Rumor: Avs Proposals/Rumors/Free Agents 2017-18 Part II

[tigervixxxen]

God...something Larry Brooks from the NY Post said made me shudder. He said the Rangers are shopping Holden for some help at center. Given how much the Rangers in the past just looooove Avs players, I couldn't help but make a correlation in my head, even though NO mention of Duchene was made whatsoever.

I tell ya what, if any return on Duchene includes Nick goddamn Holden, I will vomit last week's lunch.

I would still vomit of he brings them back more than a 4th.

 

[CalderKing21]

Is this a joke?

Sometimes...it's better to have Sakic as GM.

 

[Balthazar]

Would people do this trade?

Vegas 2018 1st rounder + Shea Theodore for
Matt Duchene & Avs 2018 second rounder

McPhee isn't touching that with a 10ft pole. Did you miss everything that happened with Vegas since the expansion draft?

 

[Nalens Oga]

I know lol, Vegas is the only team that's actively tanking other than us and I doubt he wants to put together two proper top-six centres by bringing Duchene in. Being as bad as possible this season is more valuable to them than bringing in Duchene.

It's kinda ingenious actually, they have a roster that's just good enough to not embarass itself but too offensively weak to actually score much. They'll pull a Toronto 2015 and lose a lot of close games and finish with a 65-75 point season.

 

[GoNordiquesGo]

I Wonder what the Bolts and Jets boards looked like when Drouin and Trouba publicly stated that they wanted to be traded and their GM didn't comply because he felt he didn't get proper value for them.

One of the main difference I see is that in these cases, it didn't go rampant in the media. Other than Sakic's initial comment about everyone except Mac and kids being available, he has kept rather quiet about the whole process. And that initial comment was nothing special. GM say all the time that it is their job to enquire about everyone and anyone, that no one is untouchable, etc...

I wonder why it became such a circus in Duchene's case. Seems more a case of other GMs, like Ott, NYI and Car who made public comments than Sakic's direct doing. Probably his indirect doing however, because is mismanaging the negociations with these GMs, which lead to them being frustrated and leaking more info to the press.

The last similar case I recall was Luongo in Vancouver, where they ended-up trading Schneider instead. That Luongo situation turned into a similar circus at that time, and didn't end well at all for Van...

 

[ABasin]

I've got, I've got, I've got, is Dater actually Sakic?

No. Dater's actually Sea Eagles.

 

[Bender]

I Wonder what the Bolts and Jets boards looked like when Drouin and Trouba publicly stated that they wanted to be traded and their GM didn't comply because he felt he didn't get proper value for them.

One of the main difference I see is that in these cases, it didn't go rampant in the media. Other than Sakic's initial comment about everyone except Mac and kids being available, he has kept rather quiet about the whole process. And that initial comment was nothing special. GM say all the time that it is their job to enquire about everyone and anyone, that no one is untouchable, etc...

I wonder why it became such a circus in Duchene's case. Seems more a case of other GMs, like Ott, NYI and Car who made public comments than Sakic's direct doing. Probably his indirect doing however, because is mismanaging the negociations with these GMs, which lead to them being frustrated and leaking more info to the press.

The last similar case I recall was Luongo in Vancouver, where they ended-up trading Schneider instead. That Luongo situation turned into a similar circus at that time, and didn't end well at all for Van...

I think it has to do with the fact that other GMs were foaming at the mouth to acquire a very good player ‘on-the-cheap’ due to a poor season by the team. I think GMs like Dorion and Snow thought they’d be able to acquire Duchene for relatively cheap, given his track record and their inability to do so led them to cry and moan about it in the media. I think once melnyk was able to publicly ridicule Sakic for his ask and nothing came of it, it opened the door for others to do so and to continually keep piling on.

 

[Sea Eagles]

No. Dater's actually Sea Eagles.

No way - that guy is consistently negative about our team. That's why I appreciated his latest piece. Something of substance.

 

[tigervixxxen]

Drouin and Trouba both held out so the biggest mark of importance was them reporting and playing on the team, not a trade.

 

[EdAVSfan]

What'll be interesting to note several years from now, is that even though joe Sakic will have horribly failed at the NHL level, he will most likely leave the team with a significantly better prospect pool, as well as a good healthy future than when he got here.

 

[cgf]

argh thread got closed as i was going to post , anyway

I suppose the Isles picks are ok, but wont they be late ? so a bunch of 2nds for Duchene essentially?

I mean i guess if we have a bunch of assets like that we can trade up, not that i think we are that capable but its a nice idea in theory

Even with the additions of Duchene & Hamonic respectively, the Isles & Flames would both still be bubble-to-low-level-playoff teams. I'd guess that one ends up in the teens & one in the early 20s.

 

[agentblack]

Even with the additions of Duchene & Hamonic respectively, the Isles & Flames would both still be bubble-to-low-level-playoff teams. I'd guess that one ends up in the teens & one in the early 20s.

Yeah I'm totally for it , especially if we can get their CGY 2nd and a prospect like Bellows or Toews thrown in.

 

[Taak19]

What'll be interesting to note several years from now, is that even though joe Sakic will have horribly failed at the NHL level, he will most likely leave the team with a significantly better prospect pool, as well as a good healthy future than when he got here.

So ironic.

 

[CoachBadkitten]

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/30-thoughts-summer-market-matt-duchene-still-open/

6. Everyone decided to take a deep breath and go back to their corners when Matt Duchene wasn't traded July 1. It sounds like everyone is realizing the possibility he could start next season in Colorado. But remember this: Avalanche assistant GM Chris MacFarland was with Scott Howson in Columbus when Howson waited until July 20, 2012, to trade Rick Nash. Sometimes the best predictor of future behaviour is past behaviour, and MacFarland could be following that blueprint. I wouldn't be surprised if interested parties (Boston, Columbus, Nashville, Pittsburgh, maybe Calgary) try again to see if anything shakes loose.

7. There's been criticism of the way Colorado's handled this. I do think everyone -including Duchene -would benefit from a fresh start, but the Avalanche need this deal. The Ryan O'Reilly trade didn't work, and you can't move two of those talents without getting some kind of win. They are looking for young players with term, and I think the guys they've targeted include Mathew Barzal and Ilya Sorokin from the Islanders; Brandon Carlo or Charlie McEvoy from the Bruins; Mattias Ekholm from the Predators. (Before someone from Barstool comes at me, I don't think the McEvoy conversation was a long one.)

What makes it tough for these other clubs is Duchene only has two years remaining. That certainly was a problem for Carolina. One exec pointed out three examples of similar trades: Ryan Johansen for Seth Jones; Taylor Hall for Adam Larsson; and Jonathan Drouin for Mikhail Sergachev. They were all one-for-one, and both players involved could be under team control for a longer time. But the Avalanche are determined to do it right, and they have to.

Some interesting stuff, not surprising. Nice to hear they are going for Barzal and such. Interesting that Flames name is thrown in there.

 

[Freudian]

Part of the reason the prospect pool is better is that the O'Reilly trade brought back what ended up as Compher, Greer, Morrison and Smirnov and part of the reason is that he hasn't really graduated any player during his watch beyond Rantanen.

It's not like Sakic has been accumulating picks. What holes there were on the team were filled with waiver pickups, fading veterans and players like Gelinas. That's why we haven't really had any player from the prospect pool promoted.

It's not all bad. There are reasons to be tentatively positive about the players Avs have drafted. Chances are there are going to be a bunch of good NHLers coming out of that bunch. Beyond the draft where Avs wanted size and right hand shots (2014) there hasn't been any wasted draft.

 

[Vaslof]

Those are all good pieces to be after. I'm on Sakic's side on this. A package of lottery tickets can be a fallback, but not what you ask for.

About the extensions.. Teams can negotiate an extension when there's only 1 year left in the contract, right? So.. If this really drags out, can we sign and trade Duchene next year?

 

[hockeyfish]

Ugg, saying the Avs missed on O'Reilly and then saying they are aiming for a futures only package from the Islanders two sentences later.

 

[tigervixxxen]

Not just our sections, but that whole column felt like pushing someone's BS

 

[tigervixxxen]

Part of the reason the prospect pool is better is that the O'Reilly trade brought back what ended up as Compher, Greer, Morrison and Smirnov and part of the reason is that he hasn't really graduated any player during his watch beyond Rantanen.

It's not like Sakic has been accumulating picks. What holes there were on the team were filled with waiver pickups, fading veterans and players like Gelinas. That's why we haven't really had any player from the prospect pool promoted.

It's not all bad. There are reasons to be tentatively positive about the players Avs have drafted. Chances are there are going to be a bunch of good NHLers coming out of that bunch. Beyond the draft where Avs wanted size and right hand shots (2014) there hasn't been any wasted draft.

Agree, good points to remember.

 

[Bender]

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/30-thoughts-summer-market-matt-duchene-still-open/




Some interesting stuff, not surprising. Nice to hear they are going for Barzal and such. Interesting that Flames name is thrown in there.

I think out of all the teams that would be interested in Duchene, Calgary makes a ton of sense. Other teams have their own reasons for being interested as well but when the Flames traded what they did for Hamonic, it really signaled their intention to make some damage in the playoffs starting next year.

For me, if they were to offer Bennett + Valimaki + a prospect like Gillies or Parsons, it gets done on my end.

I'm still a huge fan of Sam Bennett even though his first 2 years in the NHL haven't been as productive as he'd like. I could see the Flames getting impatient there.

Valimaki I had him ranked extremely high (4th overall in this year's draft) I think he's going to be an excellent Top-4 D-man eventually and the Flames have 2 very good goaltending prospects in Parsons or Gillies, so pick one and send him over.

 

[hockeyfish]

I think out of all the teams that would be interested in Duchene, Calgary makes a ton of sense. Other teams have their own reasons for being interested as well but when the Flames traded what they did for Hamonic, it really signaled their intention to make some damage in the playoffs starting next year.

For me, if they were to offer Bennett + Valimaki + a prospect like Gillies or Parsons, it gets done on my end.

I'm still a huge fan of Sam Bennett even though his first 2 years in the NHL haven't been as productive as he'd like. I could see the Flames getting impatient there.

Valimaki I had him ranked extremely high (4th overall in this year's draft) I think he's going to be an excellent Top-4 D-man eventually and the Flames have 2 very good goaltending prospects in Parsons or Gillies, so pick one and send him over.

I'd be fine with that. Bennett is a bit of a roll of the dice, but the upside to that deal is massive.

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

I think out of all the teams that would be interested in Duchene, Calgary makes a ton of sense. Other teams have their own reasons for being interested as well but when the Flames traded what they did for Hamonic, it really signaled their intention to make some damage in the playoffs starting next year.

For me, if they were to offer Bennett + Valimaki + a prospect like Gillies or Parsons, it gets done on my end.

I'm still a huge fan of Sam Bennett even though his first 2 years in the NHL haven't been as productive as he'd like. I could see the Flames getting impatient there.

Valimaki I had him ranked extremely high (4th overall in this year's draft) I think he's going to be an excellent Top-4 D-man eventually and the Flames have 2 very good goaltending prospects in Parsons or Gillies, so pick one and send him over.

That's kind of the package that I was going to propose as well. It's a lot to give up, Bennett has shown glimpses of being a very good talent but also hasn't really put it together. Valimaki has a good floor, but may not have a high ceiling. I'd be down for a Flames trade TBH, I'd like a future MacK-Bennett 1-2 punch.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

FYI....There's a rumor out there that the Canes have a buyer and would stay in Carolina. If true, I'm not sure it changes anything but maybe the new owner would loosen up the purse strings some?

Scott Soshnick is a reporter for Bloomberg Sports

 

[hockeyfish]

What is the deal with Bennett anyway. Some fundamental flaw to his game that we didn't see before his draft or is he just stuck behind other players?

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

FYI....There's a rumor out there that the Canes have a buyer and would stay in Carolina. If true, I'm not sure it changes anything but maybe the new owner would loosen up the purse strings some?

Scott Soshnick is a reporter for Bloomberg Sports

The Canes and Hanifin are definitely my preferred option, hoping that a new owner would want to compete quicker and helps to force through a Duchene trade.