GDT: Avalanche @ Senators 03/16/23 5:00PM Mountain Time (Emergency GDT)

[The Shermanator]

New avatar for our overlord Mojo JoJo.

 

[niwotsblessing]

Yeah, the Nichushkin - Compher - Malgin line got crushed last night. The Avs just have to make do I guess because neither Lehkonen nor Landeskog are coming back soon and that's the best they've got.

The 4th line actually had some pretty decent shifts in the offensive zone. Problem is they were on the ice for two goals against, and that cannot happen. You cannot be that much of a liability on ice in your ~5 minutes of ice time to concede two goals.

One of the goals the 4th line gave up was when Sammy G pinched up the boards and the Sens got a clean break out. That one was on the D, not the 4th line.

 

[Polite HKYDiscussion]

One of the goals the 4th line gave up was when Sammy G pinched up the boards and the Sens got a clean break out. That one was on the D, not the 4th line.

I don’t remember how that play shook out, but I clearly remember the announcer saying “Girard didn’t get any support from Newhook” .

 

[Pokecheque]

One of the goals the 4th line gave up was when Sammy G pinched up the boards and the Sens got a clean break out. That one was on the D, not the 4th line.

Not quite that cut-and-dried. Sammy and the other Avs D play aggressively because they usually have the puck support behind him. And he DID have that puck support in Newhook, but then Newhook doesn't take a look around at all, puck-watches and slowly backs up, not realizing there's not one but TWO players behind him. To make things worse, Bo doesn't see the guy streaking up the middle until it's way too late and has to scramble on the ensuing 2-on-1, he hugs the boards for way too long and instead should've been trying to secure the middle while Newhook tried his best to catch up with the guy on the left half-wall.

So, yeah, it was partially on the D but it was still very much on that 4th line (Nieto and Galchenyuk were kinda caught in limbo as well, at least one of them should've been backchecking hard once the Sens started pushing their way up the ice). If you're gonna play center in Bednar's system you have to have a modicum of awareness of what's going on around you in the neutral zone. Newhook went full tunnel vision right there and it cost them.

Sammy had some not-great moments in this game and last but I'm not holding that one against him.

 

[dahrougem2]

That goal is on Newhook. You're a damn centre, have some awareness out there let alone being the support forward.

 

[niwotsblessing]

Sammy G was on the wrong side of the ice, pinching up the boards, and too damn small to make the play. And sometimes players from the other team will jump on a turnover and cut loose up the ice, center coverage or not, the Avs do that all the time.

 

[Pokecheque]

Sammy G was on the wrong side of the ice, pinching up the boards, and too damn small to make the play. And sometimes players from the other team will jump on a turnover and cut loose up the ice, center coverage or not, the Avs do that all the time.

He successfully makes that play all the time. As do Byram, Toews, and Makar, all of whom are not exactly behemoths themselves. Size has nothing to do with it. He took a chance and the Sens player had too much momentum by that time and the puck just didn't bounce Sammy's way. We can argue that discretion may have been the wiser play there, but that still doesn't become a goal if Newhook and Bo are doing their jobs.

 

[dahrougem2]

He successfully makes that play all the time. As do Byram, Toews, and Makar, all of whom are not exactly behemoths themselves. Size has nothing to do with it. He took a chance and the Sens player had too much momentum by that time and the puck just didn't bounce Sammy's way. We can argue that discretion may have been the wiser play there, but that still doesn't become a goal if Newhook and Bo are doing their jobs.

And we know the Avs do not coach discretion from their defensemen.

 

[Pokecheque]

Also, are we sure Sammy was on the wrong side of the ice? In previous seasons he usually plays the right side when there's a pairing of two lefties, though Bednar appears to have Bo on the right side a lot this year, so I'm not sure.

And we know the Avs do not coach discretion from their defensemen.

Nope, definitely not.

 

[cinchronicity]

One of the goals the 4th line gave up was when Sammy G pinched up the boards and the Sens got a clean break out. That one was on the D, not the 4th line.

This issue costs the Avs a goal in virtually every game. Sometimes, as many as 3 goals. Bednar's 'system' leave virtually zero room for error. If every player is not in a precise spot or mode, the goalies face an odd man situation. I can't think of the last game where I wasn't screaming at the TV about Toews / EJ / Manson being near the offensive net with nobody covering. SO I think we all just have to accept the high risk / high reward nature of the system.

To his credit, I think Mac is having his best season ever in terms of backchecking and driving Bednar's system. But Erod is not terrific defensively, which now opens the 1st line to occasional disaster. Chuck on the 4th line was not really helping LBN and Hook. This, more than anything else is what makes the return of Landy valuable. Everyone takes a step down to the lines where their play meets demands.

 

[Gumballhead]

Still not a fan of the trade, but he has played better the past 3 games or so. Hopefully the line of Cogs-Eller-LOC continues to gain chemistry.

He’s definitely a notch or two above Helm. If we get Helm back for playoffs, I love our grindy guys.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

I think the Eller trade would have been fine, if it wasn't the only deal we made.


Eller as the 4C? With JTC as the 3C? Fantastic Center depth.


Eller as the 3C, with JT2C? Nope, that ain't it. If they had grabbed Hayes and Eller at the deadline for example, I think we probably win the cup again tbh.

 

[LOFIN]

I think the Eller trade would have been fine, if it wasn't the only deal we made.


Eller as the 4C? With JTC as the 3C? Fantastic Center depth.


Eller as the 3C, with JT2C? Nope, that ain't it. If they had grabbed Hayes and Eller at the deadline for example, I think we probably win the cup again tbh.

I still think we can win the cup with this roster, provided everyone is healthy. On the other hand, if Landeskog is still out, I don't know if there was a trade to be made that would enable us to win without him. At least not any easier than with him.

 

[Ceremony]

I have two observations:

The Senators are truly a team in their captain's image.

JoJo is absolutely remarkable. When Kuemper was set and pucks went through him you wondered how someone that size could still have holes. When the pucks go through JoJo it's like he disintegrates and doesn't look like a goalie anymore. I don't get it.

 

[The Kingslayer]

The guy is a career AHLer and probably shouldn't be playing in an NHL game. He did however make a couple very nice saves to secure the win. I think he deserves just a little bit of credit for coming up big when the Avs needed him to.

Instead of looking for the fault in his big saves I think it's probably OK to give the guy some credit.

Two ways of looking at the same situation. Glass half full or half empty. You can look at it however you'd like, I prefer to see something positive out of it.

Did I not give him credit? I said it was a great save several times in fact.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

I still think we can win the cup with this roster, provided everyone is healthy. On the other hand, if Landeskog is still out, I don't know if there was a trade to be made that would enable us to win without him. At least not any easier than with him.

There's no chance we win the cup with JTC, Eller, Helm as our 2-4 Centers.

Absolutely no chance. Let's not kid ourselves

 

[LOFIN]

There's no chance we win the cup with JTC, Eller, Helm as our 2-4 Centers.

Absolutely no chance. Let's not kid ourselves

Sure

 

[Raucherhusten]

There's no chance we win the cup with JTC, Eller, Helm as our 2-4 Centers.

Absolutely no chance. Let's not kid ourselves

We are without a 2C since the beginning of the season, and without this stupid injury bug, we would still rule the West.

So yes, there is a chance. Not a HUGE one, but a decent one for sure.

 

[LOFIN]

We are without a 2C since the beginning of the season, and without this stupid injury bug, we would still rule the West.

So yes, there is a chance. Not a HUGE one, but a decent one for sure.

Call me a heretic, but centers are overrated. And every team has its shortcomings.

We have the #1 D-corps in the league (maybe some people can argue Boston or Carolina, but I still prefer ours). We have multiple stud puck moving D-men. That's where our strength comes from. We also have pretty damn good top-6 wingers. You look at the Leafs or Oilers for an example. Great center depth. With wingers and D, not so much (although Leafs are head and shoulders above Oilers there).

Still not happy we didn't do anything to our #2C spot at the deadline, but it's not all doom and gloom for me. Health is the issue. If we aren't getting Landy back, I don't think we can defend the cup. But if he does, I do like our chances. At least coming out of the West.

 

[hoserthehorrible]

Did I not give him credit? I said it was a great save several times in fact.

"He sucks, he sucks, he sucks, little bit of credit for not sucking, he sucks, he sucks, he sucks" probably does technically qualify for giving him credit in a fairly negative way I suppose.

 

[AllAboutAvs]

We are without a 2C since the beginning of the season, and without this stupid injury bug, we would still rule the West.

So yes, there is a chance. Not a HUGE one, but a decent one for sure.

Why are you arguing? You have already been told there is "absolutely no chance" for the Avs to win the SC.

 

[The Mars Volchenkov]

Sammy G was on the wrong side of the ice, pinching up the boards, and too damn small to make the play. And sometimes players from the other team will jump on a turnover and cut loose up the ice, center coverage or not, the Avs do that all the time.

Sam was not on the wrong side of the ice. Byram was already back, and Newhook was there. I don’t see what Girard did wrong. Heck, at the time of his “pinch”, all 5 Sens were still in the d-zone. The guy who scores the goal is at the face-off dot.

 

[nammerus]

Call me a heretic, but centers are overrated. And every team has its shortcomings.

We have the #1 D-corps in the league (maybe some people can argue Boston or Carolina, but I still prefer ours). We have multiple stud puck moving D-men. That's where our strength comes from. We also have pretty damn good top-6 wingers. You look at the Leafs or Oilers for an example. Great center depth. With wingers and D, not so much (although Leafs are head and shoulders above Oilers there).

Still not happy we didn't do anything to our #2C spot at the deadline, but it's not all doom and gloom for me. Health is the issue. If we aren't getting Landy back, I don't think we can defend the cup. But if he does, I do like our chances. At least coming out of the West.

Considering it would likely be the worst group of centres to win the cup in the last 30-40 years (outside of maybe the juggernaut Hawks teams), it’s really not that crazy a statement. The only thing crazier is calling the centre position overrated.

 

[LOFIN]

Considering it would likely be the worst group of centres to win the cup in the last 30-40 years (outside of maybe the juggernaut Hawks teams), it’s really not that crazy a statement. The only thing crazier is calling the centre position overrated.

Kuemper was the worst goalie to win in like 30 years. So yeah, crazy things happen.

To me, positioning in hockey is a dying concept anyways. Makar is basically the 4th forward at times.

Tell me, what does the center do that separates him from the wingers?

 

[nammerus]

Kuemper was the worst goalie to win in like 30 years. So yeah, crazy things happen.

To me, positioning in hockey is a dying concept anyways. Makar is basically the 4th forward at times.

Tell me, what does the center do that separates him from the wingers?

You can win with mediocre/shit goaltending. Plenty of teams have done that. You can’t win with mediocre/shit Center depth.

Are you asking if a Center has different responsibilities and impact on the game vs a winger? Is that a serious question?