Friedman: Avs interested in Nick Hjalmarsson

[Weast]

Ah, yes, nothing says winning hockey like having 3-4 of your defensemen being unable to move the puck up the ice, and their preferred defensive style being falling to the ice and flailing about while hoping a puck hits them.

I prefer to think of it as having 3-4 veteran defensive leaders, who are smart positionally and know their roles to block shots and make hits. With that being said, if the Avs do go after Hammer, I fully expect Cole to be off the team one way or another.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

I guess. We've seen teams rally around 3rd string goalies a ton. And we saw the Avs do much better with their 3rd string goalie than they did with their 2nd string goalie this year.

Yes, we have seen teams rally around a 3rd string goalie. But, it's almost in the regular season, and only for a few games. The longest stretch I can remember was Andrew Hammond in 2014-15 when he won 20 out of 24 games.

What we don't see is 3rd string goalies lead their teams to Cups. It's just not something that happens, and pretending a team should be able to do that is unrealistic.

 

[Gurglesons]

Yes, we have seen teams rally around a 3rd string goalie. But, it's almost in the regular season, and only for a few games. The longest stretch I can remember was Andrew Hammond in 2014-15 when he won 20 out of 24 games.

What we don't see is 3rd string goalies lead their teams to Cups. It's just not something that happens, and pretending a team should be able to do that is unrealistic.

The Blues just did it last year. Obviously, not through injury. But let's not pretend we haven't seen it.

 

[missionAvs]

Yeah, I guess the injury with MacK wasn't technically until G7 and the other injuries were modest. For some reason I thought Grubs was injured heading into the playoffs that year, was it Rantanen that was?

Gru owned in the first round against Calgary so if he was injured, it certainly wasn't anything to the extent of these playoffs where it looked like the dude's pecker fell off on the ice from a nothing play. Rants also had a very good first round. I honestly just think that we were outmatched against the Sharks. The MacK situation would have been catastrophic but that wasn't until the very last game.

 

[Gurglesons]

Gru owned in the first round against Calgary so if he was injured, it certainly wasn't anything to the extent of these playoffs where it looked like the dude's pecker fell off on the ice from a nothing play. Rants also had a very good first round. I honestly just think that we were outmatched against the Sharks. The MacK situation would have been catastrophic but that wasn't until the very last game.

I was all in on the Avs that year, but I must be misremembering.

I remember when the Pens played them that year the Pens board was expecting an easy win and I was like, this Avs team is something special right now and I think they beat us 5-1 or something.

Ah, just checked it. It was 6-3. The Avs killed us the whole game and Crosby had a hat trick because of course he did against MacK.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

The Blues just did it last year. Obviously, not through injury. But let's not pretend we haven't seen it.

Binnington was a rookie who ended up earning the starting role during the regular season and started all 26 playoff games. He was in no way their 3rd string goalie when the playoffs started.

 

[Gurglesons]

Binnington was a rookie who ended up earning the starting role during the regular season and started all 26 playoff games. He was in no way their 3rd string goalie when the playoffs started.

He was a 3rd string goalie that led the team on the way to the cup which is what I'm saying.

Once again, I don't really need to argue semantics. The Avs will invest in depth and looking at a player like Hammer shouldn't be surprising.

 

[Fatass]

Jost for Hjarmalson?

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

He was a 3rd string goalie that led the team on the way to the cup which is what I'm saying.

I guess. But, he earned the starting role months before the playoffs started, and has continued to be their starter since. For that Cup run, he was absolutely their starter.

 

[shadow1]

Sakic said he was looking to add around the edges (as opposed to last off-season's roster overhaul), and this is a move that would make sense.

The Avs PK was a respectable in the regular season (81.4%, 13th in the NHL), but was an abysmal 75% in the post-season (36/48).

Some of that was goaltending, but Colorado's defense struggled incredibly to clear the puck on the PK.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

2017 Penguins.

Welcome to contender status. Injuries ain't an excuse, especially now that the kids are going to start getting paid.

I'm confused... Did the 2016/17 Penguins lose its starting goalie AND backup goalie to injury? You're just acting dumb at this point. Yes, injuries are no excuse and any cup winner has to play through at least some of them in order to win. But it's a different story when you are talking about your #1 AND #2 Goalies in the playoffs in the same series at basically the exact same time.


When was the last time a team had to use its AHL Goalie in the playoffs and won the cup with him as the starting goalie? In the last 20 years only 2 Cup winning teams have even used a 3rd goalie in the playoffs. The 15/16 Penguins who had to use Zatkoff for all of 2 games in the first round. And the 2009/10 Hawks had to use Corey Crawford(At the time was there AHL goalie) for 1 game.


The Avs were absolutely toast the moment Francouz went down with his injury. Hutchinson came in and almost managed to steal a series in spite of the injuries two both starters, but they weren't going any further then that and everybody knew that(Well actually with how poorly Vegas looked who knows).


It's just the way things go. Injuries happen and every year at least 1 top contending team usually gets taken out partly due to injuries, this year it was the Avs.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

He was a 3rd string goalie that led the team on the way to the cup which is what I'm saying.

Once again, I don't really need to argue semantics. The Avs will invest in depth and looking at a player like Hammer shouldn't be surprising.

I don't disagree that we'll most likely invest in depth. Winning the Cup is extremely difficult, and multiple injuries during the playoffs can derail even the best team, so depth is key. And I'd happily replace Cole with Hjalmarsson in a heartbeat, assuming the price is right.

Where I disagree is that a team should be able to overcome losing their starter and backup goalie to injuries during the playoffs and still be expected to compete for the cup, because it simply doesn't happen. I also disagree that the 2017 Penguins overcame the same level of injuries in the playoffs that we had.

 

[Gurglesons]

I'm confused... Did the 2016/17 Penguins lose its starting goalie AND backup goalie to injury? You're just acting dumb at this point. Yes, injuries are no excuse and any cup winner has to play through at least some of them in order to win. But it's a different story when you are talking about your #1 AND #2 Goalies in the playoffs in the same series at basically the exact same time.


When was the last time a team had to use its AHL Goalie in the playoffs and won the cup with him as the starting goalie? In the last 20 years only 2 Cup winning teams have even used a 3rd goalie in the playoffs. The 15/16 Penguins who had to use Zatkoff for all of 2 games in the first round. And the 2009/10 Hawks had to use Corey Crawford(At the time was there AHL goalie) for 1 game.


The Avs were absolutely toast the moment Francouz went down with his injury. Hutchinson came in and almost managed to steal a series in spite of the injuries two both starters, but they weren't going any further then that and everybody knew that(Well actually with how poorly Vegas looked who knows).


It's just the way things go. Injuries happen and every year at least 1 top contending team usually gets taken out partly due to injuries, this year it was the Avs.

Binnington - 2019. 3rd goalie.
Darling - 2015. 3rd goalie.

Avs were down 3-1 when Francouz went down with his injury. I'm not sure how him being healthy or not prevents the Avs from winning the series. And they lost to a team that was missing their starting goalie in every game the Avs lost.

The Avs lost because their back-up was a mediocre overachiever in the regular season and they didn't have the "right" depth to match-up against a better Dallas squad.

Sakic's offseason likely results in him trying to fix those situations.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Binnington - 2019. 3rd goalie.
Darling - 2015. 3rd goalie.

Avs were down 3-1 when Francouz went down with his injury.

I dont even know why I responded to you in the first place, it is so obvious here and in all of your posts that you dont really have a clue what you are talking about.


Binnington most certainly was not the #3. He flat out stole the #1 job from Allen and was the starter from January onward. Not even close to a #3 goalie.

Darling was not the #3 Goalie. He was the back up who played all of 4 games because Crawford couldn't make a save at the beginning and he stole the job from Corey until Darling played like crap himself. Nothing whatsoever to do with an injury to either starting goalie and neither guy was a #3.


And no, do some reading on the Francouz injury. He was hurt the entire playoffs, came into camp with a nagging injury and tried to play through it until he couldn't anymore. Joe Sakic said exactly this less then a week ago.

 

[Bounces R Way]

Think he's more of a good name than a good player these days but would definitely be a upgrade defensively on Cole, Graves, or Zadorov.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Every contender should be interested in Hammer, the part that got me was SJ interested in Kuemper, the Sharks sold the farm for Karlsson and it failed MISERABLY they they need to restock the prospect pool, not sell whatever future they have left.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

Sakic said he was looking to add around the edges (as opposed to last off-season's roster overhaul), and this is a move that would make sense.

The Avs PK was a respectable in the regular season (81.4%, 13th in the NHL), but was an abysmal 75% in the post-season (36/48).

Some of that was goaltending, but Colorado's defense struggled incredibly to clear the puck on the PK.

9 of the 12 post season PP goals against came after EJ, Calvert and Grubauer got injured. Before that, we were 24/27 (88.89%). Losing three of our best PKers would still have an impact, but some PK depth might help mitigate how badly it impacts the team when EJ inevitably gets hurt.

 

[Gurglesons]

I dont even know why I responded to you in the first place, it is so obvious here and in all of your posts that you dont really have a clue what you are talking about.


Binnington most certainly was not the #3. He flat out stole the #1 job from Allen and was the starter from January onward. Not even close to a #3 goalie.

Darling was not the #3 Goalie. He was the back up who played all of 4 games because Crawford couldn't make a save at the beginning and he stole the job from Corey until Darling played like crap himself. Nothing whatsoever to do with an injury to either starting goalie and neither guy was a #3.


And no, do some reading on the Francouz injury. He was hurt the entire playoffs, came into camp with a nagging injury and tried to play through it until he couldn't anymore. Joe Sakic said exactly this less then a week ago.

Most players are injured in the playoffs. Binnington was the third string goalie that stole the # 1 job and won the cup. Raanta was the # 2 goalie in CHI to start the season and was replaced by Darling.

Once again, championship squads have the depth to allow for these types of injuries. Francouz was good enough to play. Him sucking while being injured doesn't change the fact other goaltenders have played through injuries (including Khudobin right now).

Do you honestly think the Avs had a championship caliber roster this year? If so, are you comfortable simply upgrading Cole or Graves for Byram and rolling the dice next year with the same group minus Zadarov and Nieto?

I don't see what is so shocking that I'm saying? Sakic saw what injuries did to his squad and wants to make sure it doesn't happen again.

 

[shadow1]

9 of the 12 post season PP goals against came after EJ, Calvert and Grubauer got injured. Before that, we were 24/27 (88.89%). Losing three of our best PKers would still have an impact, but some PK depth might help mitigate how badly it impacts the team when EJ inevitably gets hurt.

No doubt, but like you mentioned, EJ will inevitably get hurt (again).

(And Calvert for that matter).

 

[_Del_]

Jost for Hjarmalson?

I think he gets a second and a third. Jost and a pick (fight about where you value Jost) probably interests Arizona.

 

[Avs44]

Do you honestly think the Avs had a championship caliber roster this year? If so, are you comfortable simply upgrading Cole or Graves for Byram and rolling the dice next year with the same group minus Zadarov and Nieto?

I don't see what is so shocking that I'm saying? Sakic saw what injuries did to his squad and wants to make sure it doesn't happen again.

To be clear, yes, I think the Avs could have comfortably been in the finals right now with some better injury luck...or even just a tiny bit more fortune in general. That's not exactly a radical statement...they went to game 7 OT against the Stars. Literally a bounce away from the conference final. I'm of the view there are a group of 5-6 teams every single year who could all plausibly win the cup if fortune simply goes their way (their opponents being more injured than them; literally just a player getting hot at the right time; etc.), and I did and do count the Avs amongst those teams at this point.

That doesn't mean, of course, they shouldn't be trying to make upgrades. I pretty strongly think they need an upgrade on D to oversee the next 1-2 year transition to Byram (since it's clear EJ unfortunately won't hold up to be that guy), as well as a quality #3 centre.

 

[Gurglesons]

To be clear, yes, I think the Avs could have comfortably been in the finals right now with some better injury luck...or even just a tiny bit more fortune in general. That's not exactly a radical statement...they went to game 7 OT against the Stars. Literally a bounce away from the conference final. I'm of the view there are a group of 5-6 teams every single year who could all plausibly win the cup if fortune simply goes their way (their opponents being more injured than them; literally just a player getting hot at the right time; etc.), and I did and do count the Avs amongst those teams at this point.

That doesn't mean, of course, they shouldn't be trying to make upgrades. I pretty strongly think they need an upgrade on D to oversee the next 1-2 year transition to Byram (since it's clear EJ unfortunately won't hold up to be that guy), as well as a quality #3 centre.

Senators were a bounce a way from a Stanley Cup Final appearance as well, then added Duchene to nearly an identical roster.

Fortunes go the right way when you insulate your roster. Sakic didn't at the deadline and paid dearly for it. The D and goaltending got significantly exposed. Forward depth held up, but the real question is are they going to invest in Burky. Scary player to drop some major coin on, especially with Landy and Makar coming up.

 

[AZviaNJ]

I’d be all over that. Throw in Cole too so we drop that washed up dud.

Kuemper would get that return on his own, Hammer can get a 2nd rounder on his own & Coyotes have more pressing needs than goaltending, even if (when) they move Kuemper.

Now if Zadorov is part of the package, AZ should be interested.

 

[Avs44]

Senators were a bounce a way from a Stanley Cup Final appearance as well, then added Duchene to nearly an identical roster.

Fortunes go the right way when you insulate your roster. Sakic didn't at the deadline and paid dearly for it. The D and goaltending got significantly exposed. Forward depth held up, but the real question is are they going to invest in Burky. Scary player to drop some major coin on, especially with Landy and Makar coming up.

The Avs are not the Senators, nor are they owned by Eugene Melnyk. If that's the comparable you want to use then this is pointless.

The goaltending issues have been already addressed to you. Sakic could have maybe done better getting a #3 goaltender, but there's also not a hell of a lot you can do when your #1 gets injured and your #2 starts the playoffs with an injury, gets further injured, and you have to turn to your #3. Defense, yeah, Sakic should have added a #4 sort of guy around the deadline.

As for Burakovsky, his post-season performance made him an obvious re-sign, no matter how it turns out in the end.

 

[Gurglesons]

The Avs are not the Senators, nor are they owned by Eugene Melnyk. If that's the comparable you want to use then this is pointless.

The goaltending issues have been already addressed to you. Sakic could have maybe done better getting a #3 goaltender, but there's also not a hell of a lot you can do when your #1 gets injured and your #2 starts the playoffs with an injury, gets further injured, and you have to turn to your #3. Defense, yeah, Sakic should have added a #4 sort of guy around the deadline.

As for Burakovsky, his post-season performance made him an obvious re-sign, no matter how it turns out in the end.

Grub was hurt all year. Big balls GMs win the cup. Avs pay a couple picks for Lehner where are they now?