKinnon, Pastrnak, Kane , and *ahem* Wayne Gretzky for further proof.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Oh wow! So if you do something 100 times more than someone else there's a chance you might have it actually happen more? I remember this argument in the old Iverson days. Hey look, I scored more points, though I shot 30% more times so also missed more but please ignore one over the other.

Now have fun comparing him to all the other guys like McDavid, for example.

Are you actually trying to argue that completing passes is a bad thing?

 

[Peggy]

Gretzky won a bunch of art rosses years ago too.

Doesn't matter what someone did in the past when asking a question about the current player.

Who's leading in goals?

 

[JasonRoseEh]

It's still Ovechkin. His line has been in turmoil pretty much all year, the Caps haven't been healthy so the PP has suffered greatly over the last 22 games and he's still leading his team in points and the league in goals.

 

[c3z4r]

This season so far, I’d say definitely Gaudreau over Ovi, but we’ll see. We’re only halfway through.

 

[Ashasx]

That's logic if you aren't very bright. See there are all kinds of players who have the puck lots but aren't at the bottom of the league in giveaways every year AND sport more takeaways than giveaways. Johnny is both at the bottom and gives it up twice as much as he gets it back.

https://www.foxsports.com/nhl/stats...sort=8&time=0&pos=0&team=0&qual=1&sortOrder=1

Look at the players with the most giveaways in the NHL. There is literally zero correlation between giveaways and players being defensive liabilities.

 

[King In The North]

Both are franchise guys. Obviously Ovi has a longer track record at being the best of his position.