Rumor: Avs Proposals/Rumors/Free Agents 18-19 part XXXIV|Pokecheque Liked The Other Title Better Ed.

[Pierce Hawthorne]

So Vancouver is interested in trading for Barrie.

But don’t they have Hughes?

Isn’t there some kind of weird rule where you can’t have 2 offensive dmen?

Only in Colorado.

I believe it was @henchman24 who posted the link to the rule in the CBA about this situation already.

 

[henchman21]

How does it work if he's not signed by the expansion draft? Can't we just sign him AFTER the expansion draft so we don't have to protect him?

Not sure Barrie wasn't to be jobless for a year

 

[Barklez]

Sakic isn't making a deal unless it makes perfect sense for him.

Some will disagree but I find that comforting. If there’s anything I’m confident that I know about Sakic as a GM it’s that he won’t compromise for a deal he’s not happy with.

Until the return for Barrie surpasses the value he brings to next year’s cup run, no need to force anything. Let the interested GMs stumble over one another and their respective crap offer packages as much as they want.

 

[Pokecheque]

Yeah, I said it and I stand by it.

He backed himself into a corner and got saved by Dorion deciding he just had to have Duchene. Dorion is the one who orchestrated the 3-team trade (something Joe hasn't denied). The trade fell apart and it was MacFarland & Fenton who resurrected it.

Joe's entire history shows passivity. Yeah he set a high price, and yeah he ended up getting it, but to attempt to dispute that his "patience" didn't nearly backfire would be wrong. Dorion walked away from that price, and it was on to other suitors (CBJ, NYI, NSH, etc) before Dorion decided to come back around.

Sure thing, it's just interesting how you are "standing by" this notion that he fell ass-backward into this because Pierre Dorion is an idiot, yet you say nothing about the fact that this deal doesn't happen unless David Poile gets involved as well. So is he an idiot too? And Joe is so passive that he just lucked into two stupid GMs wanting to make a deal? This was all just dumb luck?

Okay then...you'll forgive me if I don't stand by your ridiculously shaky narrative. You're really going out of your way to convince yourself that Joe isn't a good GM to the point where you won't give him an ounce of credit for engineering one of the greatest trades in franchise history.

This of course doesn't make him an unmitigated genius either, but it's possible he at least knows what he's doing.

 

[Foppa2118]

In 1 year, the Blues acquired three centers in Schenn, O’Reilly, and Bozak.

They promptly won the Cup.

Kudos to them for such aggressive moves to improve their team.

They also traded away pending UFA's Kevin Shattenkirk and TJ Oshie. Shattenkirk for futures that helped them make those moves.

This is not meant to support a Virtanen trade BTW.

 

[GoNordiquesGo]

Joe backed himself into a corner on the Duchene deal and got bailed out because Pierre Dorion is a ****ing idiot. So while it was good that Joe got what he did for Duchene, it wasn't some masterful stroke of genius. In fact, Dorion (if he's to be believed, but I haven't seen/heard Joe dispute this) was the one who had to sort of let Joe know how he could get as much as he ended up getting ("You take our pacakge, and then flip Turris to Nashville...")

Joe's larger body of work shows him to be extremely passive and gunshy, and not really all that great of a trader. Could he have improved? Sure, but this whole notion that just because he got bailed out by Dorion going "Full Dorion" doesn't mean that he's a great trade negotiator.

Just to be clear, I didn't write that he was a great trader. I said that his passive behavior indicates that he will prefer to do nothing rarther to do a bad trade. Therefore this horrible trade rumor with Vancouver doesn't make any sense to me.

 

[Foppa2118]

"For now, Sakic has informed teams that he is perfectly willing to play out this season – as the up-and-coming Avalanche hope to contend for the Stanley Cup – with Barrie as an “own rental” and risk letting him walk next summer for nothing."

I don't think Sakic is bluffing here either. He doesn't usually operate that way, and after the success they had this year with Barrie down the stretch, I've said there was a decent chance they'd just keep him and lose him to UFA anyway.

Everyone needs to step away from the ledge. Wait for the trade to be announced, before freaking out. Like it was said already, Dater probably doesn't have all the pieces to the trade, or know how close it is to being finalized anyway.

Hell, this could be one of Benning's first offers. Waiting for Sakic to counter offer with something involving Horvat, and because it's Benning he'll just go, "Ok."

 

[Iceberg]

So, "own rental" it is.

 

[Wintersun]

They also traded away pending UFA's Kevin Shattenkirk and TJ Oshie. Shattenkirk for futures that helped them make those moves.

This is not meant to support a Virtanen trade BTW.

Well, that's cool but unless you can promise we can get a O'Reilly/Scheifele/Couturier for a late 1st, bowers, calvert and nieto after we have traded Barrie for a futures package, we're not going to be a cup contender by trading Barrie.

 

[Foppa2118]

Well, that's cool but unless you can promise we can get a O'Reilly/Scheifele/Couturier for a late 1st, bowers, calvert and nieto after we have traded Barrie for a futures package, we're not going to be a cup contender by trading Barrie.

St Louis didn't have any promises like that when they made those moves.

 

[Wintersun]

St Louis didn't have any promises like that when they made those moves.

True. But it's not because they managed to pull it off that we will if we move Barrie for cap space. And anyway, we could make a trade including a first and prospects for immediate help and sign guys like the Blues did even if we keep Barrie. We have that cap space. So..

 

[Foppberg]

If our best returns for Barrie are packages like 1st + Virtanen or Kapanen for Barrie.. I'd rather just keep him and run the risk of losing him.

 

[The Abusement Park]

I wanna know what’s going on with Big Ol’ Carl!

 

[flyfysher]

Joe's larger body of work shows him to be extremely passive and gunshy, and not really all that great of a trader.

You're disregarding what Sakic said about acquiring players after Roy left - youth, skill, not overpay for FA. It's not like he's actively looking to spend for FA and he's very careful when it comes to spending. Again, this is with Sakic fully in charge catering to what he ultimately thinks is best for the team. Normally you're right. Sakic prefers to be passive with respect to trades, more like he does trades because he has no choice, and where we see him be proactive is with bottom sixers as UFAs.

This year will be interesting. The Avs are clearly in their cup window. They are contending now. So I would expect that Sakic's normal way of doing things will change. Specifically, I'd expect him to be more open to big trades or drafting home run type players (Dach). I also suspect he'd be more active on the FA market but given the present climate, he's thankfully unwilling to commit himself to the crazy contract terms that we're seeing. So whatever moves he makes should hopefully give us a little clearer direction of where the team is going.

As Cobra Access stated, extend Barrie now or trade him. If he is trading Barrie then please retain the 4th and 16th picks. Sakic must address the second-line C and W if he trades Barrie.

Yeah it's disappointing that the Avs didn't get Hughes or Kakko because they'd be immediate impact players. Still, over a career it wouldn't surprise me if someone like Dach developed into the best player from this draft. In other words, our perspective is super limited and narrow right now.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

That Saravalli video makes me feel much better. Sakic isn’t trading Barrie for futures.

I love trades. I love activity. Most of all I absolutely love draft day. I was looking forward to hopefully seeing some changes for the better of our team tonight but after the fear of trading Tyson Barrie for a pile of shit all day I think my most ideal draft day would be to select somebody at 4, 16 and call it a night.

I take zero trades over trading Tyson Barrie every day.

 

[Ararana]

FWIW, AJ disputing Dater's rumor

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

FWIW, AJ disputing Dater's rumor

Ya pay no attention to those two. It's like watching an episode of Jerry Springer play out on the internet.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

FWIW, AJ disputing Dater's rumor

What a stupid response. Even if AJ has legit news and knows a bunch there’s no way he could know with absolutely certainty that there’s “nothing” to Daters tweet.

I mean I Hope AJ is right. But the bold way he goes about it just makes him look like a know it all when there’s no chance in hell he “knows it all”.

 

[dahrougem2]

AJ and Dater are both hacks

 

[Foppberg]

Hm.. I wonder why he has a hard time being taken seriously. The hockey world is a small one, he doesn't do himself any favours when he continuously does things like that.

 

[Foppa2118]

FWIW, AJ disputing Dater's rumor

I guess these two didn't resolve their pissing match about the Kevin Hayes thing in Philly.

 

[Barklez]

FWIW, AJ disputing Dater's rumor

Ya pay no attention to those two. It's like watching an episode of Jerry Springer play out on the internet.

 

[henchman21]

I wanna know what’s going on with Big Ol’ Carl!

 

[S3rkie]

I wanna know what’s going on with Big Ol’ Carl!

With Soda's NTC cap friendly has it listed as kicking in, in 2017 does that mean he already submitted his 10 team list or does it have to be updated in the event of a trade.

 

[hooverdam]

I remember when AJ quote-tweeted another insider's tweet about Ottawa and Nashville engaged in trade talks with the Avs for Duchene with "lol" the night before Duchene was traded in a threeway trade with Ottawa and Nashville. Really did a lot for his #brand that night.