Post-Game Talk: Babcock gets out-coached and team gets embarrassed again.

[White Shadow]

One year rebuild is falling apart, Shanahan should have pulled back the reigns on Lou and Babs who reverted from the plan, when they started trading picks away after only one year into the plan. Nothing seems to change I've seen these rebuilds over and over the years they get a little success then try and hit a HR.

Huh?

Since the beginning of last season we have acquired a 4th, 6th and 7th and traded away a 2nd and a 6th.

 

[Man Bear Pig]

It's not Babcock's fault that Jake Gardiner forgets how to play hockey...forget defence.

That's not the issue though with Babcock. We're all fully aware that he plays whomever he's given on the roster. The issue is sticking with a style that didn't work last year and hasnt worked this year. I'm speaking of the defensive zone coverage and this collapsing style they're trying to use. Over and over again we'r seeing the opposition grind in the corners then flip it back to their D who are wide open. That's what's killing this team right now. And thats on Babcock. The forwards are clearly being told to collapse and all its leading to is panic and chaos in the defensive zone. So while it's not Babcocks fault that Gardiner and Kadri make bonehaded plays, it is on Babcock to read and adjust. Opposition coaches are adjusting their play. Trapping the Leafs, and it works. Why is our coach demanding this collapsing style of system when it hasn't worked for over a year. Babcock is paid to be smarter than 90% of the coaches out there. All I'm seeing is a stubborn coach who believes in his system and refuses to adapt.

 

[rent free]

he needs to teach his players how to forecheck, backcheck and play defense

 

[Egghead1999]

I don't understand stand why Marleau and Nylander aren't on the same line. They can both play center 50% of the time.

JVR Matthews Marner
Marleau Nylander Hyman
Komarov Kadri Brown
Martin Bozak Kapanen

Did you watch any leafs game this year? Nylander won't pass to Hyman even if Babcock puts a gun to his head . May be "JVR Matthews Hyman" and "Marleau Nylander Marner"

 

[Sniper99]

doubt it.

 

[FreeBird]

Huh?

Since the beginning of last season we have acquired a 4th, 6th and 7th and traded away a 2nd and a 6th.

Traded away 1st and 2nd for Andersen, two 2nd's and a 3rd at last June draft. Continue to draft small wingers who loose puck battles.

 

[Anthrax442]

doubt it.

You doubt that I said that I was sarcastic?

 

[White Shadow]

That's not the issue though with Babcock. We're all fully aware that he plays whomever he's given on the roster. The issue is sticking with a style that didn't work last year and hasnt worked this year. I'm speaking of the defensive zone coverage and this collapsing style they're trying to use. Over and over again we'r seeing the opposition grind in the corners then flip it back to their D who are wide open. That's what's killing this team right now. And thats on Babcock. The forwards are clearly being told to collapse and all its leading to is panic and chaos in the defensive zone. So while it's not Babcocks fault that Gardiner and Kadri make bonehaded plays, it is on Babcock to read and adjust. Opposition coaches are adjusting their play. Trapping the Leafs, and it works. Why is our coach demanding this collapsing style of system when it hasn't worked for over a year. Babcock is paid to be smarter than 90% of the coaches out there. All I'm seeing is a stubborn coach who believes in his system and refuses to adapt.

That's not entirely how it is supposed to work. The winger can collapse down, but if he does, he still has to be able to cut off the top. The job of the winger is to apply down low pressure but not necessarily to dislodge puck carrier from the puck: mainly it is 1. deny the pass to the point or failing that 2. get in the lane to block the point shot.

 

[White Shadow]

Traded away 1st and 2nd for Andersen, two 2nd's and a 3rd at last June draft. Continue to draft small wingers who loose puck battles.

We made no trades at last June draft. The third rounder was compensation for Babcock.

Freddie is basically what we got back for Kessel.

 

[weems]

The first goal last night is a perfect example of how disorganized we currently are defensively.

Puck gets bounced over to the boards. We have not only the D and center chase the ONE player but Brown also overcommited and it left both his pointman but also the slot area he could be shading open.

Freddy gets blamed because he left a soft little rebound for Tarasenko but there was problems before Freddy even comes into play.

Just no way 3 players should be chasing one player for the puck.

 

[Man Bear Pig]

That's not entirely how it is supposed to work. The winger can collapse down, but if he does, he still has to be able to cut off the top. The job of the winger is to apply down low pressure but not necessarily to dislodge puck carrier from the puck: mainly it is 1. deny the pass to the point or failing that 2. get in the lane to block the point shot.

That is the idea, but it isnt working. Its not stopping the cycle. Which is why I'm suggesting trying a man to man defense. Try it for a period. Theres nothing left to lose at this point.

 

[The Best Leafs Ever]

We are still 2nd in GF but we are 28th in GA. Even VGK is doing a far better job controlling that and with a team built from scraps of players that most teams didn't need on their roster. I blame both Lou and Babcock for this shi*, he can't trade any of Bozak/JVR/Komarov for 2 seasons now and get a little bit of defensive help. Yes Hainsey signing has paid up but the problem with Gardiner, Carrick and Polak still exists. Babcock is also pretty pathetic sticking Kadri with Komarov, Marner with Bozak. Just play god damn Leivo with Kadri, sit Komarov for a few games. At this point the team defense is affecting the new players that are coming to the league negatively AKA Zaitsev, Borgman.

Andersen is also pretty much mediocre at best, he has some good saves but he just gives up some easy savable goals. How do you expect to win a game when your f***ing goalie gives up 3.48 goals on average every match.

 

[Apotheosis]

Didn't watch the game, but just caught the highlights after work and I'd like to voice my pure opinion on the matter. I fully understand the idea of having a grinder-esque player to support skill players, but if that player doesn't have skill, then it won't do anything in the long run and just make it harder for the skill players to play. For instance, it worked in the case of Kane-Panarin and now Stamkos-Kucherov because Name and Anisimov are good at getting the puck but also are good at handling it. Hyman works just as hard, but has the hockey IQ of a donkey when the puck is on his stick. You see this on the break out when Matthews and Nylander have tried to pass to him and he gets stuck in the neutral zone because he can't balance the puck on his stick properly. It speaks volumes that Matthews is nearly top of the league in scoring when he's STILL not scoring well enough on HD chances for league average. This applies to other lines as well. The team is fast. VERY FAST. When the team gets in the zone, they are one of the best teams in the league in possession. The problem is the initiative. It seems like from game to game, the team doesn't know if it want to burn with speed or play possession. The forwards minus the first line still aren't that good at supporting defence, which makes the D look worse than it is (which doesn't excuse the crapshoot the STL game was). There's problems with this team, and it's mostly chemistry based, but Babcock needs to do this soon, or we could end up just outside of the 8th seed by the end of the season.

 

[ottomaddox]

IMPORTANT POINTS FOR CALM. NOW CALM.

• The fans need to show some calm here. We are not going to win The President's Trophy. So be it.
• Andersen has been a slow starter, but you know he can play better.
• Babcock is allowed to have an off night too.
• We are going to have bad games this season. They often come on the road.
• Many of these games have been experiments. I can't believe many of you haven't caught on to that. Almost every night there is a trial and error moment. The MGMT is seeing who is worth playing, who they can live without, and what they need more of. I am sorry, but Dominic Moore is proven. Why would you shuffle him in and out of the line-up with Boz or Fehr playing 4th line C. Does that make any sense? The only sense is that this team is going to have a once-over after American Thanksgiving. I also think Dermott, Kapanen, and Sosh, will be part of the team this year (significant down the stretch).
• Leivo is not the answer. He can't put on the goalie pads, coach the team, make trades, skate fast, play the PK, and defend (play 1D).

 

[FreeBird]

We made no trades at last June draft. The third rounder was compensation for Babcock.

Freddie is basically what we got back for Kessel.

They were traded during the season leading up to the Deadline, we had three heading into last season.